Kavanaugh's SC Confirmation Hearings

horninchicago said:
Except they didn't when they did the background check for this nomination.
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interesting ...

I think the difference is ... investigating criminal history which can actually be FOUND ...

but in this "limited scope" and based upon one person's allegation with very vague information which hasn't already been denied/refuted ... they COULD "find" that evidence.

Given the recent history of the FBI senior management ... I wouldn't put it past 'em.
 
horninchicago said:
Kavanaugh will get confirmed but always have a false cloud over him.
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and I think this was the real purpose behind this fiasco. They sold their dignity and integrity to the process for the possibility of being able to point at Kavanaugh's "murky past" of a allegation with exceedingly vacant detail.
 
ShAArk92 said:
interesting ...

I think the difference is ... investigating criminal history which can actually be FOUND ...

but in this "limited scope" and based upon one person's allegation with very vague information which hasn't already been denied/refuted ... they COULD "find" that evidence.

Given the recent history of the FBI senior management ... I wouldn't put it past 'em.
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It may have been Karl Rove, but I heard someone saying the 6 investigations he has been through would have contacted high school and college friends. Obviously nothing even remotely close to any of the allegations was found through those investigations.
 
horninchicago said:
Obviously nothing even remotely close to any of the allegations was found through those investigations.
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that's true ... as a guy who once held TS clearance, and like you, was submitted for FBI background checks multiple times in our current work ...

They don't just call the references you provide, and something in HS, especially for a senior, like this would have been found in the normal process of the "business" the FBI was tasked to do ...


But now it's a political football, and the FBI hasn't proven to be completely A-political in the senior management.
 
Horns11 said:
OK so tell me what they destroy RBG with? What accusations?
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Anybody can come up with a bald accusation at any time. It doesn't matter if someone actually had one. One could have been facilitated. People lie. People falsely accuse.

Or they could have gone with another approach such as to demonize some of the work she did for the ACLU. They've done some pretty controversial stuff that wasn't too popular. In short, they could have treated her like Democrats treated Bork.

Horns11 said:
Is it because Republicans are just more trusting and only look at the merits of her qualifications?
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Yeah, they are, though I think that's going to change after this. They could have gone apeshit on every Democratic nominee. In the end, they usually brought up disagreement with their judicial philosophy but generally treated them like human beings. And several often voted to confirm them.

Horns11 said:
If yes, then we're still at the impasse. Because Garland would have easily gotten a hearing if so.
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That's a different issue. Nobody is entitled to be confirmed or to have his nomination even considered. He is entitled not to be personally slandered and have his honor destroyed. If Garland had been treated like Kavanaugh, I would have condemned it even if I opposed his nomination.

But that's a bit of an "if my grandmother had balls" scenario. It never would have happened. If someone had accused Garland similarly (no details, no corroboration, no support from witnesses, politically adversarial to the nominee, etc.), she would have been treated like Paula Jones and Juanita Broderick at best. The accusation would have mostly prompted eye-rolls and dismissals.
 
GoFundMe campaigns for Christine Blasey Ford raise over $700,000 combined

OK, I will go along with the $200,000 for death threats, and new living area (very grudgingly) but the other $550,000 just for her? Her attorneys worked pro bono, so just why in the world does she need that money? I imagine the country paid for her flights, room, food, etc.

Does this open the door for opportunistic women to accuse other men in power? Is this a subtle call for other women to come to the table for some fast cash if they suddenly "remember" something from the past,or right now, as far as a false accusation? I don't like this precedent. It comes across almost like a reward and I can easily see this situation being abused in the future.

Who started all of these Go Fund Me accounts, and who will manage them and ensure the money goes to non-profit organizations?

I think I am one of the few monsters that do not find Dr. Blasey-Ford credible. She seemed to be playing a role. She came across as childlike, confused, and overall just gave me a strange vibe.
I think she may have experienced trauma of some type, or is dealing with some mental condition, but her baby voice, and continual looking back at her attorney did nothing for me.

I have seen or spoken to women after a real assault, (by the way, why do people continue to say she was raped? At best, she may have been in danger of being raped.) Put that aside, and I have heard true fear, shame, anger and all the many emotions that follow. I did not see these emotions, or any that felt "right" to me. I volunteered at a rape crisis hotline for almost 4 years. Not all the calls were immediately after the rape. While I never had a call from 30+ years, I did have some from several years earlier, and there was something missing from Dr. Blasey-Ford's manner and recollections that I can't explain.

While I understand Judge Kavanaugh's anger and frustration, and I was glad to see him unleash some of it, there were other times I wish he had kept some of his anger under control. It gives all the #metoo women one more nail to hammer. "Even if he's innocent, he doesn't have the temperament of a judge" type of comments.

Overall I worry that this will have a huge impact on the Beto/Ted election. I have less than 200 Facebook friends, and 4 of them who don't live in Texas are mailing hundreds of cards for Beto every day. There are several involved in organized groups that are targeting middle aged women, signing them up to vote, going door to door for him ( I have had 2 different groups of women canvas my house for the first time in my voting life the past two weeks) I think this is one more thing that will energize the female base, which I have heard is what will make the difference in the Ted/Beto election. This sexual accusation is the last thing we needed, for a variety of reasons.
 
The FBI has no credibility at this point. Who is going to investigate who is in charge of investigating to make sure they are not biased one way or the other?
 
Hollandtx said:
While I understand Judge Kavanaugh's anger and frustration, and I was glad to see him unleash some of it, there were other times I wish he had kept some of his anger under control. It gives all the #metoo women one more nail to hammer. "Even if he's innocent, he doesn't have the temperament of a judge" type of comments.
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It's a damned if you do situation. If he had been calmer, they'd say he was emotionless and unsure of himself. People who were crazy enough to believe Ford's accusation were going to crap on Kavanaugh's statement no matter what he did.
 
Hollandtx said:
I think I am one of the few monsters that do not find Dr. Blasey-Ford credible. She seemed to be playing a role. She came across as childlike, confused, and overall just gave me a strange vibe.
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I also did not find her credible.

She lied about her "claustrophobia" as a result of this sexual assault preventing her from flying. Then we find out that she has flown all over the country for business and pleasure. So we already know she is not very honest to start with. She made no attempt to explain this lie to the committee.

The complete lack of detail provided of this traumatic incident that she claims is "seared into her memory" is amazing. I can accept that certain details would escape her memory but not for a minute can I believe that she would not remember the exact location. It's not like she was dragged to this location unwillingly. She voluntarily went to this party and this location. That is a damning omission.

She also claims to not know who paid for the polygraph. Come on now. This is a bad joke.

I will not repeat the obvious issues such as the lack of any corroborating evidence, politically opportune timing, and that all the witness claimed to be present having no recollection of this incident or party.
 
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The accuser also testified that in 2012 she and her husband wanted to remodel her home, she wanted an extra door since Kavanaugh made her made her claustrophobic. This apparently drove them to therapy.
BUT they applied for the building permit in 2008 and she also stated that they had google employees renting rooms and they used the second door.

Now her friend that she says was there will cooperate with the FBI. This is the friend who stated she did know know Brett and Never saw him at any party.
Dems know this is all BS but they continue to use this to gain advantage.
 
but her baby voice
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I try to not focus on physical things like that due to people being different and one person’s physical mannerism meaning something entirely else for another, but in my life experience, the biggest female liars I have known (thankfully never about rape or sexual abuse), always used a similar baby (poor lil me) voice when telling their biggest whoppers. Ford is a different individual and this cannot be used as evidence of anything, but it is funny you brought that up because it also struck me the wrong way.

One of the reasons I ended up in law is growing up with family, friends, teachers, school admins, other people, college etc, I have had the unfortunate experience of being around a disproportionate number of horrible liars, male and female alike. People commented I was like an attorney by high school due to far too much experince dealing with them. I later learned most people have not had such experiences and are not good at spotting them or really realize how prevelant they are (although they think they do). Anyway, the point of this personal rambling is that I acknowledge my own person bias is that I do tend to treat all accusations with high levels scrutiny due to being the victim of or seeing far, far too many false ones. My experience has been few people are honest, good or trustworthy. However, I feel like the majority people want to see others as trustworthy. I think it is true most people are bias towards assuming positive outcomes, because all too often I have clients that get lied to and once I find out or the other sides admits their previous representations are false and it is clear the other side is willing to say anything for their own finanical gain at my client’s expense, it is shocking how long it takes me to convince some clients to stop believing and trusting the other side’s representations.

Anyway, the baby voice does not prove anything, but man it bothered me due to my past experiences with grade A liars.
 
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Horn6721 said:
Are there any HFs who think Ford is telling the truth that Kavanuagh tried to assault her?
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Mom and I have both had several conversations about this. She is beyond frustrated with the politics of the process (she is in her 70's). Like me, Kavanaugh was not her ideal choice to fill the vacancy but recognizes that he isn't a horrible choice. We both agree that something likely happened with Ford, but there is simply no credibility in her claims that it was Kavanaugh. Mom actually thinks the friend (Judge) may well have been involved in whatever MIGHT have happened.

Bottom line, however, is that we both believe that someone in such a situation is going to have a far better memory of the when and where even if the memory had been suppressed for so many years for whatever reason.

Mom, like me, tends not to be a supporter of a particular party but instead votes candidates based upon issues relevant to the position. She abhors straight-ticket voting, but DiFi has pissed her off enough that she may spend the remaining elections she has as someone who simply never votes for another candidate with a D next to their name even if only for a dog catcher vacancy...

DiFi has pissed off by energizing the older voters who don't always take the time to go to the polls...
 
mb227 said:
Mom and I have both had several conversations about this. She is beyond frustrated with the politics of the process (she is in her 70's). Like me, Kavanaugh was not her ideal choice to fill the vacancy but recognizes that he isn't a horrible choice. We both agree that something likely happened with Ford, but there is simply no credibility in her claims that it was Kavanaugh. Mom actually thinks the friend (Judge) may well have been involved in whatever MIGHT have happened.

Bottom line, however, is that we both believe that someone in such a situation is going to have a far better memory of the when and where even if the memory had been suppressed for so many years for whatever reason.

Mom, like me, tends not to be a supporter of a particular party but instead votes candidates based upon issues relevant to the position. She abhors straight-ticket voting, but DiFi has pissed her off enough that she may spend the remaining elections she has as someone who simply never votes for another candidate with a D next to their name even if only for a dog catcher vacancy...

DiFi has pissed off by energizing the older voters who don't always take the time to go to the polls...
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Yep, keep letting the Dems have a little more rope on a false, partisan attack and increase the chance that more of them can hang at the election.
 
I don't know what happened back then but we do know this: Robert Byrd was a KKK member. No problem. Bill Clinton was a sexual abuser. No problem. Ted Kennedy was a drunk and a liar and left Mary Jo to die. No problem. Ellison accused of sexual assault. No problem.

The arrogant aggressive hypocrisy and sanctimony truly makes me sick.
 
Hollandtx said:
GoFundMe campaigns for Christine Blasey Ford raise over $700,000 combined
...
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That should be enough for a lot of new escape doors


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One beginning issue with Ford is she tried so hard to portray herself as apolitical but she is a registered Dem and has protested against Trump She is pro abortion.She worked for a company that makes an abortion pill.
Corcept Therapeutics (Corcept.com) manufacturers and markets an abortion pill drug called mifepristone, and Christine Blasey Ford is a co-author of at least eight published scientific papers produced by the pharmaceutical giant to promote its pills. You can see Blasey’s name listed on several publications at this Corcept.com web page detailing their research papers.

Corcept Therapeutics, Inc., a $166 billion market cap company (stock symbol CORT) reportedly has current annual sales of $216 million. The company offers just one drug, mifepristone, which is widely known as an “abortion pill” or RU-486.
Her papers were intended to show other benefits the RU-486 pill could do.
Hardly an apolitical person just doing her civic duty.
What does she have to gain Dems ask? Uh continued money from the drug company for sale of the abortion drug. Gofundme accounts approaching a million and not closed. It is not a stretch to think of Soros etc giving money outright and even college funds for her sons. Speaking engagements, a book deal.
There is no downside to her miraculous "recovered memory" with no details.
 
Horn6721 said:
Are there any HFs who think Ford is telling the truth that Kavanuagh tried to assault her?
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Probably not except for Husker. However, I do believe Kavanaugh has been less than honest in some his testimony, especially the yearbook questions. FFFFFF and devil's triangle responses were laughable.
 
@mb227

My mother was born in 1936 and is a staunch Republican but not a religious one (i.e. she wouldn't outlaw abortion). And let me tell you, she HATES the Liberals. Not reasonable Democrats but Liberals and we know who they are (Kamala for instance). She told me more than I wanted to hear recently about a groping she suffered through in high school. And she mocked Dr. Ford for being traumatized over what happened assuming the details we do have are true. She was laughing about how weak-minded she must be. I was taken aback a bit but to her, it is being overly hyped 100% for political reasons and the humorless sanctimony of the Left is playing it for all it's worth.

My mother doesn't know if it happened but if it did she thinks the reaction now when he has a wonderful family and a long distinguished career to be a travesty.

Kavanaugh though has denied it. He's not asking for forgiveness. So we are forced to decide who is lying. My mother didn't go there. She just said it is wrong for something of that nature to be held in the back pocket until the most politically advantageous moment.
 
Garmel said:
Probably not except for Husker. However, I do believe Kavanaugh has been less than honest in some his testimony, especially the yearbook questions. FFFFFF and devil's triangle responses were laughable.
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That's the problem when you are in such a gotcha' situation. You can't be honest. Everything gets twisted so you become defensive and make mistakes.

I have a picture of me in the high school annual casually flipping the bird in our tennis team picture and the boys locker room in general was Saddam and Gomorrah. It is what it is...
 
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Garmel said:
Probably not except for Husker. However, I do believe Kavanaugh has been less than honest in some his testimony, especially the yearbook questions. FFFFFF and devil's triangle responses were laughable.
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I thought the questions were laughable. The answers seemed believable to me. At least, I have no reason to not believe the answers. Is there some urban dictionary for 80s references?
 
I like to compare what people say in different contexts. For instance, everyone was offended when Trump used the term "sh*thole." Well recently I was watching the movie El Norte, a highly sympathetic film towards migrants and in the movie a Mexican referred to Tijuana as a "sh*thole." I almost spit up my beer. The film was released in the early 80's. And Tijuana is a sh*thole. It's just that Republicans can't say it due to political correctness.

Today I read an article on ESPN.com about former UConn basketball coach Kevin Ollie who is under fire for NCAA violations. Here is a statement released by his attorney (notice the part I bolded):

""It is not a surprise that the Notice of Allegations mimics the University of Connecticut's position in the arbitration as there is every reason to believe that the NCAA would support its member," Jacques Parenteau, Ollie's attorney, said in a statement. "However, an allegation is not proof of anything, it's just an allegation. When the time comes to prove what actually happened, we will show that Coach Ollie did nothing to justify UConn's failure to pay him the money that is due him by contract."
 
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bystander said:
She just said it is wrong for something of that nature to be held in the back pocket until the most politically advantageous moment.
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Your Mom is right. It’s called Sin of Scandal, something the little Sisters taught me long ago (look it up). Seriously, is anyone better off personally because of this? In short, it’s a sin to hold something against someone for decades only to bring it out for scandal. Nobody wins, just as we saw.
 
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