Yemen for the Yemenites!
Now that’s something we can all agree on, right?
(maybe 1% of lurkers will get it…)
Israel = the Good Guys in the Middle East; their neighboring states are unsavory and un-trustworthy
- Thread starter Chop
- Start date
Now that’s something we can all agree on, right?
(maybe 1% of lurkers will get it…)
Isn't he in hospice? He has greatly improved his standing over the years just being a good man. He doesn't need to ruin it by reminding the world of how he governed.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
I was pointing out the similarities to the situations and the basic view points leading to those similarities. My point wasn't that everything is the same in every way. There are some important differences too. But that wasn't my point because you already believed that, so I focused on the similarities.
Of course there is a difference between what Hamas did and their view point and what German Jews did and were thinking. You rightly point out that difference. But your statement about me is off the mark.
It remains that in both cases collective guilt was used to justify violence against a large group of people. Israel responds to Hamas' crimes by bombing a city where most people don't like Hamas. Germany committed atrocities against their Jewish population because of the threat the Communists posed. Most of the leaders of the Communist groups were Jewish. In both cases the state punished a large group of people for the sins of a much smaller group.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
This really misses the point comparing WW2 to a 4th generation intra-state conflict. I guarantee you Israel won't end the conflict with what they are doing. It may even make their situation worse.
Egypt and Jordan are willing to fight including loss of life to prevent any Palestinians from getting into their country. That is telling.
Maybe Yemen will take the Palis since Yemen declared war on Israel.
USA must not take any. Enough have already snuck in illegally.
If Palis are so impoverished how do they pay their way to Mexico?
Maybe Yemen will take the Palis since Yemen declared war on Israel.
USA must not take any. Enough have already snuck in illegally.
If Palis are so impoverished how do they pay their way to Mexico?
Ivy League Leftist Terroristic Threat Suspect Arrested
Ivy League student Patrick Dai has been arrested. Dai made a series of terroristic threats, threatening to kill Jews, rape Jewish woman, stab Jews on campus, etc. at Cornell. Just a few of his posts are show below.
Ivy League student Patrick Dai has been arrested. Dai made a series of terroristic threats, threatening to kill Jews, rape Jewish woman, stab Jews on campus, etc. at Cornell. Just a few of his posts are show below.
Ivy League Leftist Terroristic Threat Suspect Arrested
Ivy League student Patrick Dai has been arrested. Dai made a series of terroristic threats, threatening to kill Jews, rape Jewish woman, stab Jews on campus, etc. at Cornell. Just a few of his posts are show below.
Note, this is not the wealthy young entrepreneur, also named Patrick Dai, who founded QTUM.
I suspect he said something unwise in class or in the dorm and then was nearly killed over it by leftists. Thus, he did this action in response to the other action done earlier.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Now, so fooked
Yeah. That conveniently comes up after he's been caught.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
And now a refugee camp. Who cares. Palestinians aren't human, maybe half human, right?
We're going to have to consider charging parents who don't publicly declare their child to be a menace.
It's very simple.
1) If Israel is to be destroyed then that is a non-starter.
2) If #1 is true, then Israel has the right to eliminate the threat against it's citizens.
3) If Hamas continues to hide amongst women and children while taking pot shots at Israel, then the women and children will eventually be killed (HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE) because of Hama's provocation, UNLESS you think Israel should chalk up the death of their own women and children as collateral damage for the cause of Zionism.
Does "By any means necessary" for Israel mean the death of women and children on both sides is acceptable for the existence of the state?
1) If Israel is to be destroyed then that is a non-starter.
2) If #1 is true, then Israel has the right to eliminate the threat against it's citizens.
3) If Hamas continues to hide amongst women and children while taking pot shots at Israel, then the women and children will eventually be killed (HORRIBLE HORRIBLE HORRIBLE) because of Hama's provocation, UNLESS you think Israel should chalk up the death of their own women and children as collateral damage for the cause of Zionism.
Does "By any means necessary" for Israel mean the death of women and children on both sides is acceptable for the existence of the state?
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
At least you admit it now. Israel should have no constraints in killing Palestinians. They are completely forfeit in your mind. The issue isn't human shields or collateral damage. The issue is you don't think Palestinian lives are worth considering. The fact that this won't end Hamas doesn't matter. It doesn't even hurt them. This is actually the reaction that Hamas wanted.
Let me pose a scenario to you. You live on the 3rd story of an apartment building and your parents and siblings live in a similar building across the street. A terrorist organization has an office in the 1st floor of your apartment building and a tunnel runs pat your building and underneath the building across the street. Do you think a government is justified in wiping out you and the rest of your family in order to take out the office and the tunnel? Are you not morally outraged at your own death and that of your own family? What if that government told you to evacuate your homes and go to another facility across the city. You do that but 1 terrorist follows the crowd into the camp. You think it is morally acceptable to drop bombs to wipe out the camp? If so that is a suicidal mind set.
It is like in a hostage situation bombing the building or setting it on fire and shooting any trying to get out. Even if he worked for a hostage gang, no one would agree that doing such would accomplish anything close to justice. A policeman or SWAT would be considered criminals.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
bystander, not sure I completely understand but I think I agree with. For starters, Hamas is not an existential threat to the nation of Israel. They are a terrorist organization engaged in massive amounts of violent crime but they aren't anywhere close to having the capability to threaten the existence of the nation.
Therefore, if you say that Israel has can seek to eliminate them "by any means necessary" then you would also justify Hamas seeking to eliminate Israel "by any means necessary". Only one side has the capability though.
Mona
Again Are you serious?
You, "The issue is you don't think Palestinian lives are worth considering. "
Uh Mona it is Hamas who doesn't think Palestinian lives are worth anything( do you need the link to the Hamas leader saying that?)
AND doesn't think Israeli lives are worth anything.
You admit that, right?
In your scenario, Why would You put your family in danger by living on top of Hamas that You know wants to kill all Israelis?
If after Hamas butchered tortured raped beheaded and murdered innocent Israeli and other nationality citizens And Israel announced it would destroy Hamas so it couldn't happen again AND announced they would be attacking Hamas where they were including hiding under civilian buildings and civilians should leave
2 things
1. Where should Israel attack Hamas?
2. Why wouldn't you as Gazan citizen take Israel's notice?
Again Are you serious?
You, "The issue is you don't think Palestinian lives are worth considering. "
Uh Mona it is Hamas who doesn't think Palestinian lives are worth anything( do you need the link to the Hamas leader saying that?)
AND doesn't think Israeli lives are worth anything.
You admit that, right?
In your scenario, Why would You put your family in danger by living on top of Hamas that You know wants to kill all Israelis?
If after Hamas butchered tortured raped beheaded and murdered innocent Israeli and other nationality citizens And Israel announced it would destroy Hamas so it couldn't happen again AND announced they would be attacking Hamas where they were including hiding under civilian buildings and civilians should leave
2 things
1. Where should Israel attack Hamas?
2. Why wouldn't you as Gazan citizen take Israel's notice?
This man may look like (and be built like) Curly Howard, but he led the defense of his Kibbutz, personally taking out, and driving away, many Hamas terrorists before they could kill the women and children. His oldest son died in one of the shootouts, also armed and trying to defend the Kibbutz with his dad. RIP young Mr. Asher.
Two brave, and well-armed, citizens.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Totally. Many people don't care about the Palestinians: Israel, Hamas, and many American conservatives (but not a majority of even them).
Well in Gaza people don't have any choice about it. Some probably don't know. Some probably do but don't have any other place to go.
1. I admit this is a hard question. I don't really know. I don't think Israel has a good option but maybe a least bad. I think the only justifiable approach is special forces and find the Hamas leaders who live outside of Gaza. If you are going to move civilians into refugee camps, then use different tactics on the target areas.
2. They did and were bombed anyway. That was the tweet I shared. Those people did take the notice and were killed anyway.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Mona
They were killed because Hamas embedded with them.
If YOU can figure out a way for cowardly Hamas to be taken out by Israel without destroying Hamas where they are embedded please share it.
Otherwise Israel must destroy Hamas where they are.
You understand that I know
They were killed because Hamas embedded with them.
If YOU can figure out a way for cowardly Hamas to be taken out by Israel without destroying Hamas where they are embedded please share it.
Otherwise Israel must destroy Hamas where they are.
You understand that I know
When I mentioned, "by any means necessary," I meant it in the vein of stopping Hamas from never again, doing what they did. If they do not do what it takes (whatever theoretical use of force necessary), then they will continue to take potshots (very understated term for their attacks) at Israel. Is Israel to just take it or what?
And if Israel decided their own reprisals are immoral or incapable of stopping Hamas, what can be done? Would you sign a deal with Hamas, ceding land to the Palestinians (including the West Bank if that's what it takes), and be able to trust that the attacks will cease?
I believe they will never cease. So to give up land (that is holy on both sides) and end up right back where we are today, would be insane. Somebody has to make Hamas disband and end the threats against all of Israel. But who would or could do that?
It’s called a mind virus and Hamas has it.
Sum Ting Wong with him.
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