Venezuelan Update (Florida Maquis)

The two issues you are conflating Mus are not logically linked. There are many examples of currency being managed better without access to foreign loans.
 
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Joe Fan said:
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That’s a simplistic distortion which serves as propaganda. Lots of causes may produce hunger. Drought, famine, war, blockade, recession/depression resulting in lack of money are reasons beyond the scope of government. For example, in the 30s and 40s the US produced plenty of food, but as income vanished with deflation, many people could no longer purchase food. Communism wasn’t the cause. Today, if there were a prolonged power failure, grocery stores would empty, transport systems would close down, and people would starve. Would you then say that the free market/capitalism causes starvation?
Communist Cuba has been under sanctions and embargo for years. While I wouldn’t wish to live there, people are generally self-sufficient and aren’t starving. If Cuba suffered a prolonged power outage they would be better off than we are because Americans are dependent on the system and not self-reliant. Our system allows for a higher standard of living but is also less resilient to interruption/failure.
 
Musburger1 said:
That’s a simplistic distortion which serves as propaganda. Lots of causes may produce hunger. Drought, famine, war, blockade, recession/depression resulting in lack of money are reasons beyond the scope of government. For example, in the 30s and 40s the US produced plenty of food, but as income vanished with deflation, many people could no longer purchase food. Communism wasn’t the cause. Today, if there were a prolonged power failure, grocery stores would empty, transport systems would close down, and people would starve. Would you then say that the free market/capitalism causes starvation?
Communist Cuba has been under sanctions and embargo for years. While I wouldn’t wish to live there, people are generally self-sufficient and aren’t starving. If Cuba suffered a prolonged power outage they would be better off than we are because Americans are dependent on the system and not self-reliant. Our system allows for a higher standard of living but is also less resilient to interruption/failure.
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All true, commie. When you are already dirt poor, you don't have much to lose.
 
Mus, in the 30s and 40s food disappeared from groceries in the US because of central planning of money supply and prices. Just like what is happening in Venezuela. Who could have guessed? What is the technical term for central planning again?
 
Monahorns said:
Mus, in the 30s and 40s food disappeared from groceries in the US because of central planning of money supply and prices. Just like what is happening in Venezuela. Who could have guessed? What is the technical term for central planning again?
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It’s a chicken or the egg scenario. Why did the government attempt price controls in the 30s?

What precipitated the crises? You had vast over leverage (just as today), huge swings in inequality, monopolistic characteristics at work, and then it all collapsed. Much the same exists today in addition to systemic corruption and a government essentially bankrupt.

Socialism, capitalism, and communism all have flaws. And that’s when the judicial system and political system are fully functioning as designed. Our judicial and political systems are mired in corruption. The media is now basically a propaganda tool of competing elitists. Like Rome, the survival of the system now relies on continual growth (in a world of finite resources) and relies on force - both military and financial - to keep the ball rolling. Our wars (Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Yemen, Syria), our alliance with dictators and brutal regimes ((Saudi Arabia, Israel, Colombia, Brazil) or justified with lies and propaganda (weapons of mass destruction, killing their own people, starving their own people, supporting terror, etc.).
 
The terrible forthcoming destruction of the « Caribbean Basin », by Thierry Meyssan
Below is an excerpt from the last third of the article. The entire piece is available at the above link.

Brazil
In May 2016, Henrique Meirelles, the Minister of Finance for the transitional government of Libano-Brazilian Michel Temer, nominated Israelo-Brazilian Ilan Goldfajn as director of the Central Bank. Mereilles had also presided the Committee for the preparation of the Olympic Games, calling on Tsahal to coordinate the Brazilian army and police, thus guaranteeing the security of the Games. Simultaneously controlling the Central Bank, the army and the police of Brazil, Israël had no difficulty in supporting the popular movement of dissatisfaction in the face of the incompetence of the Workers’ Party.

Believing - without any solid proof - that Presidente Dilma Rousseff had fudged the public accounts in the context of the Petrobras scandal, the parliamentarians impeached her in August 2016.

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Eduardo and Carlos, the sons of President Jair Bolsonaro.
During the Presidential election of 2018, candidate Jair Bolsonaro went to Israël to be baptised in the waters of the Jordan, and consequently obtained a massive percentage of the evangelical vote. He was elected with General Hamilton Mourão as his Vice-President. During the period of transition, Mourão declared that Brazil should prepare to send men to Venezuela as a « peace force » once President Maduro had been overthrown – comments which constitute a barely-disguised threat which President Bolsonaro attempted to downplay.

In an interview on 3 January 2019, on the TV channel SBT, President Bolsonaro spoke of negotiations with the Pentagon concerning the possibility of creating a US military base in Brazil. This declaration raised powerful opposition within the armed forces, for whom their country is capable of defending itself without assistance.

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Benjamin Netanyahu during the investiture of President Bolsonaro. Israël has taken position in Brazil.
During his investiture on 2 January 2019, the new President welcomed Israëli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. This was the first time that an Israëli personality of this importance had been to Brazil. On this occasion, President Bolsonaro announced the coming transfer of the Brazilian embassy from Tel-Aviv to Jerusalem.

US Secretary of State Mike Pompeo, who also went to the investiture, where he met Peruvian Minister for Foreign Affairs Néstor Popolizio, announced with President Bolsonaro his intention to fight with him against the « authoritarian régimes » of Venezuela and Cuba. Returning to the United States, he stopped over in Bogota to meet with Colombian President Iván Duque. The two men agreed to work for the diplomatic isolation of Venezuela. On 4 January 2019, the 14 States of the Lima Group (including Brazil, Colombia and Guyana) met to agree that Nicolas Maduro’s new mandate, which begins on 10 January, is « illegitimate » [8]. This communiqué has not been signed by Mexico. Apart from this, six of the member-States lodged a complaint with the International Criminal Tribunal against President Nicolas Maduro for crimes against humanity.

It is perfectly clear today that the process towards war is under way. Enormous forces are in play, and there is little that can be done to stop them now. It is in this context that Russia is studying the possibility of setting up a permanent aero-naval base in Venezuela. The island of La Orchila – where President Hugo Chávez was held prisoner during the coup d’etat of April 2002 – would enable the storing of strategic bombers. This would constitute a much greater threat to the United States than the Soviet missiles stationed in Cuba in 1962.

Thierry Meyssan
Translation
Pete Kimberley
 
Just read the other day that Chavez told everyone he was going to strengthen the Venezuelan currency, the bolivar. He did this by calling it the bolivar fuerte and chopping 3 zeroes off the end of the number value. Sounds really strong!

So strong that now Maduro has created the bolivar soberano to replace the bolivar fuerte. Bear in mind nothing has changed about the banking and monetary system. But this time Maduro will chop 5 zeroes of the number value! That is so strong. It's got to work this time.
 
Those of you who believe this is totally organic, believed the same thing about Ukraine and Syria. Trump, just like his predecessors, is in the business of empire and regime change.

In Syria, the regime change attempt failed and we lost regionally to Iran.
In Ukraine, the regime change succeeded, but it backfired as Ukraine is a failed state and Crimea (the crown jewel) is now part of Russia.
Whether or not regime change is accomplished in Venezuela, it is sure to backfire just like the others.
 
Venezuela had been destroying their own economy since the 1950s when they centralized their banking system. Bank mismanagement 1960s-1980s led to industry nationalizaion. Then to help their failing government they accelerated bolivar creation in the 2000s. That is why they went from the richest country in South America in the 1970s to the poorest country in South America in the 2000s to the murder and starvation capital of the world in the 2010s.

Unless US government officials were telling them to do that or compelling them to do those things, they don't share the blame.
 
Musburger1 said:
Those of you who believe this is totally organic, believed the same thing about Ukraine and Syria. Trump, just like his predecessors, is in the business of empire and regime change.

In Syria, the regime change attempt failed and we lost regionally to Iran.
In Ukraine, the regime change succeeded, but it backfired as Ukraine is a failed state and Crimea (the crown jewel) is now part of Russia.
Whether or not regime change is accomplished in Venezuela, it is sure to backfire just like the others.
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Expressed support or recognition of Maduro as president of Venezuela:
- Bolivia
- Cuba
- Mexico
- Russia
- Turkey

Recognising Juan Guaido as president of Venezuela:
- US
- Canada
- Brazil
- Paraguay
- Colombia
- Argentina
- Peru
- Ecuador
- Costa Rica
- Chile
- Guatemala
 
Monahorns said:
Venezuela had been destroying their own economy since the 1950s when they centralized their banking system. Bank mismanagement 1960s-1980s led to industry nationalizaion. Then to help their failing government they accelerated bolivar creation in the 2000s. That is why they went from the richest country in South America in the 1970s to the poorest country in South America in the 2000s to the murder and starvation capital of the world in the 2010s.

Unless US government officials were telling them to do that or compelling them to do those things, they don't share the blame.
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You skipped the 90’s. Prior to Chávez, 80% of the population lived under the poverty level. Although the country was rich in resources, the wealth never reached the people. Under Chavez and nationalization of the oil industry, the standard of living increased tremendously. Beginning in 2008, problems and events began reversing the gains.

The first was the oil crash. The second factor was that corruption had never been rooted out. Then in 2015, the US under Obama and pressured by the oil industry, lifted a 40 year statute prohibiting the US from exporting oil. At the same time, the US and Saudi Arabia orchestrated a production increase to create another drop in the price of oil. The US placed sanctions on Venezuela making it difficult to make repairs needed to upgrade their oil infrastructure as well as create shortages of goods in order to place hardships on the population in hopes the people would rise up against the government; much the same tactics used against Syria and Iran.

The news doesn’t emphasize the heavy role in Venezuela’s demise played by the US government and the lobbying of major oil companies such as Exxon (why do you think the CEO of Exxon was chosen by Trump to be Secretary of State?).

Civil War may be next and our government eggs it on and most stupid Americans applaud the effort. Let’s see how it turns out for them.
 
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