Netanyahu Schooled Obama on the Middle East ...

Palestinians do not exist. It is a made up term, much like the term 'Hispanic.' People use it, but it entirely a political designation. The term in it's modern usage refers to people born in the British Mandate after WWI until the creation of the state of Israel in 1948. This means that Jews born there as just as 'Palestinian' as Arabs. Israelis, Jews, Christians, Arabs... all could be dubbed 'Palestinian.'
After WWII when the modern state of Israel was created Arabs who were predominately Muslim refused to acknowledge a state that recognised Judaism.
The crux of the issue will not be resolved with any so called 'two state solution.' The only solution palatable to the Arab Muslims in the area is that Israel cease to exist.
Israel has long recognised freedom of religion and also does not base citizenship or rights on ethnicity or religion. This cannot be said of the areas currently under 'Palestinian' control.
Into this mix, Obama wants Israel to sit down and negotiate land swaps ect, with Hamas which is a terror organisation. Hamas has repeatedly called for the destruction of any type of Jewish control of any land, and refuses (still) to acknowledge the right of a Jewish state to exist.
Tell me where all people in the middle east who are citizens can freely vote and elect a government? Israel. PERIOD.

Into this Obama wants to give billions to an as yet unnamed Egyptian governments, gives equal standing in the international community of a terrorist organisation and Israel, our strongest ally in the region.

Islam is a demonic religion with which the United States is currently in a worldwide war. Obama continually sides with our enemies, and continues to defy US law by advocating negotiating with terrorists and waging war on Libya without Congressional approval or oversight.
Troubled times these are in which we live.
 
How many Muslim attacks on Jews in the US occurred prior to the establishment of Israel? For that matter, how many attacks were there on Jews living in the ME prior to the creation of Israel? It's not Judaism per se that is the issue in this conflict.

Oh, and if it's a religious thing, how do the Muslims compare to the Christian European countries when it comes to slaughtering innocent Jews? The Muslims have a better history of religious tolerance than Europe. This conflict emerged from politics not religion. Sort of like N. Ireland: you can tell the sides because of their religion, but the conflict is rooted in the politics of conquest.

You are over simplifying the issues into good-guy vs bad-guy terms. That's appealing emotionally, but sort of useless if you want to dive into the issues of what to do in the ME. The ME is troublesome because it's complex not because it is simple.
 
Roma and Buckhorn are completely on point. Slugga just nails it.

Clean and most others on this board fall into two categories. They are either Jewish or Christians that believe Israel must be supported in order for Christ to return. It's really that simple.

Slugga brings out the 8 million pound elephant and so far is ignored. Saudi Arabia is one of our biggest allies, the home of Mecca itself, a country that beheads people and cuts off their hands and is a monarchy established by the British, yet we don't dare question them or attack them to "free their people and bring them democracy." We never ever raised an eyebrow on Mubarak for decades, and all of a sudden, we support the people there against their tyrant. Israel tries to support Mubarak and people here sit on their hands and look the other way while simultaneously yelling off their soapboxes how democratic Israel is. It's really pathetic.

All people here, with a few exceptions, want to say is that God gave Israel to the Jews, so everyone else can suck it, and that Muslims hate everyone and want to kill everyone. It's not that simple. It's just not.
 
I think it is a pretty queer argument, "Who has killed more Jews, European or Middle Eastern countries?" The diaspora was not by choice and was extensive in time and place.
 
Clean,
Didn't you hear, Pakistan LOVES India these days and there is no problems with Muslim violence in India at alll.

Of course that is a different scenario, and I am not attempting to equate Pakistan/India with Israel.

The bottom line is that a 2 state solution is no solution at all. Israel will never have security as long as a Palestinian state exists. Israel faces enough threats from Lebanon, Syria, Egypt, and Iran as it is without having to face Palestinian violence as well.

For those who say that essentially Israel landed on top of Palestinians in 1948, look at the history of the land. There has NEVER been one stable long term government in this land area. PERIOD. The longest that I can think of was Roman rule. (that is off the top of my head. Persian, and Greek rule were also fairly long as I recall).
No one has made a single comment about the fact that up until 1948 the term 'Palestinian' was not an ethnic one. It was applied to all who lived in the British Mandate. The term now has changed to apply to only ethnic Arabs. I call BS on that.
And if you think that other Arabs are on the side of the Palestinians, I have some Lebanese family you can talk to about that. They are against Israel and like using the Palestinian Arabs as pawns. They don't care about a Palestinian state, they care about Israel not existing.
 
Ahh, the problem is that you don't understand my point. I was answering something specific from another post. My point is not an abstract comparison of atrocities, it's to merely show that the animus towards the Jews is not particular to Muslims.

I don't see that as "queer."
 
buckhorn, what is worse? Western style colonialism or violent military conquest? A huge amount of current "Islamic" land was conquered by bloodshed from the Arab peninsula to North Africa and SE Europe.

And do you really believe that the Jews are ethnically cleansing Arab Palestinians? Huh?
 
buck,

If blacks had not been brought into the New World, there would have been no slavery. If Jews had not migrated to Europe, there would have been no Holocaust.

Are we really degenerating to this level of absurdity?

The Arabs, by and large, refuse to even ackowledge the historic and religious ties of the Jews to Jerusalem, despite that city being continually inhabited by Jews throughout the centuries, constituting a majority since at least 1850, and building the first new structures outside of the Old City walls a century-and-a-half ago. The Jordanians marched every last Jew out of the Old City in 1948 when they captured it. Today the Israeli government gives the Muslims exclusive dominion over the Temple Mount except for certain times when non-Muslims can visit.

There is no comparison to the way Muslims are treated in the US, Europe and Israel itself vs, the way non-Muslims are treated in the Middle East. I should know. I am the son of an Iraqi Jew whose family has continuously inhabited the Middle East since biblical times.

Hatred is born of ignorance.
 
I don't hate Jews, I just want them to move somewhere else.

I don't hate blacks, I just don't want them living next door to me.

I don't hate homosexuals, I just don't think they deserve to be treated equally.

Most racists are in denial about it.

Muslims live in freedom all over the West and even in Israel. Nobody threatens them with extinction. Nobody is telling them they can't exist. The very Israelis they hate give them dominion over the holiest site in Judaism. Why do they want to blot out the only home the Jews have ever had? Why can't there be room for everyone to live in peace?
 
For the last time, Jews lived among Muslims before there was an Israel. The violence starts after the creation of Israel. (Again, this is fact yet does not absolve the actions of either party.) The Muslims did not just wake up one day being more anti-Jewish than they were the day before.

Continue on your non-sequitur and have a nice Memorial Day weekend.
 
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