The Russians are Coming, The Russians are Coming

[Seattle Husker]

Better find a new source for potash and fertilizer too then.

I think oil and gas is easier to find alternatives for. Hopefully.

I pointed this out earlier in another thread. We've been moving away from the Russian potash with fairly extreme tariffs since 2020 or 2021. Morocco or Madagascar (???) has supplanted Russia for our imports of potash. As someone coming from farming roots, there are other alternatives if needed. Less natural of course which the environmentalist will never know about. In summary, this isn't a major issue.

 

[Monahorns]

I pointed this out earlier in another thread. We've been moving away from the Russian potash with fairly extreme tariffs since 2020 or 2021. Morocco or Madagascar (???) has supplanted Russia for our imports of potash. As someone coming from farming roots, there are other alternatives if needed. Less natural of course which the environmentalist will never know about. In summary, this isn't a major issue.

Good to hear.

 

[Monahorns]

Ukraine, Russia agree to temporary local cease-fires for aid, evacuees

 

[Horn6721]

I watched Trump at the NATO Summit where he went after Germany for paying Russia billions for oil/gas while USA is paying lion's share of NATO
Notice who is sitting on Trump's right.
btw Is Trump wrong?
Word for Word: President Trump Strongly Criticized Germany at Start of NATO Summit (C-SPAN) - Bing video

 

[bystander]

I watched Trump at the NATO Summit where he went after Germany for paying Russia billions for oil/gas while USA is paying lion's share of NATO
Notice who is sitting on Trump's right.
btw Is Trump wrong?
Word for Word: President Trump Strongly Criticized Germany at Start of NATO Summit (C-SPAN) - Bing video

And that's what he said and he's right... 100%

 

[Seattle Husker]

And that's what he said and he's right... 100%

It was neither the time nor place for those comments. Germany had already agreed to increase spending to 2% by 2024. All NATO countries had that agreement. There was no indication that Germany wasn't going to meet that target. As for the place, why so public? My guess it was for domestic consumption so his base could see him "beat up" on those Europeans. If you're Putin the cracks in the NATO alliance that Trump was creating were gold, especially when combined with the "I believe him" rather than your own intelligence services.

Trump was right about the Nordstream 2 pipeline weakening Germany's position. Those that felt making Russia dependent on EU energy purposes would force Putin to be a better partner were wrong. Then again, Nordstream 2 never went into operation. Right now many companies are staring at $10's of millions of dollars of write-offs to build a pipeline that may never be used.

 

[bystander]

It was neither the time nor place for those comments. Germany had already agreed to increase spending to 2% by 2024. All NATO countries had that agreement. There was no indication that Germany wasn't going to meet that target. As for the place, why so public? My guess it was for domestic consumption so his base could see him "beat up" on those Europeans. If you're Putin the cracks in the NATO alliance that Trump was creating were gold, especially when combined with the "I believe him" rather than your own intelligence services.

Trump was right about the Nordstream 2 pipeline weakening Germany's position. Those that felt making Russia dependent on EU energy purposes would force Putin to be a better partner were wrong. Then again, Nordstream 2 never went into operation. Right now many companies are staring at $10's of millions of dollars of write-offs to build a pipeline that may never be used.

It doesn't bother me a bit to say it out loud. They are corrupt politicians and need to be spoken to in that manner sometimes.

Now I'm sure you're thinking it's stupid because they will get their feelings hurt and do something counter to our national interests. But at times I just don't care. I've said it here many times; I have zero respect for Europe. Nothing matters to me except the art. Otherwise, they are the incubator for white privilege and world domination. Yet they act smug and worldly.

 

[Seattle Husker]

It doesn't bother me a bit to say it out loud. They are corrupt politicians and need to be spoken to in that manner sometimes.

Now I'm sure you're thinking it's stupid because they will get their feelings hurt and do something counter to our national interests. But at times I just don't care. I've said it here many times; I have zero respect for Europe. Nothing matters to me except the art. Otherwise, they are the incubator for white privilege and world domination. Yet they act smug and worldly.

Europe is like family to the US. You don't dress down your family in public. That doesn't help family relations and Ukraine should demonstrate how important these family relationships are.

 

[bystander]

Europe is like family to the US. You don't dress down your family in public. That doesn't help family relations and Ukraine should demonstrate how important these family relationships are.

And yet they dress down Trump con limon. The Dixie Chicks felt very at home over there.

 

[Seattle Husker]

And yet they dress down Trump con limon. The Dixie Chicks felt very at home over there.

First, the Dixie Chicks? They aren't politicians.

Second, Trump based his candidacy in 2015 on flamethrowing at our allies. It didn't matter if it was Mexico, Canada or EU. He was appealing to our native nationalists. Try berating your daughter(s) in public often and see how long it takes until they also respond negatively toward you in public. No leader (or child) is going to stand there and be bullied publicly. You don't get to be Prime Minister, President or whatever in any country by cowing to bullies.

 

[iatrogenic]

Germany had already agreed to increase spending to 2% by 2024. All NATO countries had that agreement. There was no indication that Germany wasn't going to meet that target.

Chancellor Angela Merkel had pledged to increase the country’s military expenditure to more than 2 percent of its GDP by 2024, but later said the country would not have met that target until well after the agreed timeframe.

 

[iatrogenic]

It doesn't bother me a bit to say it out loud. They are corrupt politicians and need to be spoken to in that manner sometimes.

Now I'm sure you're thinking it's stupid because they will get their feelings hurt and do something counter to our national interests. But at times I just don't care. I've said it here many times; I have zero respect for Europe. Nothing matters to me except the art. Otherwise, they are the incubator for white privilege and world domination. Yet they act smug and worldly.

An incubator for white privilege? I hope you are joking, or speaking about the idea of white privilege.

 

[iatrogenic]

First, the Dixie Chicks? They aren't politicians.

Second, Trump based his candidacy in 2015 on flamethrowing at our allies. It didn't matter if it was Mexico, Canada or EU. He was appealing to our native nationalists. Try berating your daughter(s) in public often and see how long it takes until they also respond negatively toward you in public. No leader (or child) is going to stand there and be bullied publicly. You don't get to be Prime Minister, President or whatever in any country by cowing to bullies.

First, your daughters? They aren’t politicians.

 

[Horn6721]

ia
Pointing facts is wasted on some people. They hate Trump so much it clouds their minds.
How many years had the US paid a lions share and stationed troops in Europe.
How many Presidents had asked Euro countries to pay their fair share with zero result.
Finally bringing it into public got results.
Maybe some people would rather we spare the free loaders and keep paying a disproportionate share.
Those are the same people who were upset by mean tweets

Which would you rather have now?
Mean tweets and lower gas prices etc
Or demented bumblings and high inflation?

 

[Seattle Husker]

ia
Pointing facts is wasted on some people. They hate Trump so much it clouds their minds.
How many years had the US paid a lions share and stationed troops in Europe.
How many Presidents had asked Euro countries to pay their fair share with zero result.
Finally bringing it into public got results.
Maybe some people would rather we spare the free loaders and keep paying a disproportionate share.
Those are the same people who were upset by mean tweets

Which would you rather have now?
Mean tweets and lower gas prices etc
Or demented bumblings and high inflation?

The 2% of GDP by 2024 was agreed to in 2014.

What NATO’s burden-sharing history teaches us

The 2014 NATO summit in Wales turned the European decline around with the commitment by heads of state to seek to spend 2 percent of GDP on defense by 2024. Defense cuts have been reversed everywhere. The number of allies to meet that 2 percent goal has risen from three to eight in the past four years. More than 16 have clear plans to attain the goal by 2024.

 

[iatrogenic]

The 2% of GDP by 2024 was agreed to in 2014.

What NATO’s burden-sharing history teaches us

Agreed to and not carried out.

I’m curious, where did you get the statement that there was no indication that Germany wasn’t going to meet the 2024 target, particularly since Merkel said they weren’t going to meet the target?

 

[Horn6721]

AH ia
Asking for facts. Let us know if you get an answer

 

[Chop]

I pointed this out earlier in another thread. We've been moving away from the Russian potash with fairly extreme tariffs since 2020 or 2021. Morocco or Madagascar (???) has supplanted Russia for our imports of potash. As someone coming from farming roots, there are other alternatives if needed. Less natural of course which the environmentalist will never know about. In summary, this isn't a major issue.

Canada for Potash
Morocco for Phosphates
Nitrogen — synthetic/manufactured

Of these, Phosphates are the hardest to get and Morocco is the Saudi Arabia x 4 of Phosphates. Very important place for the future.

 

[Seattle Husker]

Agreed to and not carried out.

I’m curious, where did you get the statement that there was no indication that Germany wasn’t going to meet the 2024 target, particularly since Merkel said they weren’t going to meet the target?

I was incorrect. In 2017 Merkel said they would meet the target then in 2018 said they'd only hit 1.5% by 2024 and would reach 2% by 2030. Based on media stories of the time it appears Merkel ran into very stiff resistance by one of the major parties. As @Mr. Deez can likely attest to, there is still a stiff hangover in Germany regarding military buildup due to WWII. The doubling of their military spending is what's occurring but that's an admittedly very slow pace of growth.

 

[bystander]

An incubator for white privilege? I hope you are joking, or speaking about the idea of white privilege.

The idea of it mainly.

What I'm saying is this: If there is such a thing about white privilege then Europe is the mother ship. I say that because Liberals love Europe so much. They are embarrassed by certain Americans. My feeling is this: WHY? Who cares what Europeans think.

 

[OUBubba]

The idea of it mainly.

What I'm saying is this: If there is such a thing about white privilege then Europe is the mother ship. I say that because Liberals love Europe so much. They are embarrassed by certain Americans. My feeling is this: WHY? Who cares what Europeans think.

That’s a fair statement.

 

[Mr. Deez]

I was incorrect. In 2017 Merkel said they would meet the target then in 2018 said they'd only hit 1.5% by 2024 and would reach 2% by 2030. Based on media stories of the time it appears Merkel ran into very stiff resistance by one of the major parties. As @Mr. Deez can likely attest to, there is still a stiff hangover in Germany regarding military buildup due to WWII. The doubling of their military spending is what's occurring but that's an admittedly very slow pace of growth.

It was two things. It was due to WWII but also due to the Cold War. Both West and East Germany spent heavily on defense throughout the Cold War. After reunification they fully exploited the peace dividend and focused their attention on European integration and environmentalism.

Merkel did want to boost defense, but there was opposition from some who simply didn't want to spend more on defense (especially from the Greens and some of the be SPD, who were coalition partners with Merkel's CDU) and others in both major parties who wanted to deemphasize the Bundeswehr and put any new spending toward a European Union-based military.

I think Russia annexing Ukraine started the reversal, but now that an actual hot war has broken out, the political logjam has broken. The fact that a SPD chancellor is pushing for a big, long term boost in defense spending suggests a pretty big shift in their politics and priorities.

 

[bystander]

It was two things. It was due to WWII but also due to the Cold War. Both West and East Germany spent heavily on defense throughout the Cold War. After reunification they fully exploited the peace dividend and focused their attention on European integration and environmentalism.

Merkel did want to boost defense, but there was opposition from some who simply didn't want to spend more on defense (especially from the Greens and some of the be SPD, who were coalition partners with Merkel's CDU) and others in both major parties who wanted to deemphasize the Bundeswehr and put any new spending toward a European Union-based military.

I think Russia annexing Ukraine started the reversal, but now that an actual hot war has broken out, the political logjam has broken. The fact that a SPD chancellor is pushing for a big, long term boost in defense spending suggests a pretty big shift in their politics and priorities.

It all reminds me of Moe Green snapping on Michael Corleone and saying, "You want to talk business, let's talk business!!!"

So Trump talked business out loud. He wanted equity. Say what you will about his motives. Lot's of people like to think he's kicking *** on something about the Europeans acting high and mighty on that peace dividends (being the environmentalists for instance) and calling them out was necessary. I like to think that. It's very simple from that point of view.

But was he reckless? Did the German's and others act arrogant about the subsidy they received? Were they arrogant in thinking that Russia would never do this? Was it what Conservatives think about Liberals: Extreme naivety about the world bordering on delusion built upon their egomaniacal progressiveness? So Trump then loudly mocks them and everyone wants to shush him up.

Wasn't that kind of thing what draining the swamp was truly all about?