2020 Presidential Election: let the jockeying commence

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4th_floor said:
I wouldn't support a judge throwing out legal votes anywhere. And I don't expect anything to change in the outcome of the election. However, removing election observers from the counting rooms and continuing the count, as was done in Michigan, Pennsylvania and Georgia is unacceptable and should not be tolerated. People who participated in this should be prosecuted and imprisoned. They should be banned from any future government job or office.
Also, the "fixing" of invalid ballots should not be allowed. I think it would be just for all of these votes to be thrown out.
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The election workers are bipartisan, at least in Oklahoma. My mom was an election board manager for years. They always had to have a worker from each party present at all things - voting, counting, provisional ballot counting, re-counts, etc. She switched parties one election day when someone got sick and they didn't have any Republicans to spare so the lady could go home.

If fixing is seeing that blue ink was used when black ink was required then that should be allowed. That's the common error in Oklahoma. The school of thought is to never re-count the whole data set. Just re-count the absentees. That's where over voting and wrong pen issues can gain/lose votes. They can sometimes see the error when they run it through the machine but they can't fix it unless it's a recount - wrong ink, someone marked both but circled the one they wanted...
 
Joe Fan said:
The down ballot
Reps picked up seats in California (first cycle since 1998)
Dems gained zero seats in Texas​
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Results from some towns in Orange County, Calif
Westminster, CA (49% Asian) there was a 23 point swing to Trump.
Garden Grove (40% Asian) there was a 21 point swing to Trump.
Santa Ana (77% Hispanic) there was a 13 point swing to Trump.
Stanton (49% Hispanic) had a 18 point swing to Trump​
 
Republicans are particularly skeptical of the results in PA, WI, and MI. But even in TX and FL, Dems trust the results more than Republicans

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Bubba sounds like they do it right in Ok and that some issues being raised directly conflict with the policies you state are being enforced there. Specifically the monitoring by both parties.
 
Joe Fan said:
Trust in the electoral process among Republicans has cratered from 68% before the election to 34% now.
7 in 10 GOP voters say the 2020 election was not free and fair.

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Tracking Voter Trust in the American Electoral System
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Is this a surprise to anyone? Trump was screaming fraud before the election, urged his supporters to commit fraud (vote twice in NC), screamed fraud the morning after election then his campaign went in search of fraud. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
 
Joe Fan said:
Dems 2020 --
“Numerous sworn affidavits of fraud from on the record witnesses mean nothing.
Ignore them!"​
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Not worth looking into?
Just let it go?

Detroit Poll watcher: At 4:30 a.m. on Nov. 4 --

"tens of thousands of ballots" delivered from out-of-state
"Unlike the other ballots, these boxes were brought in from the rear of the room"
"I specifically noticed every ballot I observed was cast for Joe Biden"​


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From PA voting records: (third column is date of birth)
upload_2020-11-10_11-26-44.png


That was just a first snippet. Lots of people 120 years old in PA.
 
OUBubba said:
The election workers are bipartisan, at least in Oklahoma. My mom was an election board manager for years. They always had to have a worker from each party present at all things - voting, counting, provisional ballot counting, re-counts, etc. She switched parties one election day when someone got sick and they didn't have any Republicans to spare so the lady could go home.

If fixing is seeing that blue ink was used when black ink was required then that should be allowed. That's the common error in Oklahoma. The school of thought is to never re-count the whole data set. Just re-count the absentees. That's where over voting and wrong pen issues can gain/lose votes. They can sometimes see the error when they run it through the machine but they can't fix it unless it's a recount - wrong ink, someone marked both but circled the one they wanted...
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Did they remove poll watchers in gay redneck tigerhoma and resume counting? If not, there is no problem there - except for the obvious social problems. They did remove poll watchers in PA, MI, and GA and counted votes. This is the problem.

From the accounts I heard from MI, the ballots that were "fixed" were missing addresses and or signatures. So you basically have a poll worker "fixing" ballots to match registration. This was done in Houston at the drive through voting area and apparently will be prosecuted.
 
Seattle Husker said:
Is this a surprise to anyone? Trump was screaming fraud before the election, urged his supporters to commit fraud (vote twice in NC), screamed fraud the morning after election then his campaign went in search of fraud. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.
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He's been screaming fraud since August of 2016.
 
4th_floor said:
Did they remove poll watchers in gay redneck tigerhoma and resume counting? If not, there is no problem there - except for the obvious social problems. They did remove poll watchers in PA, MI, and GA and counted votes. This is the problem.

From the accounts I heard from MI, the ballots that were "fixed" were missing addresses and or signatures. So you basically have a poll worker "fixing" ballots to match registration. This was done in Houston at the drive through voting area and apparently will be prosecuted.
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My point is that there are differences between poll watchers of the campaign and general poll watchers that are already there. I think the Trump campaign had to say in court that they number was a number "other than zero" who were there in the room.
 
OUBubba said:
My point is that there are differences between poll watchers of the campaign and general poll watchers that are already there. I think the Trump campaign had to say in court that they number was a number "other than zero" who were there in the room.
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That's the reality. In court, the Trump Campaign has admitted that their claims of "no poll watchers" wasn't accurate. In reality, the watchers were there yet the Trump Campaign simply wants greater access (e.g. 6ft vs. 10ft away). What the Trump Campaign is arguing in court is vastly different than their Press Conferences which is why Fox News cut way from Kayley M's PC yesterday. They cut away ~30 seconds in. There are some things that likely should and will be investigated. The grandiose claims that aren't even supported by those things is what makes it hard to give them credence. Talking about affidavits of fraud that have yet to be submitted to the Secretary's of State or AGs for investigation but are being shared openly with the media smacks of a greater desire to win a PR war than legal judgement.
 
Poll warchers are legally required to OBSERVE and LISTEN. If you are across the room or outside the room you can not fulfill your legal and sworn obligation.
If you are denied entrance you can not fulfill.
Neither can you if you are sent home and the counting continues
 
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Actually Husker Trump sued for lack of access
For instance Trump et al is sued Philadelphia county because Republican representatives were denied access to monitoring the counting.
Also sued in Michigan for same thing.

Lack of access comes in many forms
 
Horn6721 said:
Actually Husker that is not true at al
For instance Trump et al is sued Philadelphia county because Republican representatives were denied access to monitoring the counting.
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That "access to monitoring the counting" was NOT that the watchers weren't present but that they weren't close enough to see the count. That's not "denied entrance" or "sent home and the counting continues". The remedy in that case from my understanding is that the judge stated they should be allowed within 6ft, not the 10ft-15ft. I think the PA Supreme Court may have overruled that order.

My point is that the fanciful claims that there aren't poll watchers is not true. It never has been based on the court filings and responses. The legal debate centers on the amount of access (read: distance) during this pandemic.
 
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