What if it was not the Russians?

OUBubba said:
Funny. And sad.
Kremlin papers appear to show Putin’s plot to put Trump in White House

I'm sure this is lugenpresse.
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And yet, interestingly enough, it is under Biden that they get their pipeline.

Being a "most promising candidate" carries several interpretations, most of which would have no nefarious meaning or undertone. And the report IS correct about upsetting the sociopolitical climate- he pissed some off on each side of the aisle and brought a groundswell of support to eliminate the swamp 'normal' that exists in American politics The first six months of the Hair-Sniffer-in-Chief's term have been an absolute disaster as they try to turn the USA into Cuba or Venezuela (in addition to successfully turning the nation into an international laughingstock).
 
Bubba, if this is your idea of truth then you need to take a long vacation. If it's just your fun-filled troll self to rattle cages then I'd say that long vacation is still advisable. This information is so full of unsubstantiated crap as to be bordering on desperation on the side of the Left to maintain power.
 
bystander said:
Bubba, if this is your idea of truth then you need to take a long vacation. If it's just your fun-filled troll self to rattle cages then I'd say that long vacation is still advisable. This information is so full of unsubstantiated crap as to be bordering on desperation on the side of the Left to maintain power.
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Liberals are cheering on Twitter. Nothing has been proven as of yet but is has to be true because it fits the narrative.
 
bystander said:
Bubba, if this is your idea of truth then you need to take a long vacation. If it's just your fun-filled troll self to rattle cages then I'd say that long vacation is still advisable. This information is so full of unsubstantiated crap as to be bordering on desperation on the side of the Left to maintain power.
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I don't know how true it is. It sounds believable. The russkies are playing the long game. See Solar Winds and things like the Continental pipeline hack. While it's not "state sponsored" it's "state encouraged and protected".
 
SH has learned a little about stories coming out of Russia, Bubba not so much. Funny thing is how Trump put additional restrictions on Russia yet Russia wanted him to be president. He was talking tough on Russia during his campaign. Didn’t Biden lift restrictions on Russia?
 
Monahorns said:
Russia likes to be punished real bad by their daddy. I guess?
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Trump went on to slap sanctions on Russians — not just over election interference, but also over the development of the Nord Stream 2 gas pipeline to Western Europe. Trump also confronted Russian allies and Russian mercenaries in Syria, and armed Ukraine to resist Russian invasion — unlike the Obama-Biden administration, which had refused military aid.

Since taking office, President Joe Biden has lifted sanctions on Nord Stream 2, renewed the NEW Start treaty with Russia for five years, and met with Putin at a special summit in Geneva, where the media praised their warm relations. He declined to meet with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky prior to meeting with Putin, despite Zelensy’s pleas.
 
humahuma said:
SH has learned a little about stories coming out of Russia, Bubba not so much. Funny thing is how Trump put additional restrictions on Russia yet Russia wanted him to be president. He was talking tough on Russia during his campaign. Didn’t Biden lift restrictions on Russia?
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They wanted him in office as it would take us further down relative to the rest of the world. I mean, it's an established fact that they helped him. What is unclear is how much he and his campaign played along.
 
humahuma said:
SH has learned a little about stories coming out of Russia, Bubba not so much. Funny thing is how Trump put additional restrictions on Russia yet Russia wanted him to be president. He was talking tough on Russia during his campaign. Didn’t Biden lift restrictions on Russia?
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To clarify my earlier point, I'm skeptical of this documents authenticity until further verification. I accepted that DJT did not collaborate with the Russian's to ascend to POTUS.

What is not in doubt is that Russian elements worked towards getting Trump in office. Both the fake FB crap (wasn't significant enough to make an impact) but the hacking of Podesta's email then passing of the information on to Wikileaks was much more impactful.

Still, by all know information, specifically the Mueller report that spent millions looking at that question, there was no fire thus the Russian help was simply wind at Trumps wings to assist in the 2016 election.

I'll also point out that Trump was softer in his rhetoric on Putin and matched the various sanctions of his predecessor administrations which have proven fruitless in changing Russia's behavior. At this point Biden has ramped up the rhetoric but the actions have been more of the same as his predecessors.

Still waiting for a major response to Russia's incessant hacking. Something on the level of Stuxnet in Iran seems appropriate. Could it be that our government is so scared of Russia's Cyber capabilities that they are paralyzed to escalate?
 
bystander said:
Guess the Russians didn't like the gift of Crimea or seeing Obama/Biden treat Iran with so much respect.
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We're guessing why Russia preferred Trump. Your guess is as good as mine. The Mueller report didn't delve in the "why" rather they focused on who did what. We have indictments showing who did what.
 
Seattle Husker said:
We're guessing why Russia preferred Trump. Your guess is as good as mine. The Mueller report didn't delve in the "why" rather they focused on who did what. We have indictments showing who did what.
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Yes, that's what we're guessing.

If anyone committed a crime then they should be held accountable. But this kind of stuff from five years ago, with what, no source at all and the words alleged etc... It's raw meat for progressives. They are so arrogant about it all. They will take this as fact.
 
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bystander said:
Yes, that's what we're guessing.

If anyone committed a crime then they should be held accountable. But this kind of stuff from five years ago, with what, no source at all and the words alleged etc... It's raw meat for progressives. They are so arrogant about it all. They will take this as fact.
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Yep, that's what makes this so unfortunate. There are corollaries to the left leaping here to what the right is doing for the "stolen election". Narrative confirming information simply corroborates what is already believed so they people scrutinize the information less.
 
Seattle Husker said:
We're guessing why Russia preferred Trump. Your guess is as good as mine. The Mueller report didn't delve in the "why" rather they focused on who did what. We have indictments showing who did what.
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It isn't much of a challenge if you believe the linked 'leak' given that they knew his election would sow discord within the US. Look at the levels of TDS that were reached not only during his four years, but also in both the run-up to his taking office as well as the six months since he left office.

If the leak is even remotely accurate, the Russians knew that the left would then manage to do substantial damage by destroying American culture and economy from within. And in that respect, they clearly were not wrong. And anyone with have a functioning synapse should be able to discern the damage caused by weakening the United States from within. Unfortunately, the Squad (and their followers) seem not even to have possessed a half of a functioning synapse...
 
mb227 said:
It isn't much of a challenge if you believe the linked 'leak' given that they knew his election would sow discord within the US. Look at the levels of TDS that were reached not only during his four years, but also in both the run-up to his taking office as well as the six months since he left office.

If the leak is even remotely accurate, the Russians knew that the left would then manage to do substantial damage by destroying American culture and economy from within. And in that respect, they clearly were not wrong. And anyone with have a functioning synapse should be able to discern the damage caused by weakening the United States from within. Unfortunately, the Squad (and their followers) seem not even to have possessed a half of a functioning synapse...
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That's the best attempt to absolve Donald Trump of any culpability for his role in our current mess that I've ever seen. Kudos! Let's skip past the trigger event and focus only on the outcome.
 
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Seattle Husker said:
That's the best attempt to absolve Donald Trump of any culpability for his role in our current mess that I've ever seen. Kudos! Let's skip past the trigger even and focus only on the outcome.
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I don't think it absolves him. I think the angle may be this; Trump gave the Left cover to push their agenda under the guise of, "Anyone but him." He made them out to be saviors. Now here's hoping those synapsis are seeing the light. One extreme begats another. The moderates in both parties were swamped. All the while, we had tremendous upheaval in our country and in what I blame 100% on the Left, the sense of pride in our country was cut almost in half. I believe in the foreign theater, a civil war like atmosphere emboldens our enemies. We were unable to come together.

You can blame Trump but I'm not really seeing the extremes in him beyond his personal manner that we saw from The Squad and other groups who snuck in far left-wing policies in an attempt to normalize Marxism, reduce our immigration laws to nothing more than the moral equivalent of the Confederate Flag and the explosion of grievance that was given equal standing to what reasonable people would think and say about the way life really is.
 
Much ado about nothing again. The corporate press has been lieing through their teeth since the beginning. It's been obvious to most for the last year at least.

Who really cares what country wants what candidate to be President? That shouldn't sway American voters one way or the other. We have to vote based on what policies we want implemented in our country. We can't be afraid to vote because what someone other country leader thinks.

What if Xi wanted Biden more than Trump? Does that change you vote SH?
 
nashhorn said:
SH, do you assert AOC and squad are the result of Trump?
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We have always had some element of "extremists" in Congress due to gerrymandering. I struggle with a false equivalency that "the squad" has the same impact as the POTUS. "The Squad" has moderately more influence than their counterparts on the right, Gaetz/Green/Boebert.
 
Seattle Husker said:
We have always had some element of "extremists" in Congress due to gerrymandering. I struggle with a false equivalency that "the squad" has the same impact as the POTUS. "The Squad" has moderately more influence than their counterparts on the right, Gaetz/Green/Boebert.
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Compare the rhetoric of the two extremes with actual policies put in place instead of generalizing.
 
You see, for some reason, being against reparations is possibly now considered extremist; a racist. Not being in favor of sanctuary cities or eliminating ICE. Singing the national anthem or saluting the flag is now considered extremist. Opposition to defunding the police is seen as racist. Not wanting your children to be indoctrinated in the "solutions" put forth by the CRT gambit (remember, they started with white supremacy) is to be racist. All these things are coming from the Left in a very aggressive form. We see how Kazan of SCOTUS mentioned Dredd Scott in an opinion. We see Biden dropping Jim Crow liberally. We see the absolute hatred coming from AOC and others. We see how Beto charmed a bunch of brain-dead white women, masking his extremist views with his skateboarding feminist style.

These people want to transfer wealth and they are ready to circumvent the Constitution to exactly that.

Now we have the "Human Infrastructure" bill pending, which is a vote buying scheme. 100% no doubt about that. Included is talk of amnesty for illegals (some, not all) but no talk about slamming the door on illegal entry and overstaying your right to be here. No. Instead, they pander to the tribe and send the clear signal to those south of us that they will be taken care of. In the face of a horde crossing the border they gas-light it.

Here is their comment about it:

White House maintains that Biden's $4.5 trillion infrastructure bills won't cause inflation to jump

Trump was NOWHERE NEAR AS EXTREME.
 
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Seattle Husker said:
That's the best attempt to absolve Donald Trump of any culpability for his role in our current mess that I've ever seen. Kudos! Let's skip past the trigger event and focus only on the outcome.
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Oh puh-effin-leez...the leftists were whining and pitching a fit before Trump even TOOK OFFICE. They just couldn't believe that Killary didn't win and that the swamp monsters would be exposed for the filth that they were and continue to be. Even worse was that he had the support of more black and brown people than just about any Republican presidential candidate who preceded him. The left just couldn't let that stand.

Enjoy your inflation. Enjoy your increased crime.
 
I don’t blame the Russians for wanting Hillary to lose. It’s what we want our friends and enemies to want. This isn’t complicated.
 
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