Coronavirus

Will the people who condemned the unvaccinated as selfish monsters ever apologize and admit they were full of crap? Not because they were necessarily right not to get vaccinated but because they weren't really doing anything dangerous to others.
 
Mr. Deez said:
Will the people who condemned the unvaccinated as selfish monsters ever apologize and admit they were full of crap? Not because they were necessarily right not to get vaccinated but because they weren't really doing anything dangerous to others.
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And...we were right not to get it. That's the main thing. Actually, we were right not to get it. Just saying.

I'm glad I was right in not getting it.
 
OUBubba said:
How is that exactly?
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Because I will remain the first authority on my own health, and on those treatments I am or am not willing to undergo.

EDIT: As a sidebar, I also remain the first authority on my financial health, and on those medical/pharmaceutical expenses I am or am not willing to suffer.
 
horninchicago said:
And...we were right not to get it. That's the main thing. Actually, we were right not to get it. Just saying.

I'm glad I was right in not getting it.
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I think some were right, and some (who are now dead) were wrong. However, it's clear that the choice was one for individuals to make for themselves. Those who chose not to do get vaxed were not endangering others more than those who did.
 
Mr. Deez said:
Will the people who condemned the unvaccinated as selfish monsters ever apologize and admit they were full of crap? Not because they were necessarily right not to get vaccinated but because they weren't really doing anything dangerous to others.
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They would respond by saying the unvaccinated were filling up hospital beds and disrupting care for non-Covid patients. That was the real risk, but their actions were inconsistent if not in opposition to that. But the response to these folks is that the Biden admin made no accommodation for age or if you had prior Covid. Further, if what they said was true, why focus on vaccinating school kids? And why not focus on more hospital beds and nurses in hot spots? Trump put up field hospitals. Biden did nothing but forced vaccinations on people who didn’t need it.
 
mchammer said:
They would respond by saying the unvaccinated were filling up hospital beds. That was the real risk. But the response to that is that the Biden admin made no accommodation for age or if you had prior Covid. Further, if what they said was true, why focus on vaccinating school kids? And why not focus on more hospital beds and nurses in hot spots. Trump put up field hospitals. Biden did nothing but forced vaccinations on people who didn’t need it.
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Even this is really weak. That wasn't the rationale they cited at the time.
 
The jab pushers have been reduced to arguing that the jab mostly just keeps you from becoming as sick.

If that's all it does, the risks of side effects are not worth the benefit for the vast, vast majority of people.
 
I think the real number of unvaccinated would be quite surprising, on the high side. It was once a discriminatory question if you recall ‘are you vaxxed’? Not vaxxed and caught it twice, Aug 2020 and June 2022. Please enlighten as to how being vaxxed would have helped me? Reduced symptoms? Don’t buy it. Numerous double vaxxed and some that have boosters still got it and a few were severe symptoms - but died or hospitalized. Also know some of them who have caught it twice like me.
In my large extended family all except one have tested positive at one time. Made no difference in who was vaxxed and not as to symptoms. The young ones that got it showed sniffles one day, older sniffles with fatigue for a few days - vexed and unvaxxed.
So to me, vaxxed or not is your decision but not a medical necessity. I don’t argue against the elderly taking it but I’m 75 so there’s that. I’d say only those of questionable health, diabetes and/or obese, then yeah I’d take it - maybe one.
 
OUBubba said:
The vaccine has shown to be extremely effective at improving morbidity and mortality. I agree that it is an individual decision.
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Serious question. Is there empirical evidence of this? I hear of more people getting sick that are both vaxxed and boosted than I do of those who are not.
 
theiioftx said:
Serious question. Is there empirical evidence of this? I hear of more people getting sick that are both vaxxed and boosted than I do of those who are not.
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Yes. It has been admitted. If you google it, you will find outdated articles from Fall, 2021.
 
That’s my point. And everyone reacts differently to the virus. Not sure there is any concrete proof that it lessens symptoms/severity.
 
mchammer said:
Here’s a long article on the subject that frankly doesn’t really dismiss the claim. At best, vaxxed and unvaxxed get infected at the same rate. Not really a ringing endorsement unless you think getting Covid sends you to the hospital.

Vaccinated People Not More Susceptible to COVID-19 Than Unvaccinated - FactCheck.org
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That is not what that article said. From the article:
The primary purpose of vaccination, though, is to prevent serious illness — and on that front, the data are overwhelmingly clear that vaccination is still quite effective.

“The data generally suggest something like 20-30% efficacy against infection in the omicron era. Not high,” Johns Hopkins University epidemiologist Dr. David Dowdy said in an email. “But protection against severe disease remains strong.”

Indeed, numerous studies have found that there is a small decline relative to earlier variants, but the level of protection against the worst outcomes remains high. CDC analyses, for instance, show that two doses of an mRNA vaccine reduce the risk of hospitalization by 64% four to six months after the last dose, with protection rising to 84% with a booster after the same amount of time. Protection is even higher in the first months following a shot and against critical illness and death.
 
OUBubba said:
That is not what that article said. From the article:
The primary purpose of vaccination, though, is to prevent serious illness — and on that front, the data are overwhelmingly clear that vaccination is still quite effective.

“The data generally suggest something like 20-30% efficacy against infection in the omicron era. Not high,” Johns Hopkins University epidemiologist Dr. David Dowdy said in an email. “But protection against severe disease remains strong.”

Indeed, numerous studies have found that there is a small decline relative to earlier variants, but the level of protection against the worst outcomes remains high. CDC analyses, for instance, show that two doses of an mRNA vaccine reduce the risk of hospitalization by 64% four to six months after the last dose, with protection rising to 84% with a booster after the same amount of time. Protection is even higher in the first months following a shot and against critical illness and death.
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How do you define “getting sick”? It means infection to me. It does not mean serious illness. Read the parts about infection. The writer added the parts about serious illness to confound the reader. The trick apparently worked on you.

Serious question. Is there empirical evidence of this? I hear of more people getting sick that are both vaxxed and boosted than I do of those who are not.
 
But, we were told, and the long standing definition of vaccine has always been, that you would not get covid after getting the shot.

Now, it is supposed to have been that you just wouldn't get AS sick? Please. How does any normal thinking person believe that BS?
 
horninchicago said:
But, we were told, and the long standing definition of vaccine has always been, that you would not get covid after getting the shot.

Now, it is supposed to have been that you just wouldn't get AS sick? Please. How does any normal thinking person believe that BS?
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The flu vaccine doesn’t keep you from getting the flu but provides your body with more tools to fight said flu.

Flu vaccine

How effective is the flu vaccine?
The flu vaccine gives the best protection against flu.

Flu vaccines help protect against the main types of flu viruses, although there's still a chance you might get flu.

If you do get flu after vaccination, it's likely to be milder and not last as long.

Having the flu vaccine will also reduce the chance of you spreading flu to other people who may be more at risk of serious problems from flu.
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mchammer said:
How do you define “getting sick”? It means infection to me. It does not mean serious illness. Read the parts about infection. The writer added the parts about serious illness to confound the reader. The trick apparently worked on you.

Serious question. Is there empirical evidence of this? I hear of more people getting sick that are both vaxxed and boosted than I do of those who are not.
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You go to an internet browser. You click your mouse in the search box. You type “serious illness definition covid-19”. Hit “enter”. It takes you to a variety of links - about 1,030,000,000 of them actually. The first one: Clinical Spectrum | COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines

Basically, in a twitter-worthy summary - if a patient requires oxygen they have a serious condition.

disclaimer: My education was obtained in Oklahoma. You may need to consult with someone smarter.
 
OUBubba said:
The flu vaccine doesn’t keep you from getting the flu but provides your body with more tools to fight said flu.
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It’s called a flu shot. Never in my entire life, ever, and I mean that, EVER, have I heard that called a flu vaccine. Where do you get this stuff from?

You didn’t tell me anything I didn’t already know about the flu shot. So, call the covid shot what it is, a shot. That’s it. And show me the proof that it reduces sickness. You can’t because that is just a guess. No one knows. Just like every year the flu shot is a guess, educated, but guess nonetheless that they maybe have the worst strain of flu for the upcoming season figured out to hopefully, maybe, reduce symptoms.

It’s all crap. Just admit it and let’s move on.
 
Treatment, particularly early has adapted and is much better. But yes, as one would expect it to once millions became vaccinated, the number positives have become higher in vaccinated. I heard but not a necessarily unbiased source hospitalizations we’re higher among vaccinated too but not gonna bet on that.
 
horninchicago said:
It’s called a flu shot. Never in my entire life, ever, and I mean that, EVER, have I heard that called a flu vaccine. Where do you get this stuff from?

You didn’t tell me anything I didn’t already know about the flu shot. So, call the covid shot what it is, a shot. That’s it. And show me the proof that it reduces sickness. You can’t because that is just a guess. No one knows. Just like every year the flu shot is a guess, educated, but guess nonetheless that they maybe have the worst strain of flu for the upcoming season figured out to hopefully, maybe, reduce symptoms.

It’s all crap. Just admit it and let’s move on.
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Do be daft. Key Facts About Seasonal Flu Vaccine
 
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