What if it was not the Russians?
- Thread starter Horn6721
- Start date
Brad Austin
2,500+ Posts
As you are correctly pointing out, that's the entire key to the illegality.
Oppo research is standard practice. MSM knows this and is trying to fictitiously mold the narrative to fit within those boundaries.
But Steele (who met with Russian officials, submitted their info to the client, who then leaked it to the press) wasn't hired by Fusion GPS until after the DNC and HRC campaign took over the financing for the research. There was no Fusion-Russian collaboration until after HRC's campaign assumed financial control.
To prove the attempt to shield wrongdoing even further, DNC made 347 payments to Fusion GPS and HRC campaign made 45 payments.
Both classified these payments as legal consultation/expenses which is a violation of FEC rules concerning oppo research. The Campaign Legal Center has already filed a complaint with the FEC regarding that aspect. Only fines can come from that, but the telling part is they hid what those payments were really for.
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Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
OK, so Bob Bauer runs DC office of Perkins Coie (which was used as cutout by the DNC, Clinton to get Steele dossier about Trump written), Bauer was also White House Counsel for Barack Obama. Bauer was counsel to Obama’s presidential campaign. And Bauer was general counsel for the DNC, the DCCC and the DSCC, sometimes at the same time.
Bauer is the person who wrote a lot of the ethics complaints filed against Newt Gingrich when he was Speaker of the House.
Point being that Bauer is a seasoned professional: This firm was not picked in the GPSFusion/Steele matter at random.
Brad Austin
2,500+ Posts
IMHO, trying to sweep this under the rug is a slippery slope Dems don't wanna go down. If they skate from this, it gives Trump carte blanche in 2019 to employ similar tactics without consequence. Once you let the foreign source oppo research cat out of the bag, among other things, it's open season.
Best play they have is to offer up HRC and possibly even BO as a sacrifice if the Uranium informant's evidence comes back directly on him.
However, though I don't agree with nearly anything BO stands for, the guy is absurdly more intelligent and crafty than HRC. His much more than arms reach approach is impressive...Kevin Bacon game levels of distance.
The smart play here is to distance and rebrand as the NEW democratic party. Play dumb and act appalled. Both BO and HRC have exhausted POTUS eligibility in one way or another. None of BO's top dogs are in the Dem mix anymore.
The logical move would be to shed the dead weight, play dumb, and move forward professing a new vision in stark resistance to this absurd hidden behavior. Play the victim they're so good at playing.
But then again, Dems will lie and deny their way to the grave thankfully. The relics put them where they are today, and defending them will drag them down further. Proceed.
Best play they have is to offer up HRC and possibly even BO as a sacrifice if the Uranium informant's evidence comes back directly on him.
However, though I don't agree with nearly anything BO stands for, the guy is absurdly more intelligent and crafty than HRC. His much more than arms reach approach is impressive...Kevin Bacon game levels of distance.
The smart play here is to distance and rebrand as the NEW democratic party. Play dumb and act appalled. Both BO and HRC have exhausted POTUS eligibility in one way or another. None of BO's top dogs are in the Dem mix anymore.
The logical move would be to shed the dead weight, play dumb, and move forward professing a new vision in stark resistance to this absurd hidden behavior. Play the victim they're so good at playing.
But then again, Dems will lie and deny their way to the grave thankfully. The relics put them where they are today, and defending them will drag them down further. Proceed.
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Steele contacts high ranking officials in the Kremlin and their claims are compiled in the dossier and disseminated to the MSM to take down DT.
No presumptions or hypotheticals on this one, it's dead to rights collusion. Hell even the Lib MSM is admitting it now. Where's OUBubba these days?
Hell, Bubba thought the info in the dossier was real.
I know your kidding. That's funny right there.......cause ain't gonna happen.
Brad Austin
2,500+ Posts
Hillary maybe, but doubtful. BO, no chance. BO makes bigfoot look like an amateur at covering tracks.
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Mentioned the Federalist piece above. Here are her 10 points --
"The 10 Most Important Claims About The Steele Dossier On Russia"
There is a blurb with each one, at the link
1) Russian officials were sources of key claims in dossier
2) No, the Russian dossier was not initially funded by Republicans
3) The dossier is chock full of discredited information
4) The dossier was used as a basis for wiretaps on American citizens
5) The FBI also paid for the dossier
6) Dossier publisher Fusion GPS works with shady outfits
7) Fusion GPS’ ties to media are problematic
8) Jim Comey personally briefed Trump on the dossier, shortly before CNN reported it
9) Mueller investigation spurred by dossier and illegal leaks from intelligence operatives about Trump
10) The Steele dossier was a Clinton/DNC-funded operation supported by the FBI and influenced heavily by Russian operatives in the Kremlin
http://thefederalist.com/2017/10/25/top-10-things-to-know-about-dossier/?platform=hootsuite
"The 10 Most Important Claims About The Steele Dossier On Russia"
There is a blurb with each one, at the link
1) Russian officials were sources of key claims in dossier
2) No, the Russian dossier was not initially funded by Republicans
3) The dossier is chock full of discredited information
4) The dossier was used as a basis for wiretaps on American citizens
5) The FBI also paid for the dossier
6) Dossier publisher Fusion GPS works with shady outfits
7) Fusion GPS’ ties to media are problematic
8) Jim Comey personally briefed Trump on the dossier, shortly before CNN reported it
9) Mueller investigation spurred by dossier and illegal leaks from intelligence operatives about Trump
10) The Steele dossier was a Clinton/DNC-funded operation supported by the FBI and influenced heavily by Russian operatives in the Kremlin
http://thefederalist.com/2017/10/25/top-10-things-to-know-about-dossier/?platform=hootsuite
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Here is the blurb with #8 (link above) --
8) Jim Comey personally briefed Trump on the dossier, shortly before CNN reported it
As confirmed by the Washington Post, the Russia-Trump collusion narrative was a Clinton campaign political operation. The dossier itself was shopped around by Fusion GPS a year ago to The New York Times, the Washington Post, Yahoo News, The New Yorker, and CNN, according to lawyers for the ex-spy who worked on the dossier. The dossier was so unverifiable that the only reporter to bite was from Mother Jones.
What really got the ball rolling on last year’s Russia-Trump conspiracy theory, then, was not the dossier itself but the briefing of it by Obama intelligence chiefs to President-elect Trump in January. Former FBI head Jim Comey admitted under oath that former Director of National Intelligence James Clapper asked him to personally brief President Trump about this dossier. The fact of that meeting was quickly leaked to CNN.
Given the dossier’s many problems, was the entire purpose of the meeting to produce the leak that the meeting happened? No one was biting on the dossier and it needed legitimization by opponents of Trump. If the dossier was so shoddy that it was debunked in hours after BuzzFeed posted it in all its salacious glory, why brief the president and president-elect on it, much less leak it? What was the real purpose of that meeting, and that leak to CNN?
What really got the ball rolling on last year’s Russia-Trump conspiracy theory, then, was not the dossier itself but the briefing of it by Obama intelligence chiefs to President-elect Trump in January. Former FBI head Jim Comey admitted under oath that former Director of National Intelligence James Clapper asked him to personally brief President Trump about this dossier. The fact of that meeting was quickly leaked to CNN.
Given the dossier’s many problems, was the entire purpose of the meeting to produce the leak that the meeting happened? No one was biting on the dossier and it needed legitimization by opponents of Trump. If the dossier was so shoddy that it was debunked in hours after BuzzFeed posted it in all its salacious glory, why brief the president and president-elect on it, much less leak it? What was the real purpose of that meeting, and that leak to CNN?
Clean
5,000+ Posts
Senate Judiciary committee asking for special counsel to be appointed to look into Uranium One. Also House Intelligence and Oversight and Government Reform Committees looking into it.
This thing is bubbling up. Even the MSM has been compelled to give it a few seconds of coverage before returning to Trump bashing.
This thing is bubbling up. Even the MSM has been compelled to give it a few seconds of coverage before returning to Trump bashing.
This is going to be a huge deal. I checked CNN yesterday, and no mention of it. Then late yesterday, they blended in to "other" stories.Today buried down low with headline "Hillary Unaware of Dossier." Stories above it include Trump's quest to kill Obamacare hurts middle class.
CNN should be closed.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
This post seems to written from bizarro world. Only on r/the_donald are there "cultists" and conclusive evidence that "laws were broken with out a doubt".
The Uranium One deal should be investigated. If any of the 9 agencies heads (including HRC) are shown to have voted for the deal after accepted a bribe then they deserve prosecution.
On the Fusion dossier there is this per Richard Painter:
Of course, in all the mania to tie the DNC/HRC to funding the dossier what keeps getting glossed over is some mysterious Republican donor previously funded to the effort by Steele.
None of that precludes Mueller's investigation into Russia meddling or the potential of collusion between the Trump campaign and the Russians.
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
My guess on these people who are coming out now as undercover witnesses are doing this because they realize they have become targets. I have personally seen this happen. I even knew a guy (husband of a classmate) who went on 60 Minutes with a story about insurance fraud by law firms. He figured out he was a federal target, and he panicked. He told his story on TV, trying to position himself as a whistleblower. He laid out the details of their scheme and named names. But he was too late. He was convicted, their house was seized and so on. Many of the other people he named suffered similar consequences.
Back to this matter, I think this same thing is at least part of what we are seeing now with regard to Russian actions inside the US. It is evolving on a daily basis. Witnesses are coming forward and new details are emerging. I suspect some of this is people involved realizing they are about to get caught in this big net that is being thrown.
My guess is that Mueller is now looking hard at the Clintons and maybe some of the Obama people. I think Manafort gave Mueller the perfect cover for this. The media only saw Manafort's talking to Mueller as him spilling the dirt on Trump. But they overlooked the fact that Manafort was also employed by Fusion GPS and knew all the big money players involved in this entire situation.
We already know that the FBI was investigating Russia-Uranium activities at least back to 2009. I think Sessions and Christopher Wray are deeply involved in this now as well. You never hear anything from Wray do you? And Sessions has been quiet for some time. Wonder why? Nor are there any leaks. Maybe the Clinton server will come back into play?
I think there are going to be indictments in 2018. My guess is that these people who are now spilling details to the media might mess up the timeline and force them to move it forward. But we will see.
If this is true, then it will be a bigger scandal than Watergate.
Back to this matter, I think this same thing is at least part of what we are seeing now with regard to Russian actions inside the US. It is evolving on a daily basis. Witnesses are coming forward and new details are emerging. I suspect some of this is people involved realizing they are about to get caught in this big net that is being thrown.
My guess is that Mueller is now looking hard at the Clintons and maybe some of the Obama people. I think Manafort gave Mueller the perfect cover for this. The media only saw Manafort's talking to Mueller as him spilling the dirt on Trump. But they overlooked the fact that Manafort was also employed by Fusion GPS and knew all the big money players involved in this entire situation.
We already know that the FBI was investigating Russia-Uranium activities at least back to 2009. I think Sessions and Christopher Wray are deeply involved in this now as well. You never hear anything from Wray do you? And Sessions has been quiet for some time. Wonder why? Nor are there any leaks. Maybe the Clinton server will come back into play?
I think there are going to be indictments in 2018. My guess is that these people who are now spilling details to the media might mess up the timeline and force them to move it forward. But we will see.
If this is true, then it will be a bigger scandal than Watergate.
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Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
I saw the interview with the Clinton Campaign guy. The CNN girl fully expected him to confirm her preconceived narrative that Hills knew nothing of the 'dossier.' But he waffled. You could see the panic in the eyes of the CNN girl. It was an "oh shyte" moment. She asked again a slightly different way and the dude came forward with more "she probably was aware" but he didnt know how aware.
Yea right.
LOL
That was some great TV. They should re-air that about 3 million times.
-------------
edit - here is the quote
'[Clinton] may have known, but the degree of exactly what she knew is beyond my knowledge.'
- Ex-Clinton campaign spokesman Brian Fallon
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Dude is likely to die now in a small-aircraft crash or by suicide, if historical patterns hold.
And now it's disappeared from their site totally. It truly is the Clinton News Network.I saw the interview with the Clinton Campaign guy. The CNN girl fully expected him to confirm her preconceived narrative that Hills knew nothing of the 'dossier.' But he waffled. You could see the panic in the eyes of the CNN girl. It was an "oh shyte" moment. She asked again a slightly different way and the dude came forward with more "she probably was aware" but he didnt know how aware.
Yea right.
LOL
That was some great TV. They should re-air that about 3 million times.
-------------
edit - here is the quote
'[Clinton] may have known, but the degree of exactly what she knew is beyond my knowledge.'
- Ex-Clinton campaign spokesman Brian Fallon
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
I35
5,000+ Posts
I'm sure they "all" are just a coincidence. "All" as in "many." And "Many" as in a "football roster."
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Word is that Trump personally ordered DOJ to "lift the gag order" and let this person come forward
The undercover insider witness formally released
Musburger1
2,500+ Posts
Here’s one thing to take from this. Powerful corporations and oligarchs bribe corrupt governments and government officials. If bribery and the failure to punish government officials goes unpunished, the message gets out the US government is open for business in the same sense as third world places like Afghanistan, Mexico, and numerous African countries conduct business. In fact, it is probably already ramped up to that degree. Look at all the no bid, sweetheart deals and unaccounted for transactions that took place under both Bush and Obama.
I think most everyone agrees there has always been corruption in government. What people haven’t questioned is that the underlying institutions which provide checks and balances no longer work due to infiltration, corruption, etc. We’ve seen too big to fail banks bailed out and no charges filed, Fast and Furious came and went, billions of dollars disappeared in Iraq and Afghanistan, Clapper lies to Congress and kept his job, the DOJ chief meets with Clinton on the tarmac, and Hillary is willing to sell out the country for personal gain. How do we know the top officials in the Pentagon and the judges in the court system aren’t rotting as well?
With enough evidence coming out, there will be efforts to blame a scapegoat; but will justice be pursued and a real cleansing happen?
I think most everyone agrees there has always been corruption in government. What people haven’t questioned is that the underlying institutions which provide checks and balances no longer work due to infiltration, corruption, etc. We’ve seen too big to fail banks bailed out and no charges filed, Fast and Furious came and went, billions of dollars disappeared in Iraq and Afghanistan, Clapper lies to Congress and kept his job, the DOJ chief meets with Clinton on the tarmac, and Hillary is willing to sell out the country for personal gain. How do we know the top officials in the Pentagon and the judges in the court system aren’t rotting as well?
With enough evidence coming out, there will be efforts to blame a scapegoat; but will justice be pursued and a real cleansing happen?
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
I35
5,000+ Posts
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Want to see something funny? This passage is in the VERY SAME ARTICLE the Federalist cites to claim #2 is false.
Want to know what is spin? Ignoring those 3 paragraphs. Tisk tisk TheFederalist and anyone that posts it as "fact".
Want to know what is also spin? That the entirety of the dossier has been "debunked" (JoeFan and Brad Austin). Also from that same article:
So you've falsely claimed I've spun when in reality it's those trying to evangelize the story. Can I get an apology?
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Have Dems finally decided to cut Hillary adrift?
That its time (past time) to put some distance between themselves and she?
Dont scoff, angering the Clintons has historically come at a high price. The ultimate price for some.
Here are two signs that it might be happening anyway -
(1) [Please take the time to ensure you are sitting for this first one] CNN (of all people) is woke enough now to ask a question about Hillary/DNC funding of the "dossier" (wow!)
(2) An ex-Obama-ite agreed to go on CNN and take a question about it (wow2!)
That its time (past time) to put some distance between themselves and she?
Dont scoff, angering the Clintons has historically come at a high price. The ultimate price for some.
Here are two signs that it might be happening anyway -
(1) [Please take the time to ensure you are sitting for this first one] CNN (of all people) is woke enough now to ask a question about Hillary/DNC funding of the "dossier" (wow!)
(2) An ex-Obama-ite agreed to go on CNN and take a question about it (wow2!)
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