2020 Presidential Election: let the jockeying commence

[Garmel]

Man, if people who would normally vote (R) are more bothered by Trump's so-called behavior than Biden's incoherence and the Dems non-condemnation of and seeming embracing of BLM and riots etc., the country really is on a downward spiral and will soon be lost.

That's why i don't buy into the "Trump is destroying the republican party" stuff. The democrats are 10x worse.

 

[Monahorns]

Garmel, it isn't about reality. It is about perception. Most people are dumb. They watch ABC and hear how awful Trump is. Even when Biden does or says something awful, the media portrays him as a good guy or misunderstood. People don't question the narrative, so they dislike Trump.

Trump has done creepy stuff. There is now the story about his comments about the beauty pageants. Biden publicly gropes young girls on camera. But you have only seen that if you are watching BlazeTV or other conservatives on social media. But of course everyone who is a conservative on social media has been labeled an extremist for at least 5 years.

"Nice" people don't want to agree with extremists. The Overton Window is so skewed to the Left that to think "acceptable" thoughts, you have to be a moderate Democrat or a RINO at the very far right. RINOs are basically closeted Leftists. Voila. Suburban Karen who voted for Bush now can't imagine voting for Trump. But Biden the groper and sexual harasser is a "good" guy according to the Cathedral.

 

[Mr. Deez]

That's why i don't buy into the "Trump is destroying the republican party" stuff. The democrats are 10x worse.

Destroying? No. Making our job a lot harder in the suburbs? Yes.

 

[Garmel]

Destroying? No. Making our job a lot harder in the suburbs? Yes.

The suburbs have been turning more blue for decades and the rural areas are turning more red. The suburbs are part of the new age college idiots. I don't think we can get them back completely unless we run a RINO but if we did that conservatives in the rural areas would stay home. We also seem to be gaining ground with union workers and people of color.

Edit-The only reason why this election will be close is due to the coronavirus and the collapse of the economy. If not Trump would have won in a landslide and he still might.

 

[nashhorn]

Correction, the only reason this election will be close is many will be scared that if trump wins there will be rioting in the streets, serious rioting by serious lunatics. Saddest part of that extreme statement is I am not kidding. I have heard such comments from many normally lucid people. They are genuinely scared of what is happening.

 

[Mr. Deez]

The suburbs have been turning more blue for decades and the rural areas are turning more red. The suburbs are part of the new age college idiots. I don't think we can get them back completely unless we run a RINO but if we did that conservatives in the rural areas would stay home.

The suburbs have been trending blue for a long time. However, it's a matter of degree, and we can't afford to write them off. In the 1980s, the suburbs were red across the country. In the 1990s, they were purple in the Northeast and West Coast and red everywhere else. In the 2000s, they were blue in the Northeast and West Coast, purple in a few areas like Colorado, Illinois, and Virginia and red everywhere else. When Trump entered the picture, those purple areas went blue, but the red areas stayed red.

I don't think you need a RINO to stop the bleeding. I think that Trump could do so if he generally acted like he does in the SOTU and at Mount Rushmore. Honestly, I didn't think he'd be good at big speeches, but he really is. That may be a superficial issue to you, but I agree with Monahorns that these people aren't actually that smart. They are easily swayed by superficialities and subjective feelings. Is it all of them? No, but it's enough to make a difference. We saw the evidence for that in 2018.

We also seem to be gaining ground with union workers and people of color.

With union workers, yes. However, we haven't really tested this with POC yet. We're about to in November. The problem is that these voters aren't necessarily where we need them to be. Let's suppose we gain with unions and pick up some points with POC. That could solidify Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin and might tilt Minnesota. However, if they're offset with suburban losses, we risk Texas, Georgia, and Arizona, which don't have many union voters.

Edit-The only reason why this election will be close is due to the coronavirus and the collapse of the economy. If not Trump would have won in a landslide and he still might.

This is a bit of an "if my grandmother had balls she'd be my grandfather" issue, so it may not be worth talking about. However, the 2018 election and the polling data going into 2020 didn't suggest a landslide. They suggested a nail-biter.

 

[Joe Fan]

 

[Garmel]

we gain with unions and pick up some points with POC. That could solidify Ohio, Pennsylvania, Michigan, and Wisconsin and might tilt Minnesota. However, if they're offset with suburban losses, we risk Texas, Georgia, and Arizona, which don't have many union voters.

Yes, but you're forgetting that rural areas are turning even redder. That's why the suburb's turning bluer hasn't killed us over the decades. Trump's also showing better support among latinos which will also help.

 

[Mr. Deez]

Yes, but you're forgetting that rural areas are turning even redder. That's why the suburb's turning bluer hasn't killed us over the decades. Trump's also showing better support among latinos which will also help.

But isn't there a tipping point on this? There are far more people in suburbs than in the rural areas. At some point we have to start caring about them again. Like I've said for years, we need to start putting effort into advocacy and persuasion. Don't accept that they're gone for good. They'll never be as culturally conservative as rural areas are, but we need to persuade them to at least generally go our way. If we don't, we're in trouble long term.

 

[Garmel]

But isn't there a tipping point on this? There are far more people in suburbs than in the rural areas. At some point we have to start caring about them again. Like I've said for years, we need to start putting effort into advocacy and persuasion. Don't accept that they're gone for good. They'll never be as culturally conservative as rural areas are, but we need to persuade them to at least generally go our way. If we don't, we're in trouble long term.

Yes, but it hasn't been a 1:1 gain/loss. The loss from the suburbs has not been as much as the gains from the red rural areas over the pass few decades. The exception was the 2018 midterms but I think many will come back. There were articles before the plague that said bout 80% of the suburban voters that went anti-Trump in 2018 were coming back in 2016. I don't know about now but there's still a good chance this will happen, I agree that we shouldn't give up on them and should keep hammering them but I don't think they're going to be with us like they were in the past.

 

[Joe Fan]

Rush Limbaugh said today, in light of recent events, Trump should re-launch his 2020 campaign --

“All of the language should revolve around a singular promise: to preserve the American way of life ... ”​

Good platform? Enough to keep control?
Here is the Michael Goodwin/NYPost article which he was referring to --
https://nypost.com/2020/06/23/trump-can-recover-from-this-goodwin/
And here is the essay Goodwin was referring to, written by Thomas Klingenstein/Claremont Institute in The American Mind called "Preserving the American Way of Life"

What is the American way of life that Republicans should want to preserve? It would not be difficult to reach a consensus on this question among Republicans. They want to preserve, and in some respects recover, what Americans thought was the right way of life until a generation or two ago.
…
Although we understood ourselves as individualistic, we believed that happiness (a worthy life) requires doing good in this world. And so volunteerism and sacrifice for the common good was highly valued and publicly honored. This meant more than voting and obeying the law: it meant serving in the military and participating in civic organizations, local government and political parties, and teaching one’s children what it meant to be a responsible citizen. For most people, happiness was found in family, church and community.​

Preserving the American Way of Life

 

[Horn6721]

Kayleigh was just asked about Vindman's retirement yesterday.
She said she would not comment on a junior member's retirement.
Junior

 

[huisache]

What bothers me as much as the looting and rioting and the look the other way attitude of so many is the way otherwise sane people look the other way when confronted daily with evidence of President Bone Spur’s mental illnesses

sane people don’t act like this

 

[Garmel]

Bipolar, depression, schizophrenia, etc? What mental illness is he suffering from? Trump's an odd guy that has senior moments on occasion but he's not mentally ill.

 

[4th_floor]

What bothers me as much as the looting and rioting and the look the other way attitude of so many is the way otherwise sane people look the other way when confronted daily with evidence of President Bone Spur’s mental illnesses

sane people don’t act like this

Trump can be nasty, but I see no evidence of mental illness. Considering the hourly attacks on everything Trump has said and done in his entire life, I actually think he is behaving sanely. I think I would be trying to put a hit on several people under similar conditions. When similar attacks reached a crescendo, GWB went into hiding for about 3 years. That didn't work well for Bush. Trump has learned that you have to fight back. He does that well, but doesn't know when to stop.

 

[Mr. Deez]

Yes, but it hasn't been a 1:1 gain/loss. The loss from the suburbs has not been as much as the gains from the red rural areas over the pass few decades. The exception was the 2018 midterms but I think many will come back. There were articles before the plague that said bout 80% of the suburban voters that went anti-Trump in 2018 were coming back in 2016. I don't know about now but there's still a good chance this will happen, I agree that we shouldn't give up on them and should keep hammering them but I don't think they're going to be with us like they were in the past.

We'll see. Obviously the Democrats' nuttiness is the biggest factor. They can scare suburbanites back to Trump.

 

[Garmel]

We'll see. Obviously the Democrats' nuttiness is the biggest factor. They can scare suburbanites back to Trump.

Yep. If the moderates who make or break elections can't see what's going on then we're ******. How anybody can look at a Marxist, domestic terrorist organization like BLM and not be appalled is beyond me. Please don't go libertarian this time, Deez. Western civilization is on the line and I'm not exaggerating.

 

[theiioftx]

^^^^times a billion.

 

[Horn6721]

But what can we pretty normal people do
except vote?

 

[horninchicago]

But what can we pretty normal people do
except vote?

It's very pesky being a law abiding citizen, isn't it?

 

[Mr. Deez]

Yep. If the moderates who make or break elections can't see what's going on then we're ******. How anybody can look at a Marxist, domestic terrorist organization like BLM and not be appalled is

What makes this hard is that large numbers of moderates basically accept the narratives told to them by the political media. They might recognize that the New York Times and similar outlets tend to lean liberal, but they don't believe they would blatantly lie or push an entirely fraudulent narrative. Think our token Sooner. To them, it really is just about police brutality. Furthermore, because they constantly hear about it when the police kill a black guy and never hear the actual numbers, they assume police racism is a big problem. Since the media largely dismisses the statue stuff and Antifa, they largely dismiss it as well.

It's possible to get around this, but you need people who speak over the media and do so with authority and credibility. Reagan was a master of this. Newt Gingrich could do it at times, but his platform wasn't big enough. Bush did it from time to time. Trump can do it when he's disciplined, but he does a lot to damage his credibility as well.

Please don't go libertarian this time, Deez. Western civilization is on the line and I'm not exaggerating.

I'm not sure what I'll do, but Western Civilization is in trouble either way. If Trump wins, the freakout will continue. If Biden wins, it'll dissipate some in the immediate term, because some of this is just about partisan politics and getting rid of Trump. However, long term, it'll pick back up as soon as something crazy happens again.

 

[Joe Fan]

Is he wrong?
I am not going to argue with him

 

[Joe Fan]

 

[Joe Fan]

 

[huisache]

the dems have a vocal minority that is hard left but most of us are pro capitalist and pro law and order. The last time I saw as much anti commie hysteria was in the early 60s when Birchers were claiming Ike was a commie, Kennedy was a commie, LBJ was a commie, etc. Look it up.

Things got so paranoid that I recall one right wing radio guy at the time warning conservatives to not be taken in by "that Episcopalian Jew, Barry Morris Goldwasser."

Direct quote.

And the liberal media is biased and distorted but no more so than the fear peddlers like Limbaugh and Hannity

 

[Garmel]

But Western Civilization is in trouble either way. If Trump wins, the freakout will continue. If Biden wins, it'll dissipate some in the immediate term, because some of this is just about partisan politics and getting rid of Trump. However, long term, it'll pick back up as soon as something crazy happens again.

I can deal with the daily freakout. I can't deal with people like AOC manipulating Biden into pushing radical stuff upon America,

 

[Phil Elliott]

Deez, I agree about people accepting what the media tells them, however, the ratings suggest that less and less people are listening to them in the first place.

 

[Mr. Deez]

I can deal with the daily freakout. I can't deal with people like AOC manipulating Biden into pushing radical stuff upon America,

I think the daily freakout is worse, because in time it makes what we consider radical no longer appear so. With the daily freakout, you might have AOC in the White House herself in ten years.

 

[Garmel]

I think the daily freakout is worse, because in time it makes what we consider radical no longer appear so. With the daily freakout, you might have AOC in the White House herself in ten years.

It'll be way worse if these radicals get control of the White House because they can and will move much faster in their destruction of America. Radicalism will grow faster if in control, not slower. Say goodbye to the 1st and 2nd amendments.

 

[Joe Fan]

Some good news for a change --
if Biden wins, I will be on the Board of Burisma and am getting Billion$ from China