VY Arrested Again for DWI

Back in the day Mr. Holt woukd get you a reduced fine of imprudent driving. With a bit of dinero, of course.
I wonder if any of you can connect with this?
 
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moondog_LFZ said:
As a sober person (32 years now) I can tell you that the alcoholic/drug addict asks themselves this question every sick, hung-over morning.
"Why do I keep doing this?"
It's part of the insanity of the disease.
There's no explaining it.
Some finally reach a bottom and seek help.
Sometimes the judicial system intervenes.
Many end up in prison or graveyards.
Hopefully VY finds his way into treatment.
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I'm 14 years sober now and I agree 100% with what you state. Those who do not suffer from the illness that we do will not and cannot understand. "Why not just quit of just don't drink so much? " they will ask. Vince needs help for an illness he cannot control with willpower. That help can be found very near the front of a phone book for those who still know what a phone book is.
 
Are we uniquivocally saying that Vince Young is an alcoholic?

I don't know if he is or isn't, but I don't have enough proof to declare him as one.
 
Chinstrap said:
Back in the day Mr. Holt woukd get you a reduced fine of imprudent driving. With a bit if dinero, of course.
I wonder if any of you can connect with this?
Click to expand...
At the moment, there STILL is no charge that has been filed. An arrest occurred and bond was posted. The ONLY other entry in Fort Bend is an appearance date for May 31st.

I strongly suspect, especially given the current tenor of that jurisdiction following the last election, that, if ANY disposition occurs that was not a straight dismissal on May 31st, there will be a diversion program placement that results in zero conviction at any level for this allegation of conduct following a 90-120 day period of time...
 
LonghornCatholic said:
Are we uniquivocally saying that Vince Young is an alcoholic?

I don't know if he is or isn't, but I don't have enough proof to declare him as one.
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I have no clue as to his private life and if he pushes the boat out on a frequent basis or rarely. Besides, I consider it none of my business. If it's not happening on my land or affecting a family member, it doesn't concern me.
 
I'm sure there are many that think that this disease can be controlled by "willpower".

Next time you have diarrhea, try "willpower". Let us know how that works out for you.

:texasflag:
 
I am glad I am not the UT employee who has to decide what we are supposed to do with him. I dont want to be any part of that decision

 
VY needs to be provided with counseling and enter a treatment program, then set up as an example what good can result when you treat the disease.

:hookem2:
 
If he is convicted for this offense, the third one has pretty serious penalties.

2nd DWI Offense: Class A Misdemeanor/Fine: Up to $4,000/Jail Range: 30 to 365 days/License Suspension: 180 days to 2 years

3rd DWI Offense: 3rd Degree Felony/Fine: Up to $10,000/Jail Range: 2 to 10 years in Texas Department of Criminal Justice (TDCJ)/License Suspension: 180 days to 2 years
 
yelladawgdem said:
I'm sure there are many that think that this disease can be controlled by "willpower".

Next time you have diarrhea, try "willpower". Let us know how that works out for you.

:texasflag:
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Serious question. I stopped smoking 30 years ago thru willpower. Why won't it work for those with drinking problems?
 
Horn2RunAgain said:
Serious question. I stopped smoking 30 years ago thru willpower. Why won't it work for those with drinking problems?
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I think that alcoholism embeds more into a "cycle" in your life, where the drug is what you want or need, but also it is causing social/relationship/financial/etc. problems that actually increase the need or want for the feeling of escape with the drug.

Nicotine is very addictive, certainly, and a little bit of an "escape" drug, but it does not itself contribute to the kind of deteriorating life and need for escape that a serious drinking problem does (smokers don't go wrecking cars, marriages, careers, etc. just for being high on nicotine). Over time, alcoholics usually mold their lives around other drinkers or enablers, so quitting drinking for them is giving up their whole lives, whereas a life without cigarettes can look pretty much like it did before.

Quitting cigarettes is famously difficult, however, so good job to you for doing it.
 
Horn2RunAgain said:
Serious question. I stopped smoking 30 years ago thru willpower. Why won't it work for those with drinking problems?
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I think you need a physician versed in this subject to really answer this question.
I know that people have died while detoxing from alcohol and other drugs such as heroin.
In treatment centers alcoholics are sedated for a few days while they detox.
That being said, I never went to treatment or detoxed at this extreme.
I also believe my "bottom" was higher than some.

Nicotine isn't a mind altering chemical like alcohol and other drugs.
An alcoholic/addicts entire psyche and response to life becomes dependent on the drug.

Probably not explaining this very well.
As another poster already pointed out, if you have never been an alcoholic then you can never really understand.
Unless perhaps you are a physician or are involved in the recovery industry.
 
Horn2RunAgain said:
Serious question. I stopped smoking 30 years ago thru willpower. Why won't it work for those with drinking problems?
Click to expand...

Willpower/Cold turkey is a scientifically poor method for smokers.

Smokers have a much higher success rate using will power when it's preceded by a traumatic event (loved one diagnosed with lung cancer etc)
 
Horn2RunAgain said:
Serious question. I stopped smoking 30 years ago thru willpower. Why won't it work for those with drinking problems?
Click to expand...
Others have explained very well above.
My two cents, the difficulty involved in quitting is different for everyone, depending on many factors, psychological as well as physical, that cause differing levels of dependence or addiction depending on the addicting substance.

Basically, it's different for everyone.
 
X Misn Tx said:
Willpower/Cold turkey is a scientifically poor method for smokers.

Smokers have a much higher success rate using will power when it's preceded by a traumatic event (loved one diagnosed with lung cancer etc)
Click to expand...

Fwiw it was the exact opposite with me. I stopped because I didn't want to deal with lung cancer. Fifteen years later my mother died from it. Every year my brother and I warned her and tried to get her to quit.

I'm not disagreeing mind you, but sometimes you have to say enough is enough and stand up to an addiction. Mine was cigarettes and you don't want me to describe the withdrawal and temptations (which would include having to cut ties with friends that smoked). It was the toughest thing I had to go through in several ways but I made up my mind to do it.
 
That's great man. Quitting is extremely hard regardless of how. Addiction is hard as hell to beat.

I was just speaking to your original point. The reason why will power is not a first line "method" is because it has piss poor effectiveness across the population.

In this circumstance with Vince, this COULD be his traumatic event. This situation would fit. But given everything he'd be stupid not to try effective treatments with support.
 
As another poster already pointed out, if you have never been an alcoholic then you can never really understand.
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This is not persuasive to me just because this is what aggies say about being an aggie.

Next time you have diarrhea, try "willpower". Let us know how that works out for you.
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Sorry to all those I am about to offend, but I don't buy this "alcholism is a disease just like diarrhea/cancer/whatever" thing. You can choose not to drink, you cannot choose not to have cancer. Picking up the bottle is an action that you do not have to do. If you do not have the personal willpower to not pick up the bottle, we can discuss that, but there is an action on your part that perpetuates this "disease" and that is not true for other illnesses. Even smoking is not going to give you cancer 100% of the time.

Flame away, drunks. :-)
 
Horn2RunAgain said:
Fwiw it was the exact opposite with me. I stopped because I didn't want to deal with lung cancer. Fifteen years later my mother died from it. Every year my brother and I warned her and tried to get her to quit.

I'm not disagreeing mind you, but sometimes you have to say enough is enough and stand up to an addiction. Mine was cigarettes and you don't want me to describe the withdrawal and temptations (which would include having to cut ties with friends that smoked). It was the toughest thing I had to go through in several ways but I made up my mind to do it.
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I quit smoking about 10 years after I got sober at the request of my son.
I used the patch and could not remove myself from smokers as I spent a great deal of time in smoky AA meetings. :)

I never woke up in jail due to smoking. Crashed my car due to smoking. Got divorced due to smoking.
I never suddenly realized I had a cigarette in my mouth and wondered "where did that come from?".
But that is alcoholism. Insanity.
Swearing I would never do that again, waking up sick and hungover and not even realizing when I picked up that first drink.
Again, hard to explain if you have never lived it.
 
moondog_LFZ said:
I quit smoking about 10 years after I got sober at the request of my son.
I used the patch and could not remove myself from smokers as I spent a great deal of time in smoky AA meetings. :)

I never woke up in jail due to smoking. Crashed my car due to smoking. Got divorced due to smoking.
I never suddenly realized I had a cigarette in my mouth and wondered "where did that come from?".
But that is alcoholism. Insanity.
Swearing I would never do that again, waking up sick and hungover and not even realizing when I picked up that first drink.
Again, hard to explain if you have never lived it.
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I've lived it. And I've been a responsible drinker for going on 38 years. The idea it's a disease originated with AA not the AMA. I'm not going to get in a prolonged debate on how I'm in denial. If AA works for you by all means stay with it. Personally I have never been more depressed than when attending an AA meeting.
 
I_Dont_Exist said:
I've lived it. And I've been a responsible drinker for going on 38 years. The idea it's a disease originated with AA not the AMA. I'm not going to get in a prolonged debate on how I'm in denial. If AA works for you by all means stay with it. Personally I have never been more depressed than when attending an AA meeting.
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There are drinkers, heavy drinkers, problem drinkers and alcoholics.
You may have been one of these.
But if you are drinking responsibly today then you were never an alcoholic.

I can remember very clearly when I crossed that line from drinking too much to not having any choice in the matter.
I can say with 100% confidence that there is no way I could drink responsibly today.
And, by the way, I rarely go to meetings anymore. But at one time they saved my life.
 
My heartfelt admiration for all those who recognized and dealt with their addictions.
The great thing is you did not let it have your life or who you were . Y'all seem to be decent productive human beings worthy of anyone's respect.
I really wish this for VY. But no matter what he is still someone who has done good for others at times in his past.
And he surely did GREAT:bevo::vy::bevo:
for us.
 
moondog_LFZ said:
There are drinkers, heavy drinkers, problem drinkers and alcoholics.
You may have been one of these.
But if you are drinking responsibly today then you were never an alcoholic.

I can remember very clearly when I crossed that line from drinking too much to not having any choice in the matter.
I can say with 100% confidence that there is no way I could drink responsibly today.
And, by the way, I rarely go to meetings anymore. But at one time they saved my life.
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Disagree but it's a fair point.
 
I can remember very clearly when I crossed that line from drinking too much to not having any choice in the matter.
I can say with 100% confidence that there is no way I could drink responsibly today.
And, by the way, I rarely go to meetings anymore. But at one time they saved my life.
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And that is the key difference between alcoholism and disease. Kudos and respect to you, MD, for seeing the problem and taking steps that helped you to correct it. Not everyone so afflicted is successful this way. However the point I want to make is that you could do something (in your case, AA) that would make the problem stop. Not go away, but stop. I wish there were such meetings for my mom to attend that would have stopped her cancer from killing her.

Saying it's a disease just like cancer or heart disease I think lets the alcoholic off the hook and so they are not responsible. This is a bad incentive model, IMO. It can be stopped if you will take steps to make it so and then stick with it, as you did.
 
Horn2RunAgain said:
Serious question. I stopped smoking 30 years ago thru willpower. Why won't it work for those with drinking problems?
Click to expand...
A LOT of the DWI cases out there are not really alcoholics but rather are idiots who go out with friends and have no clue about how much they consumed. You don't see many 10AM arrests for DWI...they tend to be the window of time after bars closed.

Thus the introduction of alcoholism as a disease into this discussion is really a red herring.

As to the case itself, it is of some note that the arrest report is STILL not imaged. Fort Bend County generally has these reports available and viewable pretty quick following an arrest (on any offense). The case ALSO still reflects as an unfiled case...which brings us back to the Constitutional presumptions that some in the thread are disregarding.
 
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