It definitely looks like it's heading that direction.
Rednecks shoot black kid running in neighborhood
- Thread starter AustinHorn24
- Start date
It definitely looks like it's heading that direction.
LongestHorn
2,500+ Posts
In Georgia, you have to have direct knowledge that a crime was committed and that crime had to be a felony for a citizens arrest to occur. There is no evidence he committed a crime. But suppose he did (and I don't believe he did) commit a theft from a house under construction that crime would be a misdemeanor.
O.C.G.A. 17-4-60 (2010)
17-4-60. Grounds for arrest
A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge. If the offense is a felony and the offender is escaping or attempting to escape, a private person may arrest him upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion.
"Reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion" is not "direct knowledge."
What they supposedly suspected him of was not a felony. Therefore they would have needed to have seen him commiting the crime or had direct knowledge that he had committed a crime. They had neither.
O.C.G.A. 17-4-60 (2010)
17-4-60. Grounds for arrest
A private person may arrest an offender if the offense is committed in his presence or within his immediate knowledge. If the offense is a felony and the offender is escaping or attempting to escape, a private person may arrest him upon reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion.
"Reasonable and probable grounds of suspicion" is not "direct knowledge."
What they supposedly suspected him of was not a felony. Therefore they would have needed to have seen him commiting the crime or had direct knowledge that he had committed a crime. They had neither.
Then why were they chasing him? Just decided to go hunting that day?
How do you know it wasn’t a felony?
How do you know it wasn’t a felony?
Only if the felon was attacking him and he feared for his life.
LongestHorn
2,500+ Posts
Racist murderers would have never been arrested if the video isn’t leaked. Glynn County Police department is corrupt af.
They’ve been involved in scandal after scandal, involving offenses like inappropriate sexual contact with informants in a narcotics investigation, and lying to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation, and interfering with investigations into police involved shootings.
The initial police report shows an appalling lack of investigation into the case, citing only Racist Dad’s account of the case. The case has been passed along to a new prosecutor two times due to conflicts of interest, and now sits with prosecutor Tom Durden in Hinesville to charge the racist murders or to accept their explanation that the killing was justified in self-defense.
Cameraman and racist buddy, William Bryan, should also arrested and charged. The FBI needs bringing in, and all parts of the trial process moved outside of Redneck County in this case, due to the suspects deep ties to this racist community and its bigot leadership.
They’ve been involved in scandal after scandal, involving offenses like inappropriate sexual contact with informants in a narcotics investigation, and lying to the Georgia Bureau of Investigation, and interfering with investigations into police involved shootings.
The initial police report shows an appalling lack of investigation into the case, citing only Racist Dad’s account of the case. The case has been passed along to a new prosecutor two times due to conflicts of interest, and now sits with prosecutor Tom Durden in Hinesville to charge the racist murders or to accept their explanation that the killing was justified in self-defense.
Cameraman and racist buddy, William Bryan, should also arrested and charged. The FBI needs bringing in, and all parts of the trial process moved outside of Redneck County in this case, due to the suspects deep ties to this racist community and its bigot leadership.
Do you have any facts relevant to the actual event, or just the hollow, too often used chant of racism that nobody believes any more?
His evidence stops with skin color, which means he’s a .......... well, you know.
You mean other than the video evidence of him committing a crime?
LongestHorn
2,500+ Posts
If you initiate an assault, you don’t get to then claim self-defense if the other person reacts to them being assaulted. Two cars with armed racists ambushed him. And murdered him.
Well, we don’t see who assaulted who first with the video, so we don’t know. That’s how this law thing works.
LongestHorn
2,500+ Posts
Judge denied racists’ bond. Why is that?
I don’t know. Why did he?
It’s more beneficial to the Dems to hide the problems in that culture and manipulate them for political benefit.
The education and crime statistics for blacks is horrific and not getting better. The cultural problems are the primary cause, but government programs and the libs’ willingness to treat them like helpless children is not helping.
It will take a few generations to overcome their issues if anyone actually faced the truth and decided to do something about it.
The education and crime statistics for blacks is horrific and not getting better. The cultural problems are the primary cause, but government programs and the libs’ willingness to treat them like helpless children is not helping.
It will take a few generations to overcome their issues if anyone actually faced the truth and decided to do something about it.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
I have to see good evidence that Arbery was a committing a crime at the time. His criminal record from 5 years ago doesn't matter. The fact that there had been some theft in the area in that timeframe doesn't matter.
Was Arbery positively identified as the thief that day? Otherwise, I don't want to hear anyone supporting the actions of the shooters or saying things like Arbery deserved it.
First, the crime of theft shouldn't end in a death sentence. Second, the shooters shouldn't even have pursued someone who they didn't know with a large probability was guilty of anything.
Was Arbery positively identified as the thief that day? Otherwise, I don't want to hear anyone supporting the actions of the shooters or saying things like Arbery deserved it.
First, the crime of theft shouldn't end in a death sentence. Second, the shooters shouldn't even have pursued someone who they didn't know with a large probability was guilty of anything.
What you think and what the law allows may not coincide. The felon was shot because he grabbed someone’s gun. That was dumb.
Typically, murderers don’t call 911 before shooting someone. Clearly, the guy didn’t intend on shooting the felon because he or his father called 911 while pursuing the felon.
Typically, murderers don’t call 911 before shooting someone. Clearly, the guy didn’t intend on shooting the felon because he or his father called 911 while pursuing the felon.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
My big question is how did the video go public?
If the friend video taped the shooting and was confident that they did the right thing. He doesn't send it out to all his friends. He gives it to the police to show his and his friends' innocence.
If the friend who video taped the shooting later felt that he and his friends had murdered someone, he erases the video and the bury the body to never be found.
So far the only way I can think of why the video went public is that the friend at some point thinks his friends committed murder and that despite being involved in the incident doesn't believe he is guilty of murder. He then leaks the video somehow, to show his friends were guilty of murder.
Makes me think the friend didn't think chasing Arbery would lead to death, and that he also thinks his friends committed a crime.
There is no way for me to pin blame on him at this point, because no one would even know about the shooting if it wasn't for him. He is the one who exposed the wrong doing. He sounds innocent to me. The 2 shooters sound guilty to me.
If the friend video taped the shooting and was confident that they did the right thing. He doesn't send it out to all his friends. He gives it to the police to show his and his friends' innocence.
If the friend who video taped the shooting later felt that he and his friends had murdered someone, he erases the video and the bury the body to never be found.
So far the only way I can think of why the video went public is that the friend at some point thinks his friends committed murder and that despite being involved in the incident doesn't believe he is guilty of murder. He then leaks the video somehow, to show his friends were guilty of murder.
Makes me think the friend didn't think chasing Arbery would lead to death, and that he also thinks his friends committed a crime.
There is no way for me to pin blame on him at this point, because no one would even know about the shooting if it wasn't for him. He is the one who exposed the wrong doing. He sounds innocent to me. The 2 shooters sound guilty to me.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Well if I feel like my only chance of survival is to grab someone's gun away from them, then that is what I try to do. The shooters are the ones who escalated the situation not Arbery.
The fact that you state Arbery was a felon is telling enough. What direct evidence do you have? If you don't, quit calling the murdered person a felon. Call him a victim or even a suspect. But a felon? He wasn't convicted of anything.
Although I don’t agree with pursuing the felon, I don’t think the guy intended to kill him until the felon grabbed his gun and tried to take it from him. At that point, it’s self defense. Innocent
Well, you would be just as dumb as the felon and would also get shot. Maybe you should quit acting on your feelings and start thinking.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
You totally misunderstood what I said. Okay. If I carefully analyze that my only way to survive is to get the gun away from someone through cold logic, then I direct my actions willfully in accordance.
Of course a guy pointing a gun at someone else has NO culpability. They are merely passive observers whose only intention is defense. Of course they drove their truck in the direct path of someone, maybe with guns drawn. Obviously they weren't giving off any aggressive non verbal communication. There is no reason to believe a person chasing me in a truck , pointing a gun at me wants to kill me. That would be so illogical.
Of course, I know better. In fact, I had 2 friends in high school. They were looking at guns in the house of one of them. Friend 1 points a gun at friend 2. Friend 2 tells him to put the gun down. Friend 1 refuses. Friend 2 dives for the door. Friend 1 pulls the trigger and shoots friend 2. Friend lives but almost dies from the gun shot wound. Friend 1 had no motive. Says he had no intention to harm. This is between 2 people who knew and like each other. When you pull a gun on a stranger you can't assume that person know what you are thinking and will stand still and do what you want. That isn't how the real world works.
Maybe you should quit using theory and your own feelings to evaluate a real world, chaotic, crazy, unexplainable even.t
Of course a guy pointing a gun at someone else has NO culpability. They are merely passive observers whose only intention is defense. Of course they drove their truck in the direct path of someone, maybe with guns drawn. Obviously they weren't giving off any aggressive non verbal communication. There is no reason to believe a person chasing me in a truck , pointing a gun at me wants to kill me. That would be so illogical.
Of course, I know better. In fact, I had 2 friends in high school. They were looking at guns in the house of one of them. Friend 1 points a gun at friend 2. Friend 2 tells him to put the gun down. Friend 1 refuses. Friend 2 dives for the door. Friend 1 pulls the trigger and shoots friend 2. Friend lives but almost dies from the gun shot wound. Friend 1 had no motive. Says he had no intention to harm. This is between 2 people who knew and like each other. When you pull a gun on a stranger you can't assume that person know what you are thinking and will stand still and do what you want. That isn't how the real world works.
Maybe you should quit using theory and your own feelings to evaluate a real world, chaotic, crazy, unexplainable even.t
LongestHorn
2,500+ Posts
Racist “the felon” remark without evidence of a crime, much less a felony crime.
911 operator couldn’t understand the emergency because there was no emergency.
911 operator couldn’t understand the emergency because there was no emergency.
Last edited:
It's not racist to call him a felon. He has a record. Quit being a goober.
LongestHorn
2,500+ Posts
EXCERPT FROM 911 CALL WITH TRAVIS McMICHAEL
Travis: There's a guy in a house right now. There's a house under construction.
911 Dispatcher
o you have your address or the other — that house's address?
Travis: Uh, right at 219 or 220 Satilla Drive.
911 Dispatcher: And you say someone's breaking into it right now?
Travis: No, it's all open and it's under construction and he's running right now. There he goes right now.
911 Dispatcher: OK. What is he doing?
Travis: He's running down the street.
(Interference)
911 Dispatcher: OK. That's fine. I'll get them out there. I just need to know what he was doing wrong.
Travis: There's a guy in a house right now. There's a house under construction.
911 Dispatcher
o you have your address or the other — that house's address?Travis: Uh, right at 219 or 220 Satilla Drive.
911 Dispatcher: And you say someone's breaking into it right now?
Travis: No, it's all open and it's under construction and he's running right now. There he goes right now.
911 Dispatcher: OK. What is he doing?
Travis: He's running down the street.
(Interference)
911 Dispatcher: OK. That's fine. I'll get them out there. I just need to know what he was doing wrong.
A couple of things we still need to know.
First, was Arbery just walking around a construction site, or had he actually burglarized someone's home? It makes a difference, because a citizen's arrest requires Arbery to have committed a felony. Burglary is a felony. Walking around a construction site unless combined with some other activity like theft is at most misdemeanor trespassing. If it was a construction site, did he steal anything? Was it worth over $500?
Second, if Arbery committed a felony, how did they know he did it? Did they see him do it?
If he committed a felony (by burglary or theft), then they had a right to arrest him if they saw him or otherwise had immediate knowledge of it, even if it was a stupid thing to do. If they had a right to arrest him, then there's a good chance they walk.
However, if they didn't have a right to arrest him, then I'm not so sure. I took a look at the Georgia stand your ground law (which is predicated on right to defend oneself, others, and property), and it isn't as favorable as one might assume. It allows force to be used to protect property from being stolen, but even that has limitations. It has to be property you or a family member lawfully possess or that you have a legal duty to protect. It also doesn't seem to give you the right to chase the guy down - only to keep him from taking it in the first place.
They could try to argue defense of themselves. However, if you're the aggressor (which they obviously were), you have no right of self-defense unless you try to withdraw from the confrontation and communicate that to the other person. I see no evidence that they did this.
First, was Arbery just walking around a construction site, or had he actually burglarized someone's home? It makes a difference, because a citizen's arrest requires Arbery to have committed a felony. Burglary is a felony. Walking around a construction site unless combined with some other activity like theft is at most misdemeanor trespassing. If it was a construction site, did he steal anything? Was it worth over $500?
Second, if Arbery committed a felony, how did they know he did it? Did they see him do it?
If he committed a felony (by burglary or theft), then they had a right to arrest him if they saw him or otherwise had immediate knowledge of it, even if it was a stupid thing to do. If they had a right to arrest him, then there's a good chance they walk.
However, if they didn't have a right to arrest him, then I'm not so sure. I took a look at the Georgia stand your ground law (which is predicated on right to defend oneself, others, and property), and it isn't as favorable as one might assume. It allows force to be used to protect property from being stolen, but even that has limitations. It has to be property you or a family member lawfully possess or that you have a legal duty to protect. It also doesn't seem to give you the right to chase the guy down - only to keep him from taking it in the first place.
They could try to argue defense of themselves. However, if you're the aggressor (which they obviously were), you have no right of self-defense unless you try to withdraw from the confrontation and communicate that to the other person. I see no evidence that they did this.
But that's where it gets dicey. He did come at them. He did it after their provocation by pulling a gun on him, but he did come at them. Unless they actually had a right to arrest him, that shouldn't save them, but it is relevant.
LongestHorn
2,500+ Posts
second call to 911 came in at 1:14 pm
"I'm out here at Satilla Shores," the second caller begins and proceeds to state that, "There's a black male running down the street."
The man allegedly shouts "Stop!" several times, with the call going silent for several minutes.
Meanwhile, The Brunswick News reports that Gregory McMichael went inside Travis's home, armed himself and his son, and proceeded to chase Arbery down the street in Travis's pickup truck. Travis reportedly asked Arbery to stop, and when he didn't, the fatal altercation ensued, where Travis fired two shots.
The audio calls into question the McMichael's statements that Arbery was a burglary suspect who had been caught on cameras multiple times. The Brunswick News notes that per county police reports, only one burglary was filed between Jan.1 and Feb. 23: an automobile burglary involving a Smith & Wesson pistol stolen on Jan.1 from a pickup truck outside of Travis McMichael's Satilla Drive home.
The Arbery family's attorney S. Lee Merrit released a statement on Twitter saying: "Mr. Arbery had not committed any crime and there was no reason for these men to believe they had the right to stop him with weapons or to use deadly force in furtherance of their unlawful attempted stop. This is murder."
"I'm out here at Satilla Shores," the second caller begins and proceeds to state that, "There's a black male running down the street."
The man allegedly shouts "Stop!" several times, with the call going silent for several minutes.
Meanwhile, The Brunswick News reports that Gregory McMichael went inside Travis's home, armed himself and his son, and proceeded to chase Arbery down the street in Travis's pickup truck. Travis reportedly asked Arbery to stop, and when he didn't, the fatal altercation ensued, where Travis fired two shots.
The audio calls into question the McMichael's statements that Arbery was a burglary suspect who had been caught on cameras multiple times. The Brunswick News notes that per county police reports, only one burglary was filed between Jan.1 and Feb. 23: an automobile burglary involving a Smith & Wesson pistol stolen on Jan.1 from a pickup truck outside of Travis McMichael's Satilla Drive home.
The Arbery family's attorney S. Lee Merrit released a statement on Twitter saying: "Mr. Arbery had not committed any crime and there was no reason for these men to believe they had the right to stop him with weapons or to use deadly force in furtherance of their unlawful attempted stop. This is murder."
Weekly Prediction Contest
* Predict HORNS-AGGIES *
Sat, Nov 30 • 6:30 PM on ABC
Recent Threads
-
The Media Industry
- Started by texas_ex2000
- Replies: 8K
- West Mall
-
President Biden Accountability Thread
- Started by 2003TexasGrad
- Replies: 4K
- West Mall
Prediction Results Threads
