2020 Presidential Election: let the jockeying commence

Chop said:
I see two types of VP choices:

1. A competent executive/administrator type from somewhere in the middle or middle-left.

2. A political bone throw to the identity politics crowd.

In case Joe wins, then passes away in office, we'd better hope he goes with option 1. A competent (even minimally competent) chief executive is necessary for the country to function properly.
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I think he has made it clear that he's going with Option 2. By announcing that men are off the table, he's already throwing a bone to the identity politics crowd.
 
Mr. Deez said:
I think he has made it clear that he's going with Option 2. By announcing that men are off the table, he's already throwing a bone to the identity politics crowd.
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Or, he has already chosen an Option 1 person, who happens to be female, and he’s taking advantage of that fact.

Or, more likely, he’s choosing someone who balances both considerations. It doesn’t have to be an either/or.
 
NJlonghorn said:
Or, he has already chosen an Option 1 person, who happens to be female, and he’s taking advantage of that fact.

Or, more likely, he’s choosing someone who balances both considerations. It doesn’t have to be an either/or.
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Perhaps, but isn't taking advantage of it the very essence of playing identity politics?
 
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Mr. Deez said:
Perhaps, but isn't taking advantage of it the very essence of playing identity politics?
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To a degree, yes.

I agree with your second statement a couple of posts ago that Biden is throwing a bone to the identity politics crowd. I'm just pushing back on your first statement that "he's going with Option 2". I think it's more accurate to say that he is going with a combination of Option 1 and Option 2.
 
NJlonghorn said:
To a degree, yes.

I agree with your second statement a couple of posts ago that Biden is throwing a bone to the identity politics crowd. I'm just pushing back on your first statement that "he's going with Option 2". I think it's more accurate to say that he is going with a combination of Option 1 and Option 2.
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It's possible, but his statement makes me have a hard time giving him the benefit of the doubt. He said, “If I’m elected president, my cabinet, my administration will look like the country and I commit that I will, in fact, appoint a woman to be vice president.”

Could he have picked a female VP on the merits? Of course, but the fact that he's bringing it up in the context of having a cabinet that "looks like the country" (which is a euphemism for "we're going to make sure there aren't too many straight, white guys in the administration") at least suggests that identity politics is the overriding factor. In all likelihood, a straight, white dude probably had no chance.
 
My guess is Michelle Obama for VP selection.
Total guess.... I’ve heard it on Limbaugh’s show before.
 
AC said:
My guess is Michelle Obama for VP selection.
Total guess.... I’ve heard it on Limbaugh’s show before.
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Because the party of minorities and women undermines minorities and women by pandering with a black woman if they do that. They essentially sat minorities and women are stupid and will blindly vote for Biden because of her.
 
Assuming the virus doesn't get her*, Amy K would satisfy both option 1 and 2. From the potential Dem candidates I've seen, Klobuchar appears to be the most competent executive/administrator type, and she's a standard center-left Democrat. She's also a woman so that takes care of throwing a bone to the identity politics crowd. Frankly, I'd much rather have her than Joe. She's allegedly mean on a personal level**, but she's competent and not senile like Joe, and at the same basic place on the political scale.

*Klobuchar's husband tested positive for the coronavirus.

** Not that Trump's known as a nice guy on a personal level himself...
 
However, there is an intellectually honest way to discuss an issue. It's fair to talk about the other side and to point out their flaws and inconsistencies. However, that is an offensive weapon, not a defensive one. You should be able to defend your own position entirely on its own merit and lead with that defense. If you want to rip on the other side's hypocrisy afterwards, that's fine, but it shouldn't be allowed to work as a diversion from your own flaws.
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Sure, but if I'm going to defend my position when it's accused of having a flaw, I may first want to establish that my opponent really does accept that said element is a flaw. If he actually doesn't, then I don't need to defend that element, at least not to that particular person.
 
horninchicago said:
How old is he? This is good news I would think. Not the death sentence so many say it is.
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Okay, I see he is 52. Not the 60+ critical group, but older nonetheless.

I say that being 51 with the very mildest of symptoms all week. The worst being anosmia and loss of taste since Tuesday. However, I think* my smell and taste are slightly there today as I sip some coffee here!

*Worth what you paid for it.
 
I haven't followed this thread, but those of you who are heavily into this sort of thing, and may still believe in the election system, let me pose some scenarios and whether or not they are even plausible.

I don't think Biden has a chance. He isn't trustworthy, many people consider him a crook (I do), and that he's losing his cognitive abilities. Is there any way the Democrats can get him out of there, and if so, what are the chances of this.

1. Andrew Cuomo. He has ethics issues of his own (see the wikipedia entry and look for the paragraphs dealing with corruption inquiries). He is an excellent speaker and obviously very intelligent. Reminds me somewhat of Bill Clinton. With favorable press, and establishing himself as a leader in the face of the Covid-19 epidemic, he surely is more electable than Biden. Can the Democrat party find a loophole?

2. Hilary. She has a tendency to shoot herself in the foot when she opens her mouth. But if Biden comes to be seen as clearly mentally unfit months down the road, I can see her step forward "to serve the country." And if so, she has enough allies with big pockets and deep state connections to get traction. Especially if the economy falters.

Does anyone here actually believe Joe Biden can win an election?
 
NJlonghorn said:
Or, he has already chosen an Option 1 person, who happens to be female, and he’s taking advantage of that fact.

Or, more likely, he’s choosing someone who balances both considerations. It doesn’t have to be an either/or.
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It was a foregone conclusion long ago that Biden would select female VP. Partly to appease the identity politics crowd and partly to make up for his creepy uncle issues.
 
Musburger1 said:
I haven't followed this thread, but those of you who are heavily into this sort of thing, and may still believe in the election system, let me pose some scenarios and whether or not they are even plausible.

I don't think Biden has a chance. He isn't trustworthy, many people consider him a crook (I do), and that he's losing his cognitive abilities. Is there any way the Democrats can get him out of there, and if so, what are the chances of this.

1. Andrew Cuomo. He has ethics issues of his own (see the wikipedia entry and look for the paragraphs dealing with corruption inquiries). He is an excellent speaker and obviously very intelligent. Reminds me somewhat of Bill Clinton. With favorable press, and establishing himself as a leader in the face of the Covid-19 epidemic, he surely is more electable than Biden. Can the Democrat party find a loophole?

2. Hilary. She has a tendency to shoot herself in the foot when she opens her mouth. But if Biden comes to be seen as clearly mentally unfit months down the road, I can see her step forward "to serve the country." And if so, she has enough allies with big pockets and deep state connections to get traction. Especially if the economy falters.

Does anyone here actually believe Joe Biden can win an election?
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My take:

Hillary: Too much baggage, too many negatives. She'd be like an old re-run that wasn't that great during its first run.

Cuomo: The rising star in the Democratic Party. The man of the hour. He's charismatic, good with the media, and they love him. A much better candidate than Biden. Nobody with a "D" in front of his or her name will win much of the South. The battle is for the Great Lakes States/Upper Midwest, especially Michigan, Wisconsin, and Pennsylvania. My sense is that Cuomo will play at least as well in those areas as Biden, maybe better.
 
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Hillary: Too much baggage, too many negatives. She'd be like an old re-run that wasn't that great during its first run.
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But can Dems resist the jollies of forcing Hillary down our ungrateful throats by kicking Joe to the curb right after he is sworn in so they can install her as POTUS and tell us all to F off?
 
Phil Elliott said:
But can Dems resist the jollies of forcing Hillary down our ungrateful throats by kicking Joe to the curb right after he is sworn in so they can install her as POTUS and tell us all to F off?
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What an angry woman she would be by then. I’m imagining Bill, drooling in a wheelchair in the Oval Office, and Hillary making him watch her with a young intern.
 
I'm happy to share my Texas GOP bonafides if it's needed, but I'd like to say that I have grave reservations about Trump being our president again in 2021. I'd like to the nation to get through this pandemic. And after that, we should focus on an alternative to a Trump second term. If I had a dollar for every influential Texas Republican who agreed with me, I'd run with that money...and win. As it is, I might be up for my local HOA.
 
I just don’t see Joe getting the nomination. I think he is an old school democrat who understands how graft works. But he is losing it mentally as we all do someday. The debates could get as embarrassing as the 92 VP debate.

I bet the DNC puts up Cuomo who will be a big challenge for Trump especially if CoronaVirus is still dominating the news and economy.
 
theiioftx said:
I just don’t see Joe getting the nomination. I think he is an old school democrat who understands how graft works. But he is losing it mentally as we all do someday. The debates could get as embarrassing as the 92 VP debate.

I bet the DNC puts up Cuomo who will be a big challenge for Trump especially if CoronaVirus is still dominating the news and economy.
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And the only reason he would have a chance, Cuomo, is the media would defend his mismanagement of the CV handling in NY and vilify Trump. Do we even need to watch?
 
Cuomo will be an interesting wild-card should he get picked up on a ticket only because the Democrats don't need him to win New York, but he's been in the press more lately (and will continue to be) than Biden for the forseeable future.

But both parties have a large swarth of supporters who moronically believe that their ticket will be filled out with a Vp candidate that is either culled from the field that lost out to the main Presidential nominee, and/or that can geographically make the ticket more attractive to swing states. This has been the case far, far less than the norm for nearly the last century. It's a ******** fallacy propped up by people that think they are somehow insightful to their party.

Cue somebody to give us a few token examples when most of the time, the VP is chosen from neither the previous field or a geographic tipping point. It happens, but it's maybe a 25% exception against a 75% norm, if that. It's a stabilizer and an attractor to be sure, but very rarely chosen from the previous field nor from a "swing state."

All that said, Cuomo being added is an extreme outlier because we don't have a governor on television nationwide everyday for 6 weeks during a crisis. We had a mayor do it once, and we all see what the **** happened to that guy (and I hosted a ******* fundraiser for him 12 years ago). So yeah, this will be an interesting case-study. But Pence, Ryan, Biden, Palin, Lieberman, Cheney, Kemp, et. al. You could argue Kaine was a geographic play given Virginia's tilt. And maybe Edwards for both reasons (the field and the NC play).
 
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