What if it was not the Russians?
- Thread starter Horn6721
- Start date
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
"........In his first public interview about the meeting, Akhmetshin said he accompanied Veselnitskaya to Trump Tower where they met an interpreter who participated in the meeting. He said he had learned about the meeting only that day when Veselnitskaya asked him to attend. He said he showed up in jeans and a T-shirt.
During the meeting, Akhmetshin said Veselnitskaya brought with her a plastic folder with printed-out documents that detailed what she believed was the flow of illicit funds to the Democratic National Committee. Veselnitskaya presented the contents of the documents to the Trump associates and suggested that making the information public could help the Trump campaign, he said.
“This could be a good issue to expose how the DNC is accepting bad money,” Akhmetshin recalled her saying.
Trump Jr. asked the attorney if she had all the evidence to back up her claims, including whether she could demonstrate the flow of the money. But Veselnitskaya said the Trump campaign would need to research it more. After that, Trump Jr. lost interest, according to Akhmetshin.
“They couldn’t wait for the meeting to end,” he said....."
During the meeting, Akhmetshin said Veselnitskaya brought with her a plastic folder with printed-out documents that detailed what she believed was the flow of illicit funds to the Democratic National Committee. Veselnitskaya presented the contents of the documents to the Trump associates and suggested that making the information public could help the Trump campaign, he said.
“This could be a good issue to expose how the DNC is accepting bad money,” Akhmetshin recalled her saying.
Trump Jr. asked the attorney if she had all the evidence to back up her claims, including whether she could demonstrate the flow of the money. But Veselnitskaya said the Trump campaign would need to research it more. After that, Trump Jr. lost interest, according to Akhmetshin.
“They couldn’t wait for the meeting to end,” he said....."
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
"Let's assume it's true because it's needed for our conspiracy theory to profligate."
Brad Austin
2,500+ Posts
The optics appear much worse now because people are viewing the meeting through the lens of today's hysteria over Russian meddling.
People seem to dismiss the timing of the meeting where he only agreed to hear about supposedly damaging proof of illegal acts committed by the opponent.
Back in June 2016, 13 months ago, there were no declared investigations or claims by gov officials being made about Russian interference in our election process.
Wiki didn't even publish the Podesta emails until October 2016...4 months later.
The initial contact didn't say the Russian contact was offering fabricated information to incriminate their opponent.
He said the source wanted to reveal real information. Or as the email said "...offered to provide the Trump campaign with some official documents and information that would incriminate Hillary and her dealings with Russia..."
There was no big bad meddling Russian wolf back in June 2016. The source requested to provide official documents showing illegal dealings with Russia by HRC.
No campaign member on either side would've turned down the offer to hear/see the evidence. Though campaign veterans would have handled it more discreetly or indirectly due to experience with the pitfalls of campaigns.
Don Jr. had no experience with opposition research concealment like a lifer such as Podesta. Ignorance is no excuse but the Russian threat wasn't what it is today.
But nonetheless such proposed official evidence provided by a yet-to-be accused foreign gov would've been explored by any campaign. And if ground-breaking in nature and vetting proved legit, it would've been leaked to the public.
It's the same 'bait and switch' charade the Dems and MSM pull constantly in their domestic collusion. Just like they did with Wiki, attack the source and disregard the factual content that's exposing Dem campaign collusion.
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Some of y'all seem to be in different stages.
It is a witch hunt and a funny one at that.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Still in stage one I see. I'm here to support you if you need it.
As soon as oppostion research somehow becomes "collusion" I'll let you know.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
It's fairly well established that receiving anything of value from a foreign government is against federal election campaign laws. It seems you've moved on to #4. That's progress, I guess.
From what government? No proof that she was representing a foreign government despite the clamoring from that one guy. Even if she had worked for a government in the past(no evidence of that either) that still doesn't prove she was this time. Sorry to break your heart, SH but you have nothing.
Musburger1
2,500+ Posts
Most probable scenario is this Russian lawyer was a paid informant working in conjunction with both the Clinton campaign and operatives in the DOJ (Lynch) and the FBI (Comey? McCabe?). This was a setup perpetrated by the same people calling for Trump's dismissal. It's so f'd up it sounds incredible.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Officer, I thought she was a prostitute when I picked her up but she ended up being a police officer thus I didn't actually solicit services from a prostitute. In turn, clearly no crime was committed. Is that the logic you're going with?
How 'bout I walked into the bank to rob it but it turns out there wasn't any money. I know it looks bad being that I had the stickup on but I walked away since the teller didn't have access to the money.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Most probable or is that simply the FSB sponsored response? I'm starting to think that the alt-right is being led by the FSB. You know...those alt-right patriots.
You're comparing apples to oranges because regardless of what you said earlier there is no evidence of anything being illegal. Besides, Hillary did worse than this with Ukraine. You didn't hear the conservatives whine about that like you libs are now. It was dirty pool but I don't think she broke the law there either.
Musburger1
2,500+ Posts
There's a hell of a lot more evidence Lynch was involved than the Russian government.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
You've literally hit 4 of the 5 excuses on that list. Kudos because that's quite the leaps of logic to do successfully, especially in the course of 3-4 posts. Take a lesson from Trump, stick to one excuse for branding purposes, hammer it home and never admit defeat even when the truth is staring you in the face. It's been effective for him.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Wait...the fact that Lynch allowed her into the country to defend a Russian oligarch in a case against the feds is "evidence Lynch was involved" with the Russian government? That cinches it...I believe the alt-right talking points are being drafted by the Russians. Mueller...paging Robert Mueller.
So in order to be correct I have to accept your account of things? Whatever, dude. No leaps of logic it's just your collusion theory has more holes in it than Swiss cheese.
Musburger1
2,500+ Posts
These people (The Clinton mafia) don't do things on a whim. They carefully plan their moves and their covers well in advance. Lynch isn't normally the person responsible for approving visas. She was selected to do this.
If she had won, they would be whining about it. You may not have dumb asses calling for a war over it like Paul Begala is, but they would be complaining about it.
Brad Austin
2,500+ Posts
No doubt about it. Both sides will always complain about stuff like this.
Only difference is when Dems actually commit these offenses, their unified MSM army shields it and the whole Dem gang in Congress tells Reps to pound sand.
No member of the HRC cabinet, DOJ, or her intel heads would've resigned or recused themselves from WH investigations no matter how deep conflicts of interest got.
It's the age old weakness of Rep leaders. I say weakness, not because the harsh tactics they fail to use are right, but it's the dirty nature of the battle they won't wise up to.
Dems are scandalous as hell and when controversy arrives, they'll lie to the death, and tell Reps to go f themselves in lockstep.
Reps act like b*tches when the shoe is on the other foot, even when accused of fabrications and false claims of illegality.
They often divide alliances, some act high and mighty with condemnation of their own, and they try to appease by offering resignations and recusals.
Great idea, feed the unquenchable, blood thirsty sharks. Surely they'll just go away and won't swarm the docks with even more ferocity.
The day Reps wake up to the fact they're in a dirty war and the enemy has no morals or limits, will be the day they actually start to get things done.
DT seems to be learning the Dem's tactics and to brush off the bs accusations without apologies. Wish his fake friends in Congress would join the battle or step aside.
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I35
5,000+ Posts
No doubt about it. Both sides will always complain about stuff like this.
Only difference is when Dems actually commit these offenses, their unified MSM army shields it and the whole Dem gang in Congress tell Reps to pound sand.
No member of the HRC cabinet, DOJ, or her intel heads would've recused themselves from WH investigations no matter how deep conflicts of interest got.
It's the age old weakness of Rep leaders. I say weakness, not because the harsh tactics they fail to use are right, but it's the dirty nature of the battle they won't wise up to.
Dems are scandalous as hell and when controversy arrives, they'll lie to the death, and tell Reps to go f themselves in lockstep.
Reps act like b*tches when the shoe is on the other foot, even when accused of fabrications and false claims of illegality.
They often divide alliances, some act high and mighty with condemnation of their own, and they try to appease by offering resignations and recusals.
Great idea, feed the unquenchable, blood thirsty sharks. Surely they'll just go away and won't swarm the docks with even more ferocity.
The day Reps wake up to the fact they're in a dirty war and the enemy has no morals or limits, will be the day they actually start to get things done.
DT seems to be learning the Dem's tactics and to brush off the bs accusations without apologies. Wish his fake friends in Congress would join the battle or step aside.
Brad speaks the truth. I get so frustrated that the Republicans won't stand up to that corrupt party. It's like if we play nice then maybe they will too. Well the Rep have played nice forever with the Dems and are still getting bullied, but not only the other party but by the MSM as well. DT stands up to the media and they are having a melt down over it. They are not use to getting punched back. I am proud of our party for having the civility that is lacking from the other one. But I still think you can stand up to the bullies and be firm, but be civil at the same time.
This whole situation has been a farce, and is now becoming boring. A quick summary:
The Russians hack Podesta's emails using the hi-tech method of entering "password" for Podesta's password.
The Russians release private emails that show the DNC and Hillary conspired against Bernie to elect Hillary.
The Russians release emails showing collusion between numerous members of the MSM and the DNC. Those emails show that some of the MSM actually provided, in advance, upcoming Presidential debate questions. The emails also verify what most already knew, which is that the MSM takes its marching orders from the DNC when it comes to writing partisan "news" articles. This embarrasses the MSM, but they have no shame and continue their ruse as legitimate news organizations. In fact, they redouble their efforts to smear Trump.
To assist Trump in winning the election because Trump has said negative things about NATO, which the Russians want to destroy, the Russians contact members of Trump's campaign, and either give them information (what information was given remains a mystery since nothing has been offered by anyone, and the emails were already released by WikiLeaks), or act as if they have information that will help Trump defeat Hillary.
The only two illegal acts that have been verifiably committed are by the Russians (hacking), and leaking by Comey (release of classified government information to his buddy in New York).
Big deal.
The Russians hack Podesta's emails using the hi-tech method of entering "password" for Podesta's password.
The Russians release private emails that show the DNC and Hillary conspired against Bernie to elect Hillary.
The Russians release emails showing collusion between numerous members of the MSM and the DNC. Those emails show that some of the MSM actually provided, in advance, upcoming Presidential debate questions. The emails also verify what most already knew, which is that the MSM takes its marching orders from the DNC when it comes to writing partisan "news" articles. This embarrasses the MSM, but they have no shame and continue their ruse as legitimate news organizations. In fact, they redouble their efforts to smear Trump.
To assist Trump in winning the election because Trump has said negative things about NATO, which the Russians want to destroy, the Russians contact members of Trump's campaign, and either give them information (what information was given remains a mystery since nothing has been offered by anyone, and the emails were already released by WikiLeaks), or act as if they have information that will help Trump defeat Hillary.
The only two illegal acts that have been verifiably committed are by the Russians (hacking), and leaking by Comey (release of classified government information to his buddy in New York).
Big deal.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Too many "alternative facts" to address. Podesta's password was not "password" and Comey didn't leak confidential information. That bookends a post that is rife with misinformation. We don't know whether Donald Jr. committed a crime or not by welcoming information from Russia. At this point, Trump Jr. is in the lead in the proven "untruthful" camp thus not really sure anything from him can be believed.
What's true in the post?
1. The Russians hacked Podesta and the DNC.
2. The email showed that the DNC conspired with the HRC camp to strategize against Bernie.
3. There was communication between MSM the DNC including requests for comments on some articles that were to be published.
4. The Russians did want Trump to win.
Hee hee! "Some communication" between the DNC and the MSM. That's rich. You better go back and read those emails.
You forgot to comment on the Presidential debate situation, and on the MSM's ongoing, daily litany of B.S. about Trump. Keep in mind the fact that Comey, Clapper, and everyone on any intelligence committee has already stated that there was no "collusion", whatever "collusion" may mean from a criminal standpoint regarding Trump's campaign.
You are basing your arguments against Trump on reports from, as you admit, a biased and dishonest MSM. Compared with the MSM, Trump Jr. is not only not in the lead, he's not even in the race.
Since when is "welcoming information" about your opponent a crime?
It's a good thing that the MSM got exposed as partisan hacks. Now, even those that held onto a sliver of hope that the MSM maintained some integrity no longer have to be burdened by that thought. They, like everyone else, can view the MSM as clowns.
Oh how the election of Trump continues to burn liberals and the MSM to their very rotten core. They are going mad with hate and frustration. It is a sweet, sweet show to watch.
You forgot to comment on the Presidential debate situation, and on the MSM's ongoing, daily litany of B.S. about Trump. Keep in mind the fact that Comey, Clapper, and everyone on any intelligence committee has already stated that there was no "collusion", whatever "collusion" may mean from a criminal standpoint regarding Trump's campaign.
You are basing your arguments against Trump on reports from, as you admit, a biased and dishonest MSM. Compared with the MSM, Trump Jr. is not only not in the lead, he's not even in the race.
Since when is "welcoming information" about your opponent a crime?
It's a good thing that the MSM got exposed as partisan hacks. Now, even those that held onto a sliver of hope that the MSM maintained some integrity no longer have to be burdened by that thought. They, like everyone else, can view the MSM as clowns.
Oh how the election of Trump continues to burn liberals and the MSM to their very rotten core. They are going mad with hate and frustration. It is a sweet, sweet show to watch.
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Some hacked State Department emails have revealed Obama officials and lobbyists discussing Russian lawyer days before Trump Jr. meeting. Add in the presence of Rob Goldstone of GPS Fusion and it supports the idea that this was a smelly political scheme by the Obama people to ensnare the Trump people in something --
http://disobedientmedia.com/2017/07...mails-reveal-connection-to-donald-jr-meeting/
"Hacked emails first reported on by the media over the weekend appear to reveal that officials were discussing Russian lawyer Natalia Veselnitskaya just a few days before her June 9, 2016 meeting with Donald Trump Jr. to discuss what she claimed at the time was politically damaging information on Hillary Clinton. The cache of correspondence was allegedly taken from a State Department Russian Affairs intelligence official and has yet to be verified.
The email, filename 00002215.eml, was sent by Hermitage Capital Management Founder and Director William Browder to the State Department’s Russia Domestic Affairs Division Chief Robert Otto and House Committee on Foreign Affairs staffer Kyle Parker appearing to show the three sharing an image of Veselnitskaya’s house. ....
.... online observers have noted a number of details which they claim shows evidence that Donald Trump Jr. was baited into speaking with Veselnitskaya in order to give his father’s political opponents leverage. The Independent has highlighted Veselnitskaya and publicist Rob Goldstone’s ties to Fusion GPS, the lobbying firm responsible for the notorious dossier of wild and unproven allegations about President Trump which has also been involved with lobbying against the Magnitsky Act. Anatoli Samochornov, the translator who accompanied Ms. Veselnitskaya to the meeting is also a former employee of the FBI according to a press release from 2010. On July 12, 2017 The Hill reported that Veselnitskaya was allowed to enter the United States by the Department of Justice under “extraordinary circumstances” despite the fact that she did not possess a proper visa. Some have claimed that the emails sent to Donald Jr. were intentionally worded to create a basis for a FISA request to surveil and unmask the Trump team.
The revelation that additional federal organizations were engaged in converstions with lobbyist groups where Ms. Veselnitskaya was discussed ahead of her meeting with Donald Trump Jr. will no doubt add additional fuel to an already raging fire of controversy....."
The email, filename 00002215.eml, was sent by Hermitage Capital Management Founder and Director William Browder to the State Department’s Russia Domestic Affairs Division Chief Robert Otto and House Committee on Foreign Affairs staffer Kyle Parker appearing to show the three sharing an image of Veselnitskaya’s house. ....
.... online observers have noted a number of details which they claim shows evidence that Donald Trump Jr. was baited into speaking with Veselnitskaya in order to give his father’s political opponents leverage. The Independent has highlighted Veselnitskaya and publicist Rob Goldstone’s ties to Fusion GPS, the lobbying firm responsible for the notorious dossier of wild and unproven allegations about President Trump which has also been involved with lobbying against the Magnitsky Act. Anatoli Samochornov, the translator who accompanied Ms. Veselnitskaya to the meeting is also a former employee of the FBI according to a press release from 2010. On July 12, 2017 The Hill reported that Veselnitskaya was allowed to enter the United States by the Department of Justice under “extraordinary circumstances” despite the fact that she did not possess a proper visa. Some have claimed that the emails sent to Donald Jr. were intentionally worded to create a basis for a FISA request to surveil and unmask the Trump team.
The revelation that additional federal organizations were engaged in converstions with lobbyist groups where Ms. Veselnitskaya was discussed ahead of her meeting with Donald Trump Jr. will no doubt add additional fuel to an already raging fire of controversy....."
http://disobedientmedia.com/2017/07...mails-reveal-connection-to-donald-jr-meeting/
I35
5,000+ Posts
It's really becoming comical. They just get that moment of announcing a bombshell story only for it to be nothing more than just.....well just FAKE NEWS.
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