You still haven't figured out the correlation between a wall and entry points have you? If you really want to listen to experts Hurd isn't the answer. The answer is the people who work on the border who overwhelmingly want a wall.
Can anyone justify NOT having the Wall?
- Thread starter Horn6721
- Start date
You still haven't figured out the correlation between a wall and entry points have you? If you really want to listen to experts Hurd isn't the answer. The answer is the people who work on the border who overwhelmingly want a wall.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
40yr low in illegal immigration.
The recent National threat aessessment barely mentioned the Southern border. The data supports Hurd's POV.
OUBubba
5,000+ Posts
Yeah, those CIA analysts don't know what they're talking about. Very Trumpian of you.
Illegal immigration seems to be on the rise again thanks to a good economy. Stats say the border is a problem but unfortunately this problem is highly politically incorrect which makes it one that nobody wants to tackle. If the intel agencies said it was a problem they would be attacked with multiple calls of racism. It's kind of like how the two biggest problems in the black community are black on black killings and unwed mothers. With me saying this on most sites I would be called a racist and probably banned even though it is the truth. The left instead will go with stuff like racism and police brutality as being the biggest problems which are only minor problems. As I said before the problem with you liberals as a whole is that if a problem or a solution is politically incorrect it can not be true despite all the facts pointing toward it.
Btw, like on most things Trump will be proven correct on this issue. You're being fed crap by the MSM that will turn out to be wrong once again.
The border people who work there know better than the CIA. In time my side will be proven correct and your side will be wrong once again.
Do we really need a list of things our intel agencies have been wrong about the last twenty years? Do we also need a list of the unlawful crap they've pulled against Trump over the last few years? If you people would get out of your MSM bubble your knowledge of the world would get much better.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
I think the best argument to me against a wall and super awesome border security is that when the US truly falls apart or imposes martial law, I don't want all that stuff to keep me in.
Restrict demand for illegals working, require a minimum of years working before allowing access to government welfare, delay voting rights multiple generations, don't count in the census.
I am not being totally serious, but for those of us who are big on the 2nd amendment the argument has some similarities.
Restrict demand for illegals working, require a minimum of years working before allowing access to government welfare, delay voting rights multiple generations, don't count in the census.
I am not being totally serious, but for those of us who are big on the 2nd amendment the argument has some similarities.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Actually, I think the best step would be to disband Federal border organizations and let each state handle it. Why does someone in DC get to decide how Texas regulates its border? Why should Texans have any say in how Minnesota manages its border with Canada?
There would be complications and many new issues would have to be worked out, but I would much rather let California do what they want so that we in Texas can decide what we want to do.
There would be complications and many new issues would have to be worked out, but I would much rather let California do what they want so that we in Texas can decide what we want to do.
Nah
No crisis on our border. So why are Dems lying about Trump being the only one with illegal families being separated and lying about conditions in the detention shelters?
U.S. Border Patrol Southwest Border Apprehensions by Sector FY2018 | U.S. Customs and Border Protection
Southwest Border Migration FY2018 | U.S. Customs and Border Protection
Southwest Apprehensions By Fiscal Year
Total Apprehensions
Sector FY 2018 FY 2017
Big Bend TX 8,045 6,002
Del Rio TX 15,833 13,476
El Centro CA 29,230 18,633
El Paso TX 31,561 25,193
Laredo TX 32,641 25,460
Rio Grande TX 162,262 137,562
San Diego CA 38,591 26,086
Tucson AZ 52,172 38,657
Yuma AZ 26,244 12,847
USBP Southwest Border Total 396,579 303,916
Are people lying about the Caravans of hordes headed here?
Not to mention the drugs coming.
what would be a crisis?
No crisis on our border. So why are Dems lying about Trump being the only one with illegal families being separated and lying about conditions in the detention shelters?
U.S. Border Patrol Southwest Border Apprehensions by Sector FY2018 | U.S. Customs and Border Protection
Southwest Border Migration FY2018 | U.S. Customs and Border Protection
Southwest Apprehensions By Fiscal Year
Total Apprehensions
Sector FY 2018 FY 2017
Big Bend TX 8,045 6,002
Del Rio TX 15,833 13,476
El Centro CA 29,230 18,633
El Paso TX 31,561 25,193
Laredo TX 32,641 25,460
Rio Grande TX 162,262 137,562
San Diego CA 38,591 26,086
Tucson AZ 52,172 38,657
Yuma AZ 26,244 12,847
USBP Southwest Border Total 396,579 303,916
Are people lying about the Caravans of hordes headed here?
Not to mention the drugs coming.
what would be a crisis?
Like I said above if a problem is politically incorrect there's no way it can be a problem to a liberal.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Back to the original topic...
"Crap" = publicly available data and government analysis. OK.
Simply put, the MSM isn't releasing the data or analysis that undercuts your narrative. Maybe you should try to find supporting evidence? Anecdotal stories humanize the problem and whip up emotions but don't denote a "crisis" ad you and Trump are attempting to portray.
Lost in all of this that I just saw on Neil Cavuto's program is that LEGAL immigration is up at record levels. This is in spite of the fact that dictator Trump apparently hates all immigrants and will do everything he can to prevent and end all immigration.
What a failure he is.
What a failure he is.
Available data? Look at what 6721 put up above. Every thing points to a bad situation at the border. Democrats not that long ago were saying saying the same thing Trump is currently saying until they figured out that they wanted to take advantage of the situation(potential votes). Time will prove you wrong.
Edit- Government analysis? The government workers at the border say there is a crisis and they are the ones closest to the problem. Why do you completely ignore what they are saying?
Last edited:
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Look a little further back in history to get some context. Between 1990 and 2006 only 2 years did alien apprehensions dip below 1M. Massive investments in Tech, manpower and barriers have helped drop those numbers to near historical lows. So, a 30k uptick in year over year apprehensions is a blip, not a crisis.
It's a lot more than apprehensions. Drugs and other crime are a major problem. According to DOJ stats, Illegals are roughly 3-5 percent of the population but are committing 20 percent of all crime. Like I said keep ignoring the real experts on the border who know what they are talking about.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Link?
Drugs that come in through ports of entry? We agree.
Which experts? Trump? The recommedations by border patrol agents should absolutely be considered. Like teacher unions, just because they want doesn't mean we can afford. You still haven't established anything remotely resembling a crisis, despite some admirable attempts.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Uh, I'm not the one claiming illegal immigrants are a major source of crime. That's your side counselor. Data I posted a while back showed illegal immigrants commit crime at or slightly less a rate than citizens.
Eh, no big deal. He'll be proven wrong in time as usual.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Proven wrong about what? Don't you have you define and support position first?
I don't know why I'm wasting my time but here you go.
DOJ: 26% of Federal Prisoners Are Aliens
Do you know the better the walls you have the more the criminals will go through ports where we can catch them? Unfortunately, there are many places without walls where they go right across carrying the drugs.
LOL! Keep ignoring the facts.
We conservatives here already have. You haven't learned a damn thing from arguing with us over the last few weeks, have you? If I had your track record on accuracy I'd keep my trap shut but that's just me. You do you.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
You state this...
Then support the claim with this. Do you always claim apples are oranges? The latter study by a partisan organization is interesting and deserves more discussion when i have more time.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
If you were me you might actually call an apple an apple rather than throw crap against the crap against the wall and claim its a fruit basket.
This is why I don't bother giving links to you. Did you even read the article?
SH
"Data I posted a while back showed illegal immigrants commit crime at or slightly less a rate than citizens."
Uh NO you did not post any data showing that at all. NOT even close.
You can't just post crap and think you will be believed.
What you might have posted is that LEGAL immigrants commit crimes at the same or lower rate than Americans.
If You can provide a credible link showing illegals commit crime at a lower rate than Americans Please do.
"Data I posted a while back showed illegal immigrants commit crime at or slightly less a rate than citizens."
Uh NO you did not post any data showing that at all. NOT even close.
You can't just post crap and think you will be believed.
What you might have posted is that LEGAL immigrants commit crimes at the same or lower rate than Americans.
If You can provide a credible link showing illegals commit crime at a lower rate than Americans Please do.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Yes. Quote the passage on the article that supports your statement, please. You have a chance to claim victory. Clearly my reading comprehension skills are questionable. Quote it.
You mean like the Iraq WMD?
Here we go. I see what you're trying to do and I'm not going to play your game of semantics. 20% of criminals in federal prisons are illegal aliens are they not?
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Here is a study by the libertarian Cato institute: Criminal Immigrants in Texas: Illegal Immigrant Conviction and Arrest Rates for Homicide, Sex Crimes, Larceny, and Other Crimes
Another by the Journal of Criminology that analyzed links between undocumented immigration and crime.
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