What's Trump got against US Mail and Social Security

[PecosBill]

It's not correct to say the USPS has been self sufficient since 1970s. They have been bailed out several times since the 1970s, the last time was 2012. They lose money every year. Every. Year. They were more than $70 Billion in debt at the beginning of the year and received a $10 billion "loan" as part of the CARES act. But it will never be paid back. How do you pay off a loan when you lose $10 billion or more EVERY YEAR?

Most private companies long ago abandoned generous pensions because they are not affordable. The government, including the USPS, continues to offer pensions because they know the taxpayers and the Fed will continue to fund them. If the USPS wants to be independent, they will convert retirements to a 401K plan with profit sharing. Maybe then, they can start turning a profit.

Are you saying that the USPS uses Fed money to fund the 5 year pension prepay requirement required by the last reform?

 

[PecosBill]

It's not correct to say the USPS has been self sufficient since 1970s. They have been bailed out several times since the 1970s, the last time was 2012. They lose money every year. Every. Year. They were more than $70 Billion in debt at the beginning of the year and received a $10 billion "loan" as part of the CARES act. But it will never be paid back. How do you pay off a loan when you lose $10 billion or more EVERY YEAR?

Most private companies long ago abandoned generous pensions because they are not affordable. The government, including the USPS, continues to offer pensions because they know the taxpayers and the Fed will continue to fund them. If the USPS wants to be independent, they will convert retirements to a 401K plan with profit sharing. Maybe then, they can start turning a profit.

Similiar to Fed, State and local Govt pensions and essential workers like Firemen, Police, EMT and the Military?

 

[PecosBill]

It's not correct to say the USPS has been self sufficient since 1970s. They have been bailed out several times since the 1970s, the last time was 2012. They lose money every year. Every. Year. They were more than $70 Billion in debt at the beginning of the year and received a $10 billion "loan" as part of the CARES act. But it will never be paid back. How do you pay off a loan when you lose $10 billion or more EVERY YEAR?

Most private companies long ago abandoned generous pensions because they are not affordable. The government, including the USPS, continues to offer pensions because they know the taxpayers and the Fed will continue to fund them. If the USPS wants to be independent, they will convert retirements to a 401K plan with profit sharing. Maybe then, they can start turning a profit.

What are the assets of the USPS or the balance sheet? Lots of building and land involved.

 

[4th_floor]

With no links provided as to the information source sit couls have been many reasons. The source link might provide an answer or we could provide our own supposition.

Essential services get loans all the time hence the term essential.

UPS and FedEx get loans based on their D&B and company performance. USPS gets loans they never intend to pay back and never will. You can't pay back loans when you lose money EVERY YEAR. See the difference?

 

[4th_floor]

Are you saying that the USPS uses Fed money to fund the 5 year pension prepay requirement required by the last reform?

Indirectly yes. When you lose money EVERY YEAR, Every Stinking Year, then you have no money. All USPS money is taxpayer money.

 

[4th_floor]

Similiar to Fed, State and local Govt pensions and essential workers like Firemen, Police, EMT and the Military?

But you said the USPS is independent. No they are not independent if they don't have to perform in order to survive.

 

[4th_floor]

What are the assets of the USPS or the balance sheet? Lots of building and land involved.

Who paid for all of those assets? What is the ROA for the USPS? Hint: it's a negative number because the USPS loses money EVERY YEAR.

 

[4th_floor]

Maybe reality is a little better than this.

 

[PecosBill]

Indirectly yes. When you lose money EVERY YEAR, Every Stinking Year, then you have no money. All USPS money is taxpayer money.

But you said the USPS is independent. No they are not independent if they don't have to perform in order to survive.

UPS and FedEx get loans based on their D&B and company performance. USPS gets loans they never intend to pay back and never will. You can't pay back loans when you lose money EVERY YEAR. See the difference?

Perhaps you are right 4th, USPS should ignore the Board of Gov that set the rates and act like a private company.
Forget the responsibility of going to every customer address to see if they have mail to pick up 6 days a week.
Forget the responsbility of providing a mandated service to all customer addresses in the US just drop the 30-40% that are too far out of the way to deserve service.
Forget the concept of flat rate service equal to all citizens and set up dynamic pricing where the price charged is based on what the market will bear and lack of competition.
Forget the subsidy of providing Gov mail service to the citizens and have the Govt pay market price to deliver all the Gov mandated information.
Sell off the assets, defund the pension, hire third party contractors for weekly service and then schedule the IPO.
Just keep the lucrative route and charge UPS and Fedex thru the nose for last mile service.
The only loser is the public.
Great concept!
Now lets talk about private law enforcement...

 

[PecosBill]

But you said the USPS is independent. No they are not independent if they don't have to perform in order to survive.

I keep looking to see where I said that USPS was independent.
If anything they are dependent on the politicians that set their operating requirements.
Can you help me with that?

 

[PecosBill]

Indirectly yes. When you lose money EVERY YEAR, Every Stinking Year, then you have no money. All USPS money is taxpayer money.

WASHINGTON - The U.S. Postal Service reported operating revenue of $71.1 billion for fiscal year 2019 (October 1, 2018 - September 30, 2019), an increase of $514 million compared to the prior year.Nov 14, 2019
WASHINGTON – The U.S. Postal Service reported total revenue of $17.8 billion for the second quarter of fiscal 2020 (January 1, 2020 - March 31, 2020), an increase of $348 million, compared to the same period last year

The economic slump impacted the mail also.

Since 2016 the USPS has lost $21B over the 4 fiscal years or an avg of $5B a year. Roughly 93% of operations is covered by revenue. 7% is the avg deficit

With the US Govt borrowing 68% of operating budget in deficit spending the US taxpayer may have bigger problems than USPS to worry about.

$T vs $B deficit will eventually cause a problem.

 

[4th_floor]

Perhaps you are right 4th, USPS should ignore the Board of Gov that set the rates and act like a private company.

Yes, charge market rates for delivering mail, like UPS and FedEx do and track the mail so you can measure how well you are doing. Maybe you can get successful delivery from 96% up to 99.9% which should be the minimum.

Forget the responsibility of going to every customer address to see if they have mail to pick up 6 days a week.

It's 5 days per week in most areas now. FedEx will come to my house on demand to pickup a letter. If the USPS can't they should go out of business.

Forget the responsbility of providing a mandated service to all customer addresses in the US just drop the 30-40% that are too far out of the way to deserve service.

Here, you have a point. I don't have a problem subsidizing delivery to these areas. But the USPS should have to compete with private companies to get the subsidy. BTW, when I lived in a rural area, UPS and FedEx did provide service. I had the inconvenience of going to the local truck stop to drop off and pick up. That didn't bother me since I was sure that my items were being delivered on time and with proof of receipt. Every time.

Forget the concept of flat rate service equal to all citizens and set up dynamic pricing where the price charged is based on what the market will bear and lack of competition. Forget the subsidy of providing Gov mail service to the citizens and have the Govt pay market price to deliver all the Gov mandated information. ell off the assets, defund the pension, hire third party contractors for weekly service and then schedule the IPO. Just keep the lucrative route and charge UPS and Fedex thru the nose for last mile service.

Yes, please. What you don't realize is that the subsidized cost of the USPS, with all of it's great inefficiencies, costs more than FedEx for delivery.

The only loser is the public.
Great concept!
Now lets talk about private law enforcement...

I think we can do better than the USPS. It will never happen because our representatives are cowardly and corrupt. So I will just continue to empty the pile of useless advertisements from my mailbox - why can't they lose those - and be a dissatisfied customer of the PO.

I have great respect for those in public law enforcement. Recent events show the need for improvement there also. I think privatization of some aspects of law enforcement - traffic policing for example - is worth discussion.

 

[4th_floor]

I keep looking to see where I said that USPS was independent.
If anything they are dependent on the politicians that set their operating requirements.
Can you help me with that?

My mistake - Hornhubby posted that USPS was "self-sufficient since the 1970s. My apologies.

 

[DrRad]

We are missing the main point here-we can discuss the merits of the Post Office ad nauseum, but the more serious issue is the timing. Why now? Basically, more voter suppression.

 

[4th_floor]

We are missing the main point here-we can discuss the merits of the Post Office ad nauseum, but the more serious issue is the timing. Why now? Basically, more voter suppression.

Voting in person for those able to do so has been done since the country was founded. Absentee voting is available for those with a legitimate excuse for not voting in person. To say that not fixing all of the problems with the postal service between now and election day - an impossibility even with good management - and allowing all to vote by mail this year is voter suppression is a lie. It is fraud suppression.

 

[DrRad]

Voting in person for those able to do so has been done since the country was founded. Absentee voting is available for those with a legitimate excuse for not voting in person. To say that not fixing all of the problems with the postal service between now and election day - an impossibility even with good management - and allowing all to vote by mail this year is voter suppression is a lie. It is fraud suppression.

It affects those states that vote entirely by mail and have done so sucessfully for year. Hindering (at this late date) those states that want to vote by mail is supression. I don't believe the word fraud was used.

 

[DrRad]

Note also that absentee ballots may also be affected.

 

[4th_floor]

Note also that absentee ballots may also be affected.

Noted.

 

[Horn2RunAgain]

Vote suppression is real and I don't like it. Why do you think Texans, expecially in urban, mostly Democratic counties have to take a day or half day of vacation when they go to the DMV to get a new driver's license?

I prefer that scenario to massive voter fraud. Mailing ballots is a horrible idea on many fronts.

I've walked up to the ballot box since 1976. Have seen sooo many vans with seniors pull up to voting places, so that's no excuse (elderly, disables). If someone is scared of the virus, it's on them. Sorry. If you catch it you have a 99.x% chance of surviving it. If you can go to Walmart to buy their junk, you can go vote

I'm FAR more concerned about voter fraud. For Dallas area folks that remember the group ACORN, that experience hasn't gone away. Neither has the dem party efforts to cheat with groups like ACORN

 

[Monahorns]

UPS and FedEx get loans based on their D&B and company performance. USPS gets loans they never intend to pay back and never will. You can't pay back loans when you lose money EVERY YEAR. See the difference?

4th. this is the government deceit. They take taxes to subsidize industries they like and then claim the cost is competitive with the market. It is, when you steal money and funnel money into a criminal I mean government enterprise. The biggest examples I can think of are municipal power and renewable energy, but the USPS is also good.

 

[Monahorns]

The best argument for USPS is that mail wouldn't go to remote rural areas without them. We all have to pay extra so BFE gets letters sent.

But now we know that is completely untrue because Amazon Prime. Private business will find a way to get the shipment to the person for the most reasonable cost.

That may mean that rural addresses have to pay more to get things shipped to them. So what? Their cost of living is typically way less. They pay super cheap $/sqft for a land and housing and utilities. That more than covers for having to pay extra to get fidget spinners shipped to them.

 

[WillUSAF]

Does it matter why the mail is undeliverable? The USPO charged someone to deliver a letter, bill, package or pipe bomb. They were unable to complete their side of the contract. Does FedEx or UPS have this problem? The answer is no, because there is no bailout for FedEx or UPS if they piss off their customers.

FedEx and UPS have came out and said that they could not deliver ballots, They do not have the capability like the USPS does.......And am I not mistaken that people still have the choice to vote in person?

UPS, FedEx shut down calls to handle mail-in ballots, warn of 'significant' problems: report

 

[WillUSAF]

trump absentee ballot in north carolina - Bing images

Ballots mailed to people in North Carolina.......hypocritic? I think so....

 

[Joe Fan]

The mailbox has become the 2020 election's Pepe the Frog

 

[Horn6721]

Idiots protested the Postmaster General's home IN PERSON to complain about having to vote in person
Any hater here see the irony?

 

[Joe Fan]

With no links provided as to the information source sit couls have been many reasons. The source link might provide an answer or we could provide our own supposition.
Essential services get loans all the time hence the term essential.

The postal service has the same problems as the schools - their unions have become giant, fat, lazy, corrupt bureaucracies that care more about their own revenues than they do the job at hand. With the Teachers Unions, its the kids that suffer. With the Postal Workers, its the delivery of mail.

 

[Joe Fan]

Idiots protested the Postmaster General's home IN PERSON to complain about having to vote in person
Any hater here see the irony?

It is funny-ironic
People are going to have to start fighting back and standing up to this ****. It's the only way.

 

[Joe Fan]

More irony

 

[4th_floor]

FedEx and UPS have came out and said that they could not deliver ballots, They do not have the capability like the USPS does.......And am I not mistaken that people still have the choice to vote in person?

UPS, FedEx shut down calls to handle mail-in ballots, warn of 'significant' problems: report

In an exclusive interview with Reuters, UPS and FedEx said they legally can't do the work and warned there would likely be "significant" delays.

State ballots must be postmarked to be considered valid and only the USPS has lawful postmarking status. Therefore UPS, FedEx and other private parties cannot technically be involved in shipping ballots," UPS told Reuters in a statement.

So it's not that the USPS has a capability that UPS/FedEx do not. It's a legal issue. The USPS problem is incompetence and government mismanagement. If we agree to this lunacy on a national basis, we may never know who is actually elected president.

 

[Joe Fan]

Idiots protested the Postmaster General's home IN PERSON to complain about having to vote in person
Any hater here see the irony?

It is funny-ironic
People are going to have to start fighting back and standing up to this ****. It's the only way.