If it was me, I would call up Matt Ruhl.
For Real ....Herman “IS” Done!!!
- Thread starter HoffHorn
- Start date
If it was me, I would call up Matt Ruhl.
What has Campbell done over the long haul to warrant consideration for the Texas job? His overall record is 34-27. If the reason is that he got his team to the Big XII championship in a down year, that doesn't cut it with me. We might as well pry Bill Snyder out of retirement if the criteria is to recruit 2 star athletes and have them play lights out.
Now that i look at it that way, Matt Campbell might be the best candidate for the job! Count me in on the Matt Campbell train.
Now that i look at it that way, Matt Campbell might be the best candidate for the job! Count me in on the Matt Campbell train.
Wait a minute............
Nah, probably not.
8. ALEX GRINCH, OKLAHOMA DEFENSIVE COORDINATOR
(Photo: Alonzo Adams, USA TODAY Sports)
Grinch's coaching file: Successful Washington State DC (2015-17), Ohio State
Potential landing spot: Group of 5 head coach
Ohio State's co-defensive coordinator and safeties coach last season, Grinch is an excellent recruiter and was expected to see a larger role on staff in 2019 entering the Ryan Day era before mutually parting ways to join Lincoln Riley at Oklahoma. A three-time Broyles award nominee, Grinch has won at every coaching stop following a brilliant career as a player at Mount Union and is best known for leading the defensive turnaround on Mike Leach's staff at Washington State before heading to Columbus. With a veteran group of returners at Oklahoma, through nine weeks Grinch has helped the Sooners rank second in total defense after finishing last in the Big 12 last season.
Looks like he's also originally from Ohio (the cradle of coaches, and Presidents).
Alex Grinch - Wikipedia
I sure would take him over Ash at DC though.
On edit, I sure would take him over Herman as HC (not that Grinch is in my top 3 or anything like that...)
Last edited:
Who wrote that **** that CDC left Herman out to dry? Herman left Herman out to dry last summer and with his lack of production on the field, so don't go casting blame on anyone else.
Campbell is a good coach, but Not for The University of Texas.
History is full of ok coaches who became "great" by being in the right place at the right time. It is also full of almost great coaches that never got the right location - see also Tommy Tuberville, who was in bad political situation everywhere he was. Seemed to have learned from the politics.
Campbell is a good coach, but Not for The University of Texas.
History is full of ok coaches who became "great" by being in the right place at the right time. It is also full of almost great coaches that never got the right location - see also Tommy Tuberville, who was in bad political situation everywhere he was. Seemed to have learned from the politics.
Here's a few highly disruptive DTs carrying the late Coach Akers off the field (looks like the Cotton Bowl). RIP.
I don't wish any ill on the man, but yes, he certainly made his own bed to lie in...
Life lesson: Don't burn bridges. You may need to cross those bridges in a retreat somewhere down the line. At this point, what insider(s) does Tom have left supporting him...?
And this is what's so ignorant about these so called sports journalists. They keep saying 5* talent vs 5* culture and then post the numbers showing Texas has only averaged one 5* per year under TH. One 5* per year is not 5* talent.
I'll be the first one to say that TH has failed to develop and maximize his talent, but if you're going to write sports articles at least get the facts correct.
Agreed, and I have dropped his name here several times already. Not sure why CDC has failed to read my posts and get with me to discuss, but whatever. Maybe I don't have Sabre's clout.
Or maybe the $60MM deal Rhule signed with Carolina makes him another unattainable property...
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
The media in the US is trash
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
And, while at Baylor, he even told his own players he was looking for an NFL gig. Kind of an usual move for a college coach but they say his players appreciated his honesty. Plus, several of them had the same goal.
But I do agree with the original thought that he is a solid head coach
I sure wish this was still a practice in todays defenses.
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Here's a few highly disruptive DTs carrying the late Coach Akers off the field (looks like the Cotton Bowl). RIP.
Had them both in my house
They still owe me some money!
Last edited:
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
I have heard 2 stories about Del Conte and Herman. They are somewhat contradictory but it is possible that both can still both be true
One story is that he was opposed or was at least reticent to give Herman the extension (May 2019). But he was overruled.
The other story is that later, when most everyone had since given up on Herman, that it was CDC who was the one person who stood in his corner. I am not certain if this was after the 2019 season or later, after the summer mess. In either event, CDC supposedly thought Herman served the chance to fight his way out of the corner he had painted himself into. CDC gave him the rope to do with it what he would. And he hung himself. Which is not the same thing as CDC hanging him out to dry
Last edited:
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Including, if you can believe it, influential Texas alumni actively trying to steer recruits away from UT to hasten Akers' firing
Crazy times
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Pretty good piece in the Athletic about us, by Andy Staples. Most of you already know this stuff but its still a good refresher. When I was a kid, Sports Illustrated was the hands down best long-form written pieces on sports. Now its probably these guys
I am going to spoiler the bulk of it - if anyone gets pissed off, let me know and I will drop it
I am going to spoiler the bulk of it - if anyone gets pissed off, let me know and I will drop it
" .... Del Conte also will need to decide how to handle some thorny issues going forward.
The situation involving alma mater “The Eyes of Texas” has calmed down, but it will need to be addressed. The team traditionally stays on the field after games to sing the alma mater, but during the summer a group of athletes — in response to social justice demonstrations across the country — asked the school to replace the song with a tune that didn’t have “racial undertones.” The group also asked that athletes no longer be required to sing the song. At issue is the song’s history. The phrase “the eyes of Texas” was coined by former Texas president William Prather, who was paraphrasing Robert E. Lee, who used the phrase “the eyes of The South are upon you” while president of Prather’s alma mater William & Mary. The song debuted at a minstrel show in 1903. Minstrel shows of the period frequently featured performances by people in blackface.
The edict from the administration was that no one would be forced to sing the song, but teams would be expected to stand respectfully while it is played. Controversy erupted after the loss to Oklahoma when a fan photo of quarterback Sam Ehlinger standing nearly alone as the band played The Eyes of Texas went viral. What the photo didn’t show was that the playing of the song took place nearly 10 minutes after the game had ended because of the presentation of the Golden Hat to the Sooners. That image produced a narrative that Herman had allowed his players to disrespect the song, which many alums — and importantly many donors — consider a cherished tradition.
This placed Herman in a no-win situation. He could have lost the locker room with a hardline stance on the song, and he already faced recruiting repercussions with opposing coaches asking recruits if they wanted to go to a school that would force them to stand for a song they considered racist. Meanwhile, anything but full support for the song angered some influential donors. Two groups had diametrically opposite opinions on the issue, and there simply was no way for Herman to thread the needle.
Del Conte needs to protect his coaches on this front. Whether he keeps Herman or seeks a different coach, he needs to formulate a plan for how the Longhorns will handle the song in 2021 and get out in front of the issue. If Texas makes a change, candidates will want to know how Del Conte intends to defuse this potential bomb. If Texas keeps Herman, he can’t be the face of any decision lest it harm recruiting more than rampant unchecked speculation about Meyer did.
Herman might still be able to help himself here. This has been a trying year, and all this talk of replacing him should leave him humbled. Maybe he could offer some assurances that he’ll be more pleasant to work with going forward. Sure, he can make $15 million if he gets fired. But he can make more than $20 million and potentially quite a bit more if he keeps his job.
When Auburn’s president and athletic director flew to meet with Louisville’s Bobby Petrino while Tommy Tuberville was still the Tigers’ coach in 2003, Tuberville survived the coup attempt, went 12-0 the next season and remained Auburn’s coach until the end of the 2008 season, when he got fired and collected a fat buyout. Herman knows all the stats that were rattled off earlier in this column. He can make a strong case that he’s the safer gamble. And if Herman can turn some of these close losses into wins next season, he could snatch all the leverage. Then he could either graciously take more money or strap the Longhorns over a barrel and laugh as the dollar figures rise.
Del Conte has to decide how he wants to place his bet. Does he wager less money that a coach who hasn’t quite met expectations will finally meet them? Or does he spend lavishly with the hope that a good-but-not-spectacular pool of candidates can produce the coach who finally can get all those damn BBs back in the box?
Herman has a little more time to convince Del Conte to take Option A. And as long as he doesn’t lose to Kansas, he might have a chance. "
The situation involving alma mater “The Eyes of Texas” has calmed down, but it will need to be addressed. The team traditionally stays on the field after games to sing the alma mater, but during the summer a group of athletes — in response to social justice demonstrations across the country — asked the school to replace the song with a tune that didn’t have “racial undertones.” The group also asked that athletes no longer be required to sing the song. At issue is the song’s history. The phrase “the eyes of Texas” was coined by former Texas president William Prather, who was paraphrasing Robert E. Lee, who used the phrase “the eyes of The South are upon you” while president of Prather’s alma mater William & Mary. The song debuted at a minstrel show in 1903. Minstrel shows of the period frequently featured performances by people in blackface.
The edict from the administration was that no one would be forced to sing the song, but teams would be expected to stand respectfully while it is played. Controversy erupted after the loss to Oklahoma when a fan photo of quarterback Sam Ehlinger standing nearly alone as the band played The Eyes of Texas went viral. What the photo didn’t show was that the playing of the song took place nearly 10 minutes after the game had ended because of the presentation of the Golden Hat to the Sooners. That image produced a narrative that Herman had allowed his players to disrespect the song, which many alums — and importantly many donors — consider a cherished tradition.
This placed Herman in a no-win situation. He could have lost the locker room with a hardline stance on the song, and he already faced recruiting repercussions with opposing coaches asking recruits if they wanted to go to a school that would force them to stand for a song they considered racist. Meanwhile, anything but full support for the song angered some influential donors. Two groups had diametrically opposite opinions on the issue, and there simply was no way for Herman to thread the needle.
Del Conte needs to protect his coaches on this front. Whether he keeps Herman or seeks a different coach, he needs to formulate a plan for how the Longhorns will handle the song in 2021 and get out in front of the issue. If Texas makes a change, candidates will want to know how Del Conte intends to defuse this potential bomb. If Texas keeps Herman, he can’t be the face of any decision lest it harm recruiting more than rampant unchecked speculation about Meyer did.
Herman might still be able to help himself here. This has been a trying year, and all this talk of replacing him should leave him humbled. Maybe he could offer some assurances that he’ll be more pleasant to work with going forward. Sure, he can make $15 million if he gets fired. But he can make more than $20 million and potentially quite a bit more if he keeps his job.
When Auburn’s president and athletic director flew to meet with Louisville’s Bobby Petrino while Tommy Tuberville was still the Tigers’ coach in 2003, Tuberville survived the coup attempt, went 12-0 the next season and remained Auburn’s coach until the end of the 2008 season, when he got fired and collected a fat buyout. Herman knows all the stats that were rattled off earlier in this column. He can make a strong case that he’s the safer gamble. And if Herman can turn some of these close losses into wins next season, he could snatch all the leverage. Then he could either graciously take more money or strap the Longhorns over a barrel and laugh as the dollar figures rise.
Del Conte has to decide how he wants to place his bet. Does he wager less money that a coach who hasn’t quite met expectations will finally meet them? Or does he spend lavishly with the hope that a good-but-not-spectacular pool of candidates can produce the coach who finally can get all those damn BBs back in the box?
Herman has a little more time to convince Del Conte to take Option A. And as long as he doesn’t lose to Kansas, he might have a chance. "
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
The Staples piece in the Athletic
Part I
See Part II for the rest
Part I
Now it gets awkward.
Whether Urban Meyer ever was a real option for Texas will drive fan site discussions for the foreseeable future, but we may not get any sort of on-the-record confirmation of whether anything actually happened for years.
It took three years for former Texas regent Tom Hicks to spill any beans about approaching agent Jimmy Sexton about Alabama coach Nick Saban in 2012 (a year before Mack Brown was ousted as the Longhorns’ coach). At the moment, both parties seem content to let everyone else talk about Meyer and Texas without Meyer or anyone from Texas acknowledging the other.
What seems clear at the moment is that Meyer is not an option to be the football coach at Texas in 2021, which might offer some comfort to current Texas coach Tom Herman if the Texas administration would acknowledge that Herman will coach the Longhorns in 2021. Athletic director Chris Del Conte has made clear he isn’t offering a definitive opinion on the direction of the football program until after the season. When that happens is a matter of discussion at the moment. Texas was supposed to wrap its regular season against Kansas on Saturday in Lawrence, but the Longhorns have paused football activity because of several COVID-19 positives on the team. The game might get played Saturday. It might get played Dec. 19. If the virus continues to be an issue, it might not get played.
So Del Conte faces a decision. Does he keep a coach the fan base has abandoned? Or does he write checks that could add up to $30 million to make a change that doesn’t necessarily guarantee anything because there is no Meyer, Nick Saban or Dabo Swinney in the candidate pool?
Texas finds itself in a position similar to the one rival Texas A&M faced three years ago. The Aggies fired Kevin Sumlin, whose record at the school made him one of the most successful coaches in the program’s history, and then-AD Scott Woodward had to land what he called a “rare-air” coach. Woodward determined that he needed a coach with a national title on his résumé, which meant one of four names. Meyer, Saban and Clemson’s Swinney weren’t going anywhere, which left Florida State’s Jimbo Fisher as the only option. “In contractual negotiations, you have leverage or you don’t,” Woodward told me for a story I wrote for Sports Illustrated. “I had zero leverage.” So Woodward offered a fully guaranteed, 10-year, $75 million contract and would have gone higher had Fisher not said yes. Woodward knew there was no Plan B.
The similarities between the situations end at the options. The acting coaches with national titles on their résumés are Fisher, LSU’s Ed Orgeron, Saban, Swinney, Kansas’ Les Miles and, of course, Brown. The first four aren’t moving. Miles isn’t getting hired by any program at that level. And Brown would be terribly complicated — plus he seems very happy back at North Carolina. Meyer, with three national titles between Florida and Ohio State on his résumé, apparently is happy behind the Fox Sports desk. This means if Del Conte wants to make a change, he’ll have to take an expensive leap of faith on someone who hasn’t ever reached the heights Texas donors and fans believe the Longhorns should reach. He would have to spend millions and then turn around and sell the coach to those donors and fans. Or he could keep a coach those fans don’t like anymore but who — based on his record so far — might offer a similar chance of success.
Neither situation is ideal, but at some point in the next few weeks, Del Conte will have to choose. And as he considers, he’ll probably also need to consider some of the institutional factors that have helped bring Texas to this point for the third time in seven years. So let’s examine the issues that will influence the decision.
The Coaches
Herman is finishing his fourth season in Austin, and though his tenure has been better than that of predecessor Charlie Strong, it has included only one Big 12 title game appearance. This year’s team had a chance to make the game but lost it when it blew a fourth-quarter lead against Iowa State and fell 23-20 on Nov. 27.
Herman was the toast of Austin following the 2018 season when the Longhorns reached the Big 12 title game and beat Georgia in the Sugar Bowl, but the backlash against Herman began last season when the Longhorns went 8-5. Losses to College Football Playoff participants by a combined 14 points were understandable, but the Longhorns also lost to TCU (one of three losses to the Horned Frogs in Herman’s four seasons), Iowa State and Baylor. The Longhorns have a significant advantage in the recruiting rankings against those three teams, but Texas hasn’t been able to translate a raw talent advantage into wins — especially against coaches who have proven player-development track records. TCU’s Gary Patterson, Iowa State’s Matt Campbell and former Baylor and current Carolina Panthers coach Matt Rhule fit that description.
Firing Herman now would require a $15 million payoff because of the extension Del Conte gave Herman after the 2018 season. That figure likely would rise above $20 million when factoring in staff buyouts. And that’s before any buyout payments to a new coach’s old school.
Because we’re trying to figure out if changing coaches is worth the price tag, we probably should compare Herman to coaches who might be in the hunt for the Texas job if it opened. So let’s play the blind résumé game using the factors a coach at a program such as Texas should be judged upon.
Coach 1: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .692, Power 5 conference titles: 1, Median recruiting class rank: 11, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 1 (With at least one getting picked in the first round in 2021.)
Coach 2: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .571, Power 5 conference titles: 0, Median recruiting class rank: 5.5, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 0 (With one possibly going in the first in 2021.)
Coach 3: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .500, Power 5 conference titles: 0, Median recruiting class rank: 52, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 0
Coach 4: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .611, Power 5 conference titles: 1, Median recruiting class rank: 15, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 1 (With one possibly going in the first round in 2021.)
So do any of these stand out above the others? Maybe No. 1? What if I told you he has an $8 million buyout and lost to Oregon State and Cal in the past two weeks? Feel differently? No. 1 is Oregon’s Mario Cristobal, who has proven to be an excellent recruiter and roster builder. The question with Cristobal is whether he can avoid losing games his team should win. This has been one of Texas fans’ biggest gripes with Herman, and given the extremely high price, it could be more vexing if the Longhorns hire a coach who does exactly the same thing that currently infuriates the fan base.
No. 2 is Herman, who will cost $5.8 million next year if Texas retains him. One of the more frustrating facts about this Texas season also could be encouraging depending on your perspective. (Especially if your perspective is to try to save some money.)
Yes, the Longhorns have lost three games. But they’ve lost them by a combined 13 points. Turn either the Oklahoma game or the Iowa State game into a win, and Texas is playing for the Big 12 title. But Herman’s personality has turned off people in the Texas administration and donor base. I always say that it doesn’t matter if people like you if you’re 0-12 (You’re fired!) or 12-0 (You’re getting a raise!), but it matters a great deal if you’re in the — depending on the school — six- to eight-win range. Had Herman been the guy who has admittedly been humbled by this year all along, there might be no conversation. He’d definitely be coming back. But that’s not what happened those first three years, and here we are.
No. 3 is Iowa State’s Campbell. His record should be graded on a curve because he inherited a program that went 8-28 the three seasons before he arrived. His recruiting also should be graded on a curve because Iowa State does not have the access to players that Texas does. But this also would be the only question about Campbell. He has worked at Division III Mount Union, at Bowling Green, at Toledo and at Iowa State. He has never had to swim in the recruiting waters Texas must navigate. That doesn’t mean he can’t; it only means there is no data yet.
The other major issue with Campbell is he might not want the job. He probably isn’t leaving Iowa State unless it’s for a situation he considers ideal. For a guy from the Midwest, that might be Michigan should the Wolverines move on from Jim Harbaugh. Also, don’t be shocked if some NFL teams sniff around Campbell. The qualities that have made him fantastic for Iowa State — great evaluation, development and culture building — are the same ones that allowed Rhule to win at Temple and Baylor. Those qualities travel a lot better between levels of the sport than simply being able to collect five-star recruits. If anyone in college or the NFL wants Campbell, it’ll cost a cool $6 million to Iowa State.
No. 4 is Penn State’s James Franklin. It might be tough for Del Conte to sell a coach who lost his first five games this season and is having a tough recruiting cycle in his own state, but what Franklin has done at Penn State remains remarkable considering the situation he inherited. Plus, he did win nine games twice at Vanderbilt. A fun party game is to try to figure out what other college football coaches could do that. Spoiler alert: It’s a short list. Franklin would be expensive, though. On top of likely commanding a higher salary than Herman makes, it would cost $5 million to leave Penn State now. Plus, he already has a really good job.....
Whether Urban Meyer ever was a real option for Texas will drive fan site discussions for the foreseeable future, but we may not get any sort of on-the-record confirmation of whether anything actually happened for years.
It took three years for former Texas regent Tom Hicks to spill any beans about approaching agent Jimmy Sexton about Alabama coach Nick Saban in 2012 (a year before Mack Brown was ousted as the Longhorns’ coach). At the moment, both parties seem content to let everyone else talk about Meyer and Texas without Meyer or anyone from Texas acknowledging the other.
What seems clear at the moment is that Meyer is not an option to be the football coach at Texas in 2021, which might offer some comfort to current Texas coach Tom Herman if the Texas administration would acknowledge that Herman will coach the Longhorns in 2021. Athletic director Chris Del Conte has made clear he isn’t offering a definitive opinion on the direction of the football program until after the season. When that happens is a matter of discussion at the moment. Texas was supposed to wrap its regular season against Kansas on Saturday in Lawrence, but the Longhorns have paused football activity because of several COVID-19 positives on the team. The game might get played Saturday. It might get played Dec. 19. If the virus continues to be an issue, it might not get played.
So Del Conte faces a decision. Does he keep a coach the fan base has abandoned? Or does he write checks that could add up to $30 million to make a change that doesn’t necessarily guarantee anything because there is no Meyer, Nick Saban or Dabo Swinney in the candidate pool?
Texas finds itself in a position similar to the one rival Texas A&M faced three years ago. The Aggies fired Kevin Sumlin, whose record at the school made him one of the most successful coaches in the program’s history, and then-AD Scott Woodward had to land what he called a “rare-air” coach. Woodward determined that he needed a coach with a national title on his résumé, which meant one of four names. Meyer, Saban and Clemson’s Swinney weren’t going anywhere, which left Florida State’s Jimbo Fisher as the only option. “In contractual negotiations, you have leverage or you don’t,” Woodward told me for a story I wrote for Sports Illustrated. “I had zero leverage.” So Woodward offered a fully guaranteed, 10-year, $75 million contract and would have gone higher had Fisher not said yes. Woodward knew there was no Plan B.
The similarities between the situations end at the options. The acting coaches with national titles on their résumés are Fisher, LSU’s Ed Orgeron, Saban, Swinney, Kansas’ Les Miles and, of course, Brown. The first four aren’t moving. Miles isn’t getting hired by any program at that level. And Brown would be terribly complicated — plus he seems very happy back at North Carolina. Meyer, with three national titles between Florida and Ohio State on his résumé, apparently is happy behind the Fox Sports desk. This means if Del Conte wants to make a change, he’ll have to take an expensive leap of faith on someone who hasn’t ever reached the heights Texas donors and fans believe the Longhorns should reach. He would have to spend millions and then turn around and sell the coach to those donors and fans. Or he could keep a coach those fans don’t like anymore but who — based on his record so far — might offer a similar chance of success.
Neither situation is ideal, but at some point in the next few weeks, Del Conte will have to choose. And as he considers, he’ll probably also need to consider some of the institutional factors that have helped bring Texas to this point for the third time in seven years. So let’s examine the issues that will influence the decision.
The Coaches
Herman is finishing his fourth season in Austin, and though his tenure has been better than that of predecessor Charlie Strong, it has included only one Big 12 title game appearance. This year’s team had a chance to make the game but lost it when it blew a fourth-quarter lead against Iowa State and fell 23-20 on Nov. 27.
Herman was the toast of Austin following the 2018 season when the Longhorns reached the Big 12 title game and beat Georgia in the Sugar Bowl, but the backlash against Herman began last season when the Longhorns went 8-5. Losses to College Football Playoff participants by a combined 14 points were understandable, but the Longhorns also lost to TCU (one of three losses to the Horned Frogs in Herman’s four seasons), Iowa State and Baylor. The Longhorns have a significant advantage in the recruiting rankings against those three teams, but Texas hasn’t been able to translate a raw talent advantage into wins — especially against coaches who have proven player-development track records. TCU’s Gary Patterson, Iowa State’s Matt Campbell and former Baylor and current Carolina Panthers coach Matt Rhule fit that description.
Firing Herman now would require a $15 million payoff because of the extension Del Conte gave Herman after the 2018 season. That figure likely would rise above $20 million when factoring in staff buyouts. And that’s before any buyout payments to a new coach’s old school.
Because we’re trying to figure out if changing coaches is worth the price tag, we probably should compare Herman to coaches who might be in the hunt for the Texas job if it opened. So let’s play the blind résumé game using the factors a coach at a program such as Texas should be judged upon.
Coach 1: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .692, Power 5 conference titles: 1, Median recruiting class rank: 11, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 1 (With at least one getting picked in the first round in 2021.)
Coach 2: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .571, Power 5 conference titles: 0, Median recruiting class rank: 5.5, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 0 (With one possibly going in the first in 2021.)
Coach 3: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .500, Power 5 conference titles: 0, Median recruiting class rank: 52, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 0
Coach 4: Winning percentage against Power 5 teams at current job: .611, Power 5 conference titles: 1, Median recruiting class rank: 15, First-round draft picks coached at current job: 1 (With one possibly going in the first round in 2021.)
So do any of these stand out above the others? Maybe No. 1? What if I told you he has an $8 million buyout and lost to Oregon State and Cal in the past two weeks? Feel differently? No. 1 is Oregon’s Mario Cristobal, who has proven to be an excellent recruiter and roster builder. The question with Cristobal is whether he can avoid losing games his team should win. This has been one of Texas fans’ biggest gripes with Herman, and given the extremely high price, it could be more vexing if the Longhorns hire a coach who does exactly the same thing that currently infuriates the fan base.
No. 2 is Herman, who will cost $5.8 million next year if Texas retains him. One of the more frustrating facts about this Texas season also could be encouraging depending on your perspective. (Especially if your perspective is to try to save some money.)
Yes, the Longhorns have lost three games. But they’ve lost them by a combined 13 points. Turn either the Oklahoma game or the Iowa State game into a win, and Texas is playing for the Big 12 title. But Herman’s personality has turned off people in the Texas administration and donor base. I always say that it doesn’t matter if people like you if you’re 0-12 (You’re fired!) or 12-0 (You’re getting a raise!), but it matters a great deal if you’re in the — depending on the school — six- to eight-win range. Had Herman been the guy who has admittedly been humbled by this year all along, there might be no conversation. He’d definitely be coming back. But that’s not what happened those first three years, and here we are.
No. 3 is Iowa State’s Campbell. His record should be graded on a curve because he inherited a program that went 8-28 the three seasons before he arrived. His recruiting also should be graded on a curve because Iowa State does not have the access to players that Texas does. But this also would be the only question about Campbell. He has worked at Division III Mount Union, at Bowling Green, at Toledo and at Iowa State. He has never had to swim in the recruiting waters Texas must navigate. That doesn’t mean he can’t; it only means there is no data yet.
The other major issue with Campbell is he might not want the job. He probably isn’t leaving Iowa State unless it’s for a situation he considers ideal. For a guy from the Midwest, that might be Michigan should the Wolverines move on from Jim Harbaugh. Also, don’t be shocked if some NFL teams sniff around Campbell. The qualities that have made him fantastic for Iowa State — great evaluation, development and culture building — are the same ones that allowed Rhule to win at Temple and Baylor. Those qualities travel a lot better between levels of the sport than simply being able to collect five-star recruits. If anyone in college or the NFL wants Campbell, it’ll cost a cool $6 million to Iowa State.
No. 4 is Penn State’s James Franklin. It might be tough for Del Conte to sell a coach who lost his first five games this season and is having a tough recruiting cycle in his own state, but what Franklin has done at Penn State remains remarkable considering the situation he inherited. Plus, he did win nine games twice at Vanderbilt. A fun party game is to try to figure out what other college football coaches could do that. Spoiler alert: It’s a short list. Franklin would be expensive, though. On top of likely commanding a higher salary than Herman makes, it would cost $5 million to leave Penn State now. Plus, he already has a really good job.....
See Part II for the rest
Joe Fan
10,000+ Posts
Part II
It's in two parts bc it was too long
It's in two parts bc it was too long
The School
As Del Conte examines the situation, he also needs to consider the factors at Texas that could hinder any coach’s success. Mack Brown’s run at the turn of the century obscured the fact that Texas hasn’t been a year-in, year-out superpower for most of its history. Herman is only the third coach in the program’s history — Brown and Fred Akers are the others — to win 25 games in his first three years. And as great as Brown was from 1998-2009 (128-27), the Longhorns only won the Big 12 twice in the period.
For much of the program’s history, the problem has been one of alignment. Darrell Royal compared trying to unite the university’s various factions of administration, donors and football staffers to trying to put spilled BBs back in a box, and it could be argued that only he and Brown have done that — but unfortunately Brown couldn’t keep the BBs in the box.
To understand what great alignment does for a program, look north across the Red River to Oklahoma. From December 1998 to June 2017, that school had one president (David Boren), one athletic director (Joe Castiglione) and one head football coach (Bob Stoops). Boren and Stoops have since retired, but Boren was still in place when Castiglione tapped then-Oklahoma offensive coordinator Lincoln Riley to succeed Stoops. The alignment all the way up the chain has continued unabated. Since Stoops took over, the Sooners have won or shared the Big 12 title 13 times.
Meanwhile, Texas hasn’t been aligned since Brown began to falter in 2010. Athletic director DeLoss Dodds and president Bill Powers were busy pulling strings in conference realignment, and Dodds’ retirement in 2013 brought what might be the single most disastrous hire in Texas athletics history: Steve Patterson, who served a hellish 22-month tenure as athletic director beginning in November 2013. Patterson was supposed to streamline a bloated athletic department but only made it more dysfunctional.
Attorney Mike Perrin stepped in to steady the ship — he wound up firing Strong and hiring Herman — and Del Conte’s charge when he was hired in 2017 was to bring the Texas athletic department into the present. Since 2010, Texas has had three presidents (Powers, Greg Fenves, Jay Hartzell), four ADs (Dodds, Patterson, Perrin, Del Conte) and three head football coaches (Brown, Strong, Herman). That isn’t an environment conducive to alignment, and it should be cause to redirect some of the criticism leveled at Brown, Strong and Herman.
One of Del Conte’s biggest tasks has been combining the Texas men’s and women’s athletic departments, which were separate before his arrival. He also has had to raise money for football capital projects that Texas previously didn’t spend on despite frequently raking in more money than every other athletic program in the nation.
Since 2010, Oklahoma has spent about $235 million on football facilities. Clemson has spent about $165 million. Georgia has spent about $133 million. Texas has spent about $45 million. The current football facility was built in the late 1990s, and the only recent improvements have been a new locker room and a weight room renovation. Compare that to Oklahoma, which opened a 132,000 square-foot facility in 2017. Or compare it to Clemson, where the slide gets all the publicity, but the facility is far less ostentatious and far more functional in person.
Buildings don’t equal success, and they aren’t going to guarantee that the best recruits don’t go to Oklahoma or Alabama, but it makes sense that the school former AD Dodds once referred to as “The Joneses” should at least attempt to keep up with The Joneses. To that end, Del Conte has raised money for a $175 million project that will give the Longhorns essentially a new football facility prior to the 2021 season.
But who will sit in the new head coach’s office? Herman or someone else?
The Choice
One question is whether the runaway speculation about Herman’s job security has neutered his ability to recruit. The Longhorns lost a commitment in late October from top class of 2022 quarterback Quinn Ewers, who quickly flipped to Ohio State. That decision is tough to dispute. The last starting quarterback to leave Ohio State (Dwayne Haskins) was a first-rounder in 2019. The guy Haskins beat out in 2018 (Joe Burrow) transferred to LSU and became the No. 1 overall pick in 2020. Current Buckeyes QB Justin Fields is a likely first-rounder in 2021.
If Herman or any of the potential replacements were better at developing top draft picks, the decision might be easy. To compete for national titles, a program needs to consistently develop first-rounders. Texas hasn’t had a first-rounder since defensive tackle Malcom Brown went No. 32 to the Patriots in 2015. In same period, Alabama has produced 17 first-rounders. Clemson has produced 10. Georgia has produced eight. LSU has produced nine. Ohio State has produced 15. Oklahoma has produced five. That is how programs win consistently, and developing draft picks makes its own gravy by making programs more attractive to recruits.
The Longhorns’ best hope for a first-rounder this year is offensive tackle Sam Cosmi, who opted out of the team’s final two games last week. One selection probably wouldn’t get the Longhorns’ class of 2022 recruiting jump-started, but it would offer some positive momentum. Winning in 2021 would help as well. Much of the in-person evaluation that would have been done for the class of 2022 would have taken place at camps this past summer. If — and that remains a key word — coaches can go on the road and conduct camps in 2021, schools situated near large numbers of quality recruits likely will have an advantage if the world hasn’t returned completely to normal. So Texas should be in better position with nearby players. That could help Herman or someone else.
Del Conte also will need to decide how to handle some thorny issues going forward.
The situation involving alma mater “The Eyes of Texas” has calmed down, but it will need to be addressed. The team traditionally stays on the field after games to sing the alma mater, but during the summer a group of athletes — in response to social justice demonstrations across the country — asked the school to replace the song with a tune that didn’t have “racial undertones.” The group also asked that athletes no longer be required to sing the song. At issue is the song’s history. The phrase “the eyes of Texas” was coined by former Texas president William Prather, who was paraphrasing Robert E. Lee, who used the phrase “the eyes of The South are upon you” while president of Prather’s alma mater William & Mary. The song debuted at a minstrel show in 1903. Minstrel shows of the period frequently featured performances by people in blackface.
The edict from the administration was that no one would be forced to sing the song, but teams would be expected to stand respectfully while it is played. Controversy erupted after the loss to Oklahoma when a fan photo of quarterback Sam Ehlinger standing nearly alone as the band played The Eyes of Texas went viral. What the photo didn’t show was that the playing of the song took place nearly 10 minutes after the game had ended because of the presentation of the Golden Hat to the Sooners. That image produced a narrative that Herman had allowed his players to disrespect the song, which many alums — and importantly many donors — consider a cherished tradition.
This placed Herman in a no-win situation. He could have lost the locker room with a hardline stance on the song, and he already faced recruiting repercussions with opposing coaches asking recruits if they wanted to go to a school that would force them to stand for a song they considered racist. Meanwhile, anything but full support for the song angered some influential donors. Two groups had diametrically opposite opinions on the issue, and there simply was no way for Herman to thread the needle.
Del Conte needs to protect his coaches on this front. Whether he keeps Herman or seeks a different coach, he needs to formulate a plan for how the Longhorns will handle the song in 2021 and get out in front of the issue. If Texas makes a change, candidates will want to know how Del Conte intends to defuse this potential bomb. If Texas keeps Herman, he can’t be the face of any decision lest it harm recruiting more than rampant unchecked speculation about Meyer did.
Herman might still be able to help himself here. This has been a trying year, and all this talk of replacing him should leave him humbled. Maybe he could offer some assurances that he’ll be more pleasant to work with going forward. Sure, he can make $15 million if he gets fired. But he can make more than $20 million and potentially quite a bit more if he keeps his job.
When Auburn’s president and athletic director flew to meet with Louisville’s Bobby Petrino while Tommy Tuberville was still the Tigers’ coach in 2003, Tuberville survived the coup attempt, went 12-0 the next season and remained Auburn’s coach until the end of the 2008 season, when he got fired and collected a fat buyout. Herman knows all the stats that were rattled off earlier in this column. He can make a strong case that he’s the safer gamble. And if Herman can turn some of these close losses into wins next season, he could snatch all the leverage. Then he could either graciously take more money or strap the Longhorns over a barrel and laugh as the dollar figures rise.
Del Conte has to decide how he wants to place his bet. Does he wager less money that a coach who hasn’t quite met expectations will finally meet them? Or does he spend lavishly with the hope that a good-but-not-spectacular pool of candidates can produce the coach who finally can get all those damn BBs back in the box?
Herman has a little more time to convince Del Conte to take Option A. And as long as he doesn’t lose to Kansas, he might have a chance.
As Del Conte examines the situation, he also needs to consider the factors at Texas that could hinder any coach’s success. Mack Brown’s run at the turn of the century obscured the fact that Texas hasn’t been a year-in, year-out superpower for most of its history. Herman is only the third coach in the program’s history — Brown and Fred Akers are the others — to win 25 games in his first three years. And as great as Brown was from 1998-2009 (128-27), the Longhorns only won the Big 12 twice in the period.
For much of the program’s history, the problem has been one of alignment. Darrell Royal compared trying to unite the university’s various factions of administration, donors and football staffers to trying to put spilled BBs back in a box, and it could be argued that only he and Brown have done that — but unfortunately Brown couldn’t keep the BBs in the box.
To understand what great alignment does for a program, look north across the Red River to Oklahoma. From December 1998 to June 2017, that school had one president (David Boren), one athletic director (Joe Castiglione) and one head football coach (Bob Stoops). Boren and Stoops have since retired, but Boren was still in place when Castiglione tapped then-Oklahoma offensive coordinator Lincoln Riley to succeed Stoops. The alignment all the way up the chain has continued unabated. Since Stoops took over, the Sooners have won or shared the Big 12 title 13 times.
Meanwhile, Texas hasn’t been aligned since Brown began to falter in 2010. Athletic director DeLoss Dodds and president Bill Powers were busy pulling strings in conference realignment, and Dodds’ retirement in 2013 brought what might be the single most disastrous hire in Texas athletics history: Steve Patterson, who served a hellish 22-month tenure as athletic director beginning in November 2013. Patterson was supposed to streamline a bloated athletic department but only made it more dysfunctional.
Attorney Mike Perrin stepped in to steady the ship — he wound up firing Strong and hiring Herman — and Del Conte’s charge when he was hired in 2017 was to bring the Texas athletic department into the present. Since 2010, Texas has had three presidents (Powers, Greg Fenves, Jay Hartzell), four ADs (Dodds, Patterson, Perrin, Del Conte) and three head football coaches (Brown, Strong, Herman). That isn’t an environment conducive to alignment, and it should be cause to redirect some of the criticism leveled at Brown, Strong and Herman.
One of Del Conte’s biggest tasks has been combining the Texas men’s and women’s athletic departments, which were separate before his arrival. He also has had to raise money for football capital projects that Texas previously didn’t spend on despite frequently raking in more money than every other athletic program in the nation.
Since 2010, Oklahoma has spent about $235 million on football facilities. Clemson has spent about $165 million. Georgia has spent about $133 million. Texas has spent about $45 million. The current football facility was built in the late 1990s, and the only recent improvements have been a new locker room and a weight room renovation. Compare that to Oklahoma, which opened a 132,000 square-foot facility in 2017. Or compare it to Clemson, where the slide gets all the publicity, but the facility is far less ostentatious and far more functional in person.
Buildings don’t equal success, and they aren’t going to guarantee that the best recruits don’t go to Oklahoma or Alabama, but it makes sense that the school former AD Dodds once referred to as “The Joneses” should at least attempt to keep up with The Joneses. To that end, Del Conte has raised money for a $175 million project that will give the Longhorns essentially a new football facility prior to the 2021 season.
But who will sit in the new head coach’s office? Herman or someone else?
The Choice
One question is whether the runaway speculation about Herman’s job security has neutered his ability to recruit. The Longhorns lost a commitment in late October from top class of 2022 quarterback Quinn Ewers, who quickly flipped to Ohio State. That decision is tough to dispute. The last starting quarterback to leave Ohio State (Dwayne Haskins) was a first-rounder in 2019. The guy Haskins beat out in 2018 (Joe Burrow) transferred to LSU and became the No. 1 overall pick in 2020. Current Buckeyes QB Justin Fields is a likely first-rounder in 2021.
If Herman or any of the potential replacements were better at developing top draft picks, the decision might be easy. To compete for national titles, a program needs to consistently develop first-rounders. Texas hasn’t had a first-rounder since defensive tackle Malcom Brown went No. 32 to the Patriots in 2015. In same period, Alabama has produced 17 first-rounders. Clemson has produced 10. Georgia has produced eight. LSU has produced nine. Ohio State has produced 15. Oklahoma has produced five. That is how programs win consistently, and developing draft picks makes its own gravy by making programs more attractive to recruits.
The Longhorns’ best hope for a first-rounder this year is offensive tackle Sam Cosmi, who opted out of the team’s final two games last week. One selection probably wouldn’t get the Longhorns’ class of 2022 recruiting jump-started, but it would offer some positive momentum. Winning in 2021 would help as well. Much of the in-person evaluation that would have been done for the class of 2022 would have taken place at camps this past summer. If — and that remains a key word — coaches can go on the road and conduct camps in 2021, schools situated near large numbers of quality recruits likely will have an advantage if the world hasn’t returned completely to normal. So Texas should be in better position with nearby players. That could help Herman or someone else.
Del Conte also will need to decide how to handle some thorny issues going forward.
The situation involving alma mater “The Eyes of Texas” has calmed down, but it will need to be addressed. The team traditionally stays on the field after games to sing the alma mater, but during the summer a group of athletes — in response to social justice demonstrations across the country — asked the school to replace the song with a tune that didn’t have “racial undertones.” The group also asked that athletes no longer be required to sing the song. At issue is the song’s history. The phrase “the eyes of Texas” was coined by former Texas president William Prather, who was paraphrasing Robert E. Lee, who used the phrase “the eyes of The South are upon you” while president of Prather’s alma mater William & Mary. The song debuted at a minstrel show in 1903. Minstrel shows of the period frequently featured performances by people in blackface.
The edict from the administration was that no one would be forced to sing the song, but teams would be expected to stand respectfully while it is played. Controversy erupted after the loss to Oklahoma when a fan photo of quarterback Sam Ehlinger standing nearly alone as the band played The Eyes of Texas went viral. What the photo didn’t show was that the playing of the song took place nearly 10 minutes after the game had ended because of the presentation of the Golden Hat to the Sooners. That image produced a narrative that Herman had allowed his players to disrespect the song, which many alums — and importantly many donors — consider a cherished tradition.
This placed Herman in a no-win situation. He could have lost the locker room with a hardline stance on the song, and he already faced recruiting repercussions with opposing coaches asking recruits if they wanted to go to a school that would force them to stand for a song they considered racist. Meanwhile, anything but full support for the song angered some influential donors. Two groups had diametrically opposite opinions on the issue, and there simply was no way for Herman to thread the needle.
Del Conte needs to protect his coaches on this front. Whether he keeps Herman or seeks a different coach, he needs to formulate a plan for how the Longhorns will handle the song in 2021 and get out in front of the issue. If Texas makes a change, candidates will want to know how Del Conte intends to defuse this potential bomb. If Texas keeps Herman, he can’t be the face of any decision lest it harm recruiting more than rampant unchecked speculation about Meyer did.
Herman might still be able to help himself here. This has been a trying year, and all this talk of replacing him should leave him humbled. Maybe he could offer some assurances that he’ll be more pleasant to work with going forward. Sure, he can make $15 million if he gets fired. But he can make more than $20 million and potentially quite a bit more if he keeps his job.
When Auburn’s president and athletic director flew to meet with Louisville’s Bobby Petrino while Tommy Tuberville was still the Tigers’ coach in 2003, Tuberville survived the coup attempt, went 12-0 the next season and remained Auburn’s coach until the end of the 2008 season, when he got fired and collected a fat buyout. Herman knows all the stats that were rattled off earlier in this column. He can make a strong case that he’s the safer gamble. And if Herman can turn some of these close losses into wins next season, he could snatch all the leverage. Then he could either graciously take more money or strap the Longhorns over a barrel and laugh as the dollar figures rise.
Del Conte has to decide how he wants to place his bet. Does he wager less money that a coach who hasn’t quite met expectations will finally meet them? Or does he spend lavishly with the hope that a good-but-not-spectacular pool of candidates can produce the coach who finally can get all those damn BBs back in the box?
Herman has a little more time to convince Del Conte to take Option A. And as long as he doesn’t lose to Kansas, he might have a chance.
I didn’t get the TH extension. A good win against Georgia, but where was he going? At that point he had momentum in one of the top jobs in the country. This year he decided to kill the golden goose. I feel sorry for him to an extent. He is just not that smart. His *** needs to be gone before he does any more damage.
While I agree otherwise that his *** needs to be gone, I don't feel sorry for him. He can wipe his tears with his millions of dollars while seeking help to become less of a prick.
Ha! Then you can say to both of them: "Pay up that money you owe me. You don't want me to have to kick your a$$ again."
I’m trying to keep up Joe but who are these guys and why are they tripling down ... I have seen your prior posts of their tweets but have no clue who they are ... and who is the ace ???
NEW: Pro Sports Forums
Cowboys, Texans, Rangers, Astros, Mavs, Rockets, etc. Pro Longhorns. This is the place.
Pro Sports Forums
Pro Sports Forums
Recent Threads
-
Random Off-Season News
- Started by LonghornCatholic
- Replies: 8K
- On The Field
-
Trouble in Paradise?
- Started by Vol Horn 4 Life
- Replies: 4K
- On The Field
-
Coaching News and Rumors
- Started by Chop
- Replies: 5K
- On The Field
-
Hornfans 2.0 — 10th Anniversary Today
- Started by Dionysus
- Replies: 32
- On The Field
-
Archibald Charles Manning
- Started by LonghornCatholic
- Replies: 128
- On The Field
-
2023 pro football transaction tracker
- Started by orngblud
- Replies: 293
- On The Field
-
Texas High School Football
- Started by LonghornCatholic
- Replies: 703
- On The Field
-
TLSN newsletter #4 Volume IX
- Started by Billy Dale
- Replies: 2
- On The Field
-
Poll: Separate Forums for Pro Sports?
- Started by Dionysus
- Replies: 21
- On The Field
