If you think California is bad, check out Mississippi

mchammer said:
I can only assume you are referring to the period when GOP ran California and Dems ran MS. You are undermining your position without knowing it.
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My position???

My position is to see who is consistently getting the worst (or near-worst) results, and don't go down the road they went to get there.
 
Chop said:
Well, let's see. They do have Jackson, MS - a smallish city. Let's take an even smaller Texas city for comparison and see who is doing better.

How about Midland. Welp, there you have it. Texas smokes Mississippi out of the water.
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I kind of suspected this whole thread was tongue in cheek, but I did just want to chime in about how Mississippi statistics are so often cited without reference to the urban/rural distinction.
Carry on with your fun!
 
Chop said:
Depends on where for me.

The Mid-Coast or the far North of California have always seemed attractive to me, as I've driven through and stayed for short periods of time. There's places around Paso Robles that even remind me of the Texas Hill Country. I even like the Peninsula/Silicon Valley, but you have to put up with a lot of douchebaggery.

If I was forced to live in Mississippi, I'd go for either some plot of land on the salt water bays near Biloxi and put up a house and a boat dock, or somewhere way out in the forest of South Mississippi within a couple of hours of New Orleans.
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You cannot escape the taxes, nor the stupidity emanating from Sacramento, no matter how beautiful your nearby landscape may be. And I love the natural beauty that exists in most of California.

Were I to live in Mississippi, I think I'd be looking for the same properties as you.
 
California is objectively worse (5x) if you look at out migration per resident. Everything else is ********.
 
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Where does Mississippi rank in freedom to do whatever the F you want to do? Some people just don't care about money nor how much "stuff" they have.
 
Vol Horn 4 Life said:
Where does Mississippi rank in freedom to do whatever the F you want to do? Some people just don't care about money nor how much "stuff" they have.
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CATO ranks Miss #40 in Freedom

We (TEXAS) rank worst (dead last) in terms of personal freedom. :yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes::yikes:
Miss is boosted some by their tolerance for gambling.

"The least 5 free states for personal freedom are:

  1. Texas (50)
  2. Idaho (49)
  3. Wyoming (48)
  4. Kentucky (47)
  5. South Carolina (46)"
 
mchammer said:
You should check out the states with the highest out migration: NY, CA, IL, MA, DC, HI. I wonder if they have anything in common? Policies, perhaps???
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I've lived in 2 of those for 3-4 years each.

New York -- Cost of living + high taxes means you need to make a lot of $$$. But the ceiling is super high, so many folks can and do make a lot of $$$. The culture is love it or hate it. The mindset is go-getter/get ahead/make it big. Newcomers can make it there.

Hawaii -- Both an earthly paradise, and also a tropical ghetto, ala Puerto Rico, at the same time. Depends on the specific place you are at, and the island. Very little economic opportunity. Certain spots are ideal for wealthy and very wealthy retirees. Most corrupt state, more than Louisiana (not joking). Cost of living is very high and there's not much room to expand on Oahu. Very insular; not welcoming of outsiders. The mindset is the opposite of New York. In Hawaii, it's slow down, be lazy, stop trying to be such a big-shot, we're on island time. The outdoor and ocean experiences can make it all worthwhile, depending what you're into.

Commonalities: both are huge union states, maybe the 2 most pro-union states out there.

A Major Difference: as per above, the mindset. New York--go getters; Hawaii--just relax brah.
 
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Vol Horn 4 Life said:
I'm guessing they tie freedom most directly to "women's reproductive health".
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Well, if Nevada is full of the best gynecologists and medical facilities for gynegology, and women out there get their exams, pap smears, whatever frequently, then hoozah for them.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
 
To avoid becoming like Mississippi, avoid the policies adopted by Mississippi.

It's pretty simple.
 
Chop said:
To avoid becoming like Mississippi, avoid the policies adopted by Mississippi.

It's pretty simple.
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Uh, not that simple. Don’t you think what happened over 100 years ago still impacts today?
 
Chop said:
To avoid becoming like Mississippi, avoid the policies adopted by Mississippi.

It's pretty simple.
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No, it isn't simple at all. Compared to CA, the demographics, culture and a whole lot more are so different it's literally like 2 different countries. I lived in CA for many years and have spent a significant amount of time in the south so I think I know more than most.

CA literally was the land of golden opportunity for over 100 years until liberal policies started the decline about 30 years ago. There was nothing not to like: great weather, incredible beauty, incredible agriculture. That attracted the right type businessman for over 100 years. But in a way they were too successful. People got rich and the kids ended up being spoiled brats. CA used to be very conservative, but the kids are now the leaders. And we know what happens with spoiled brats. Imagine millions of Hunter Bidens. Now everyone is leaving due to the politics and unaffordability.

MS was devastated after the civil war and there has never been anything to attract top businesses there. There's no natural beauty and the weather sucks. There's also a culture of not caring about income. Affordability is the only thing they have going for them, and that's not enough.

I can't think of a better place to live for the best weather and more natural beauty than Saratoga, CA. That's why so many ended up in that area. But any decent house is over $3 million and the politics are a turn off so it's changing. Even the tech companies are moving out. There are actually still a lot of conservatives there, but their voice is invisible. And they will mostly be gone or dead over the next 20-30 years.

Let's see where these states are 20-30 years from now.
 
Chop said:
I keep hearing how bad California sucks these days, and the reports appear to be accurate.

Then, the next thing that's said is that California's state policies have created the sorry mess that they are in.

Therefore, the other States should take note, and (1) not follow the obviously failed policies of California, and (2) enact policies counter or opposite to those of California.

Ok.

But, I've found a state that sucks a whole lot worse than even California -- Mississippi. Mississippi is usually dead last in everything from poverty to education to healthcare to maternal death rates, etc. By almost every objective criterion, MIssissippi sucks worse than any State in the Union, and it's not even close.

So, the logical thing for the other States to do is to take note, and (1) not follow the obviously failed policies of Mississippi, and (2) enact policies counter or opposite to those of Mississippi.
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My son is in Biloxi, Miss training for his job at an air force base (He works for the guvment. He'll be there for 7.5 weeks. The other day he texted me saying how bad it was over there other than the gambling district. He said it seems all the money has been sucked in by the casino's and the rest of the place is a dump.
 
bystander said:
My son is in Biloxi, Miss training for his job at an air force base (He works for the guvment. He'll be there for 7.5 weeks. The other day he texted me saying how bad it was over there other than the gambling district. He said it seems all the money has been sucked in by the casino's and the rest of the place is a dump.
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Hmmmmmm.

You could be onto something there.....

While I enjoy Las Vegas, I find that most of the other gambling towns (Atlantic City (yuck), Biloxi, and the river-gambling towns) kind of suck.
 
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Run Pincher said:
There's no natural beauty
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Disagree.

For those who like massive undeveloped forests (which are getting rarer and rarer), it has some natural beauty.

Think of a state consisting only of East Texas -- East of the DFW and Houston areas.
 
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Chop said:
Hmmmmmm.

You could be onto something there.....

While I enjoy Las Vegas, I find that most of the other gambling towns (Atlantic City (yuck), Biloxi, and the river-gambling towns) kind of suck.
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All that being said...........................

Let the Choctaws add a casino to their new hotel at the Arlington, Texas ball park!

The tie-in to this thread: The Choctaws originated in Mississippi.
 
Chop said:
Well, if Nevada is full of the best gynecologists and medical facilities for gynegology, and women out there get their exams, pap smears, whatever frequently, then hoozah for them.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:
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Come on, you know that's not what I was talking about.
 
I know it’s not like the rest of the state, but Ocean Springs is one of the nicest towns in the South.
 
HornHuskerDad said:
Haven't heard anything about this. Assume it would have to face the voters - if so, I'll definitely vote "No!"
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A couple of times I've been to the newish Loews hotel restaurant (Bourbon & Cut, or Cut & Bourbon) and even more to Texas Live. I ask the valet guys and desk workers and all of them are hearing it through the grapevine.

It will take lobbying of the State Leg.

Either that, or the Feds could give the Choctaws a 2-3 acre reservation where the old baseball part and new hotel are.
 
First of all, comparing Jackson to Midland is like trying to compare Jennifer Anniston to the female camel at the zoo. You can NOT do it. Jackson has ZERO industry, while Midland is an industrial town.

Mississippi has NO industry, and most attempts to add any have been rejected with the explanation, "we want clean jobs". What is a "clean job"? The maids, dealers at the five casinos in Vicksburg. What are they paid? $2.65 an hour plus tips. ALERT: the 80+ year old retirement home women from Dallas DO NOT TIP! They play penny slots from the time they arrive until the charter bus leaves; buy one Coke and ask for 42 free refills.

When Warren County wanted Duke's pipeline for jobs & future taxes, they voted to grant a tax abatement, but couldn't do it because one "commissioner" was pissed off because Duke executives scheduled their visit while he was on vacation, so he refused to vote for it. (Duke eventually kissed his *** or pocketbook enough that the pipeline got built)

The entire population of the state of Mississippi would fit in the Houston SMSA, but with fewer meaningful jobs than Jefferson County. When the governor invites you to breakfast, and it's at Cracker Barrell, you know the status of the restaurant industry. (Oh, I should add that the waitress accused the Governor of walking the check.)

All the government charts are useful (particularly if you run out of Charmin), but I would prefer to read experiences from people that have "been there, done that", rather than reports from government grunts that do what they do because they can't get a real job - nobody will hire them.
 
This is the primary reason for Mississippi being last at most things.
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Black populations almost universally do worse in education. Whether you have an all-black school and measure it against other mixed schools. Or whether you have a mixed school and measure one race against the other within that school. The black population is almost always fourth when compared to the other major demographic pools (1- asian, 2-white, 3- hispanic) and almost always in that order. So, if I have a population that has a much higher share of black people and black people tend to do much worse in ed, then it stands to reason, the state outcome will be worse. In other words, it may be much less about state policies and much more about priorities in the homes of these citizens.

And education is the primary predictor of success in most things later in life. (marriage, economics, homeownership, assets, health, etc) So most of the other categories that MS lags in, are related to this one basic shortcoming.
 
BOSD.

Pardon my ignorance, but does California have any primarily black colleges or universities or are all of those back east?
 
I don't think CA has any HBCUs at all and of the CA schools with a larger black enrollment, none are well known or considered high achievement. But when I say "education" I'm referring mostly to primary and secondary (K-12). That is the age group that is most indicative of the priorities in the house.

The disparity in educational attainment shows up in statistically significant ways as early as kindergarten. So even before the education system is employed, there are large disparities in academics. This difference comes from what is done in the home to start children's development. Black homes are much less likely to practice numbers, letters, ABC's , etc.

These are not hard tasks. They don't take a Phd in the house to accomplish. They are time oriented tasks. If you don't take the time to practice ABC's with your 4 year old, your 4 year is going to start out behind.

The issue, however, is not where a 4 year starts, that disparity can be erased in a year or two. The bigger issue is the culture in the home that is unlikely to ever change. So, a parent that is unable or unwilling to practice ABC's or read to their child is not more likely to get engaged as the child progresses in school and subjects get more challenging. They are even less likely. and bad habits learned in early childhood are hard to modify later. This has a cumulative effect on the achievement level of that child. Black families are not the only families guilty of this, but they do so at much higher rates than other demographics and it is substantiated in almost every academic measure we have ever taken the time to compile.
 
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