Post-Trump GOP
- Thread starter BrntOrngStmpeDe
- Start date
OUBubba
5,000+ Posts
Sicknick died the next day. One suicide three days later and one 9 days later on his way back in to work after being "cleared" to return. Yeah, exactly the same as your trick shoulder from too many curve balls. Disingenuous to the max.
What does any of that have to do with the underlying issue?
OUBubba
5,000+ Posts
Bull.
Took their money, stirred them up, said he was going there with them, watched it like he was watching MNF with Jerry Jones, delayed actual help from getting to them, "I guess they care more than you do, Kevin", kept taking their money. Still taking their money.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Misinformation, >which is what I was replying to up the thread.
McCarthy's emotions, as well as others, was flamed by reports of police being murdered. Now we know better but at the time it was non stop reported as a fact.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Was that quote verified? If so, please provide video if available
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
With all due respect, this is ********. Lol. I'm not saying you're factually wrong. I'm saying that it's highly unlikely that McCarthy was primarily driven by the dead officer. What if no one has died? Do you think the January 6 riot would have been a non-story or even a significantly smaller story? Of course not. The story was the riot and what it was about, not the dead officer.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Once again... MISINFORMATION is what I am posting about
Once again.. I don't agree with protests in that manner
To add, yes, the dead officer was front and center in msm coverage. Anytime you alter facts in a story to shape a lie, or enrage people, it's MISINFORMATION. McCarthy, like about all of us, were mislead by the news of an officer dying by being beaten by a fire extinguisher. Without a death it was simply a protest
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Did McCarthy say that the only reason he blamed Trump, initially, was due to the death of Sicknick? Most of McCarthy's public criticism actually came before Sicknick died the next day from what I remember. Unless there are quotes that McCarthy was upset about Sicknick's death that drove him to criticize Trump that line of reasoning may not be supported by the facts.
Based on what we know, McCarthy was driven by activities that happened in the moment on 1/6. His conversation with Trump in which he was told that those insurrectionists care more about the election than McCarthy did was clearly front of mind as he shared the conversation with others. The fact that Congress had to be ushered away to safe rooms and delayed the Electoral vote counting. The trashing of the Capital building with feces smeared on a hallway, broken windows/doors, ransacked congressional offices. 4 Dead protesters in the halls of the Capitol Building along with dozens of injured Capitol Police. All of these things must have factored into the 1/7 morning Press Conference which all occurred before Sicknick died. It was only a few days later that McCarthy visited Mar-a-lago and did an about face after his kiss kiss makeup session with DJT.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
McCarthy skirts questions about phone call with Trump during riot
PolitiFact - What happened during the Jan. 6 call between Donald Trump and Kevin McCarthy?
Read the nbc link. Now read the politfact link
In the 2nd link McCarthy said "no" to the quote you and the msm are trying to sell as truth.
McCarthy explains the conversation, nowhere does it line up with your "quote" of what trump told McCarthy. As I told bubba, if you have audio or video of Trump saying what you guys accuse him of, offer proof.
MISINFORMATION. Maybe you, me, everyone needs to wait until facts come out instead of jumping on what cnn reports.
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Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
I'm not referencing CNN but rather the thrust of the quote from Congresswoman Herrera Buetler of what McCarthy told her. She stands by the story. Who has the incentive to lie? Who changed their perspective 180 degrees after the meeting in Mar-a-lago?
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Show proof. Where is the audio? Her source is McCarthy? McCarthy said trump didn't say what's being reported.
You're hung up on "proof" the election was rigged in certain states. But you'll be convinced of a quote by trump even if McCarthy said himself the quote never was spoken.
Heal thyself
As for changing perspective.. that happened when we learned that a Capitol Police officer being murdered was ********. MISINFORMATION.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Proof that Congresswoman Buetler said what McCarthy told her? You're right, it was supposedly said by McCarthy while they waited in the safe room as the Capitol building was being sacked. Sadly, there are no recording devices there. You choose to believe McCarthy while I think Buetler (R) has no reason to lie. Forget that quote and listen to McCarthy in his own words below.
I'd strongly urge you to watch McCarthy's 1/13 speech in which he spends 3 minutes talking about the insurrection, 10 seconds about Sicknick(sp?) death and the officer that committed suicide and ultimately states the "Donald Trump bears some responsibility for the events on Jan 6th."
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
You still have no proof of the quote. Do you?
You're relying on rumor, not fact. 'Someone told somebody something, then told another about it.'
Your problem here is, the 'somebody' denied the quote.
Go get proof. Until then you're whistling dixie
Honestly, I'm having a hard time following your point here. You think that McCarthy changed his position and tone because we've found out that Officer Sicknick wasn't murdered by the rioters rather than the meeting at Mar-a-Lago. That was your original response when I called McCarthy for playing flippy-flop. I do not see how what you've posted establishes that. I think the video posted by Husker is a good indicator of what McCarthy thought at the time. He mentioned the officer out of respect, but that was very clearly not his focus.
Think of it this way. Suppose the officer hadn't even been hurt. Do you think McCarthy's remarks would have been wildly different? Do you think he would have shrugged the incident off as no big deal? If you think so, that's fine, but we're probably at an impasse. In light of his remarks, I don't see how someone could think that.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
I think the emotions ran high after MSM ran with "a pack of wild animals" beat a police officer to death by viciously pounding him with a fire extinguisher. If you don't recall the emotions of the moment, fine. I do.
Yes, if an officer hadn't been hurt, his remarks would be different. It wasn't an armed attack. It wasn't even an attack (afterall, who was killed? Who was arrested for carrying arms? Tell me if you have facts that I don't). But the GOP were embarrassed not only by some jackasses that breached the capitol, but the theme on the floor of the House was this was all brought on by Trump (false) and there were many acts of violence (also false) and a murder of a capitol cop (also false)
As far as any video posted, my point is>>did McCarthy say that Trump said what the left and SH are saying is "fact"? ...No he did not.... End of discussion (normally). The person that supposedly was on the other end of the line denied Trump made the comment. If we're sticking to facts and not rumors, that should end the nonsense of putting words in someone's mouth that aren't substantiated. Was McCarthy embarrassed and pissed about the protest? Yes. So was I at the time. Then facts came out, we were misled with ******** from the media.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
It's a fact that Republican Rep Buettler stated that McCarthy told her that. Not sure that's in doubt. If you want to claim she lied while McCarthy/Trump are telling the truth that's your prerogative. For me, both have proven to be untruthful often and are 100% political. Given I don't have any information that Rep Buettler has done the same I'll believe her. This is a sideshow, though. A distraction from the real argument.
You think the speech above is based only on Sicknik(sp?) death. That's a dubious claim based on the speech above and other statements/ actions. Again it's your prerogative so we'll have to agree to disagree.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Never said that. You know better, so don't play that game
Emotions were running high long before anyone knew a police officer had allegedly been killed, because, though terrible, that wasn't the big story. The storming of the Capitol to stop the election certification and breaking the 200+ year old precedent of a peaceful transfer of power was the big story. It's the reason this was literally the biggest story in the world on January 6. It was as big here in the UK as it was in the US, and that was before anybody knew an officer had died. If you think an officer dying was the dominant issue, I don't know what to tell you. Of the couple hundred cops who are killed every year, why was this one considered noteworthy?
Also, what McCarthy says on the House floor aren't the ramblings of an emotional man. It's carefully drafted prepared comments that he and his staff put together after great consideration of the impact and implications of the comments. As a former legislative aide who has written comments delivered on the floor of a legislative body, I can assure you that emotion isn't driving the content even if it looks like it is. Any apparent shows of emotion address largely contrived for effect.
Of course Trump brought it on. If Trump had conceded after the states certified their electoral votes (which is what he should have done) rather than blabbing about election theft for months, do you think these people would have stormed the Capitol? Obviously not. They'd be back home with their Red Man and spit cups and Wild Turkey.
And the entire thing was an act of violence. Nobody has to die for an act to be violent. Trespassing, damaging property, and frightening people into leaving an area where they have a right to be is an act of violence and if done to push a political agenda, it's an act of terrorism. If I hold BLM rioters to that standard, then I have to hold Trump supporters to it as well.
This has no bearing on my point, so I don't particularly care. It's true that none of us can know for sure what was said between McCarthy and Trump on the day of the incident. However, we can believe what we want. Jamie Herrera Beutler has no obvious reason to lie. McCarthy and Trump have every reason in the world to lie, so I tend to believe her. But again, I don't care that much. It just isn't very relevant to my point.
Again, we should all be embarrassed either way. We witnessed a disruptive and violent **** show driven by one of the candidates, and an officer didn't have to die for it to be so.
I think the January 6 rioters disproportionately did. Am I wrong?
They were a story, but you know who didn't treat them like a big story? The Trump campaign. You know why? Because they weren't decisive. At the end of the day, the election was close, but it wasn't a nail-biter that was decided by irregularities. When you lose states by tens or hundreds of thousands of votes, fixing or accounting for irregularities aren't going to save you.
And I'm not sure why you're so shocked. He barely won against a horrific candidate. Then when he won, he did everything he could to motivate his opposition to turn out against him and did little or nothing to expand his own base. It was pretty easy to see coming.
But nobody said more stupid **** on Twitter, so you can still brag about that.
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Yeah, apparently most of the “protesters at the rally” were folks who ran their own business.
It's amazing that some otherwise smart people still believe that even though the Capitol breach occurred while Trump was still speaking, that he somehow incited that.
Amazing. Yet, these people expect us to take heed of their other rants and novels written on here.
Is there a <Yawn> emoji?
Amazing. Yet, these people expect us to take heed of their other rants and novels written on here.
Is there a <Yawn> emoji?
Also amazing that it's still okay to throw out stereotypes of the white racist redneck with chewing tabackey and the like.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Geazus, where to begin...
(a) Mccarty changed his tune after his emotional speech. Facts came to light afterwards, not just about the false reports of Sicknick's cause of death. If you think he did so because (as some libs here tend to think) "He done kissed the raaaing of that there orange man", then cool. Wear it.
(b) Red man and spit cups? Seriously? If that's the case then in your mind Tony Gwynn is / was a deep down trumper extraordinaire ... oh wait, he's black so he gets a pass. I'll pass on your culture lesson even tho I've never chewed tobacco
Tobacco use still prevalent among professional athletes - Global Sport Matters
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