2024 Presidential Election: let the jockeying commence

Hollandtx said:
I'm not for stricter limits in the future. Republicans will lose on that ruling alone for many female voters, especially as the young voters now grow older, and young, even more liberal kids come of voting age.

I'm sorry if I'm misunderstanding your post- I was up the past 2 nights with my dog, who was very sick. He's fine now, but my brain is kind of fried.

My thought is that Rs need to be flexible soon, as in the next election.
Not super drastic, but some of the rules now are very strict. No abortion in the case of rape?
I don't think any women coming up will "get used" to those kind of abortion bans, unless they are the crazy, "abortion up until 8-9 months" type.

Women are incredibly angry about this, and most think it is a right. As a woman, with many woman friends, i can't recall a time when they were so determined to not give up on an issue. The whole "my body, my choice", and they don't understand the Roe v Wade decision

Many also don't understand, or if they do, think it very unfair that it is left up to each state.
Maybe that needs to be explained in more detail.
I think the Rs must make some small concessions sooner rather than later to win back some of the female vote. We need them.
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Yet GOP won more house votes and house seats than Dems. I think the issue naturally regresses to background noise.
 
I think with a rape if it is reported early and something is done about it, you really don't know if the woman was ever pregnant or not. Therefore, there is some gray zone.
 
guy4321 said:
If it's okay to get an abortion due to rape, it should be okay to get an abortion for other cases. Otherwise, you are saying the baby is worth less than the mother's well-being in the first case but worth more than the mother's well-being in the second case.
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that is a sticky issue but I would respond this way. It is ok for me to shoot someone in war but not in peace. It is ok for me to shoot someone who is threatening my life/safety but not if they are not a present danger. Context matters. And while we would all want to stop all rapes, it is not a reality. I'm of the opinion that we hold people responsible for their own decisions. A woman doesn't choose to be raped so it was not her decision to have the sex that led to the pregnancy. While it is not a perfect solution, I say that a rape is one of the few situations where is should be permissible.

I've said here many times before. If the GOP goes hard at very strict abortion controls then they should go just as hard at providing FREE contraceptive services.
 
BOSD
I agree with your premise of abortion for rape victims. As you pointed out they did not choose to be raped.
Free contraception products? Other than rape sex is a choice for men and women. With choice comes responsibly. People have too long used abortion as birth control.
In practicality birth control is free for many and dirt cheap for the rest
But Gee it is so tiresome to use.:rolleyes1:
 
Horn6721 said:
BOSD
I agree with your premise of abortion for rape victims. As you pointed out they did not choose to be raped.
Free contraception products? Other than rape sex is a choice for men and women. With choice comes responsibly. People have too long used abortion as birth control.
In practicality birth control is free for many and dirt cheap for the rest
But Gee it is so tiresome to use.:rolleyes1:
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In my opinion, the consequences of limiting abortions can be very bad as well. Let's face it.... making abortions hard will make/encourage some people to behave responsibly BUT it will not get all people making smart choices in the heat of the moment. There will always be people who don't buy car insurance, there will always be people who drive around for months on the donut, there will always be people that are penny wise and pound foolish and there will always be people that really can't afford reliable contraceptives. BUT they are all going to have sex anyway. Bank on it.

If contraceptives were free then that would blunt much of the lefts criticism that it is unfair to poor and POC.

Also, the ramifications for society are dramatic for unwanted/unplanned births. Handing a young mother a newborn that she didn't really want, didn't plan for and doesn't have money to raise, is a recipe for an uneducated, undisciplined child that has a significantly higher probability of being a ward of the state at some point in the future, and at fantastically higher expense than $800 for an IUD or shots or whatever.
 
Way too early, but...

Presidential candidates, 2024

Potential Candidates:
DEMOCRATS:
(Likely runners Big and in Bold--per my opinion)

Democratic politicians
Independent politicians
Democratic business executives and public figures
 
Potential Candidates:
Presidential candidates, 2024
REPUBLICANS:
(Likely runners Big and in Bold--per my opinion)

Republican politicians
Republican business executives and public figures
 
Newsome may be the Dems best shot if Biden can't handle another campaign. Klobuchar, Landrieu, or Manchin (will never be nominated) would be my favorite Dem candidate. But the Dem primary system won't let a moderate get through this round I think... Also, Klobuchar, while an intelligent leader and sometimes a compromiser who gets things done, has the television charisma of a frozen block of ice.

For the GOP, DeSantis looks the strongest right now. But Trump has his own cult that isn't going away anytime soon. Pompeo would be my favorite GOP candidate--he's ready day one for the foreign policy challenges, and unlike most of the people on these lists, he doesn't kiss Chinese a$$. In fact, he has been a strong and consistent critic of the CCP. Pompeo's intellect would also shine on the debate stage, and like Trump, he's something of a bully--although, unlike Trump, he knows when it's time to shut up (or to just stay silent) to his own advantage.
 
BrntOrngStmpeDe said:
that is a sticky issue but I would respond this way. It is ok for me to shoot someone in war but not in peace. It is ok for me to shoot someone who is threatening my life/safety but not if they are not a present danger. Context matters. And while we would all want to stop all rapes, it is not a reality. I'm of the opinion that we hold people responsible for their own decisions. A woman doesn't choose to be raped so it was not her decision to have the sex that led to the pregnancy. While it is not a perfect solution, I say that a rape is one of the few situations where is should be permissible.

I've said here many times before. If the GOP goes hard at very strict abortion controls then they should go just as hard at providing FREE contraceptive services.
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I realize we are in the 2024 thread so this'll be my last comment on abortion here. War and threats would be an equivalent argument if the rapist was the one eligible to be aborted. I'm aware the GOP will lose voters for restricting abortion in rape cases. I'm just pointing out it's always a person getting killed or never. It can't be a person when created by passionate lovemaking but not a person when a product of rape.
 
guy4321 said:
I realize we are in the 2024 thread so this'll be my last comment on abortion here. War and threats would be an equivalent argument if the rapist was the one eligible to be aborted. I'm aware the GOP will lose voters for restricting abortion in rape cases. I'm just pointing out it's always a person getting killed or never. It can't be a person when created by passionate lovemaking but not a person when a product of rape.
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The GOP won't just lose a few voters if they take this stance. They will lose a ton of voters. The position you describe loses to the tune of 80% of voters. If the GOP were ever to come out with that as their actual platform, you would see an 6-8% swing in how most elections went. That stance would give the Dem's 60% house, a 60% Senate and the POTUS. They would steamroll us on EVERY issue.
 
BrntOrngStmpeDe said:
The GOP won't just lose a few voters if they take this stance. They will lose a ton of voters. The position you describe loses to the tune of 80% of voters. If the GOP were ever to come out with that as their actual platform, you would see an 6-8% swing in how most elections went. That stance would give the Dem's 60% house, a 60% Senate and the POTUS. They would steamroll us on EVERY issue.
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Truth isn't popular. I guess we should live by lies.
 
Monahorns said:
Truth isn't popular. I guess we should live by lies.
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The only way I can begin to justify it is baby steps. Get rid of abortion on-demand first. Then get rid of abortion under these "necessary evil" cases. Abolitionists didn't get slavery overturned in a single piece of legislation or year. First, they convinced Americans to ban the trans-Atlantic slave trade then later they convinced Americans to ban slavery of blacks born in the US.
 
guy4321 said:
The only way I can begin to justify it is baby steps. Get rid of abortion on-demand first. Then get rid of abortion under these "necessary evil" cases. Abolitionists didn't get slavery overturned in a single piece of legislation or year. First, they convinced Americans to ban the trans-Atlantic slave trade then later they convinced Americans to ban slavery of blacks born in the US.
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Exactly. Abortion is an issue I care about but I'm not willing to concede congressional seats and the POTUS to die on the single hill of abortion. There are scores of other issues that matter just as much. If the GOP goes anywhere near "no exceptions" as a policy, then we have just handed the Dem's all the power to decide ALL of the issues.
 
BrntOrngStmpeDe said:
Exactly. Abortion is an issue I care about but I'm not willing to concede congressional seats and the POTUS to die on the single hill of abortion. There are scores of other issues that matter just as much. If the GOP goes anywhere near "no exceptions" as a policy, then we have just handed the Dem's all the power to decide ALL of the issues.
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The wise thing to do is let the issue sit for a while. Striking down RvW was a huge step. Now states can set laws to restrict abortions without Federal interference. If you want to include exceptions great.
 
lkainer said:
I've read a few online descriptions and still don't understand. Kind of like bitcoin or aggy.
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they are the beany babies of 2020's. Somebody somewhere wrote a silly article about their value and a group of knuckleheads wanted to be first so they started a land rush. Problem will be just like beany babies....they got there first but they ended up in a place that no one else wanted to follow.
 
Mr. Deez said:
Serious question. What the hell is a "digital trading card?"
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Probably the same thing as a trading card online.

Here's one, from the Internet:

41zDPF1VtyL._AC_.jpg
 
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