T-shirt Christians

Those kinds of sermons are shown everyday in churches around the world. You act like you haven't seen it. You should come to my church.
 
The best sermons are not "seen" in Church, imo.
Francis of Assisi put it best when he encouraged Christians to preach the Gospel always and to use words if they had to.
 
Really, Satchel, do you really think there is anything in our culture (or ever in history) that comes even remotely close to doing as much for the poor as the Christian churches? Do you know where that money comes from? From we individual Christians who give our money on top of what the government takes from us at gunpoint.

If you noticed, Chango very quickly assumed in his post that it was the Christians who generally are already the 50% of the (responsible) population that are paying 90% of the federal income taxes. (That was the whole basis of his post!) Then, this generous, hardworking subsection of the population goes to church and voluntarily gives HUGE quantities to the poor and needy. Our giving isn't to the opera, the ASPCA, PETA, the symphony, the "arts" and all that other hoity-toity rich liberal "philanthropy" that gets you tickets to shows and statues and plaques and names on buildings. No, the American Christian supports the poor in this country and around the world, and we go out of our way not to put our names on any of it. Oh, yes, did I mention that as Chango already observed, it is our money that is keeping the "safety hammock" (hey, I think I just coined a phrase) comfortable, too?
 
Jesus agreed that our sins deserved the death penalty, and paid that penalty. "I am the resurrection and the life. He who believes in me, even though he dies, shall live."

So, to him it was justice, but to us it was grace.

Satchel, if the core of all you are saying is 1. all people are hypocrites, including Christians, and 2. Christians, who have been given so much grace spiritually should be generous in this life both spiritually and materially, then I have to agree with you.

Where I disagree is with the OP that implies or says that Christians are somehow more hypocritical, or especially so, or less generous, or are not authentic--especially in a debate about how our bloated, inefficient, wasteful, immoral federal government chooses to reallocate resources based upon a belief system that is openly hostile to Christians. Nothing Jesus said or stood for told us we had to support (or not support) the particular agenda Barrack Obama and Nancy Pelosi happen to have this year. I.e., this is a political topic and the reference to Christianity was purely a bigoted personal attack, and based on false presumptions.

Sorry, got to go to church now, to praise my Lord! Truly we have been given so much, and I hope that your criticism, even though I resist it, will remind me to pursue generosity more faithfully.

We do all need criticism, I'll try to benefit from yours.
 
Very shallow argument. Jesus even said, "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's". He said that to the mostly poor folks that were following him.

A more enlightening statistic would be how Christian's compare in charitable giving. If you wanted to argue that someone who gives very little to charity is not behaving in a Christian way - then I could probably agree with that.
 
for the record guys…Christian Conservatives give more to poverty, to charity, donate more blood and volunteer more time (to secular and christian charities). which makes this whole diatribe a bit embarrassing…not that Prodigalhorn hasn't done an excellent job of responding…..but the scriptures taken wildly out of context and without any grasp of the entirety of Scripture were painful to read. (this from a hypocrite who is working in South Africa at Masiphumelele)…..
 
Government intrusion in our lives has nothing to do with Christianity. In contrast with some of the earlier posters, I have a very difficult time understanding how someone can be Christian and Liberal, particularly when it comes to defending the lives of innocent babies.
 
I love the story of John the Baptist's first very early encounter with Jesus:

"As soon as the sound of your greeting reached my ears, the baby in my womb leaped for joy." Luke 1:44

Elizabeth said this to Mary.

How amazing that a baby (not just a fetus) who is not yet born is still capable of joy.
 
The OP spells out the importance of giving to the poor. My Christian faith is absolutely clear about this. However, it does not mention the need for an intermediary. I think the government should do everything possible to encourage citizens to give graciously to the poor. Giving should not involve confiscation and redistribution. This is done by governments who ban Christianity. Certainly taking away tax deductions for charitable giving, is not, in my opinion, a Christian thing for the government to do.
 
From Hoover:
The differences in charity between secular and religious people are dramatic. Religious people are 25 percentage points more likely than secularists to donate money (91 percent to 66 percent) and 23 points more likely to volunteer time (67 percent to 44 percent). And, consistent with the findings of other writers, these data show that practicing a religion is more important than the actual religion itself in predicting charitable behavior. For example, among those who attend worship services regularly, 92 percent of Protestants give charitably, compared with 91 percent of Catholics, 91 percent of Jews, and 89 percent from other religions.

The study is silent on a breakdown of liberal vs conservative Christians as some would have you believe.
 
Chango starts an inflammatory post then runs away leaving the WM standard bearers to fight out the argument. I'd recommend no more posts until he/she shows back up.
 
I think it's interesting that chango started this threat, but Satch (whom I think is a Christian - could be wrong, but I thought he had said he was in another thread) is the one who actually engaged the issue.
 
Chango starts an insulting inflammatory post without any real factual basis and then pieces a few scripture references together. The OP then runs away leaving the WM standard bearers to fight out the argument.

I'd recommend no more posts until he/she shows back up and only if chango is capable of a rational discussion.
 
satchel, you are correct…the difference between politically liberal and politically conservative Christians in terms of overall charity is small….conservatives still fare better. but those who don't believe and those who do believe it is QUITE dramatic. so it makes me laugh when people spout on about how Christians aren't generous blah blah blah and don't know they are entirely wrong.

i would also point out….much to your chagrin….that there are far more politically conservative theologically conservative Christians than politically liberal theologically liberal Christians so as a group the former also perform FAR better than the other groups. at the end of the day…someone can go on about how "unChristian" it is to be conservative politically but without that group of people giving time, energy, blood and money to charities….the nation would be FAR worse off charitably speaking. there's no great way to spin that for a political liberal.
 
Satchel, church was very cool. In my class, we looked in depth at Galatians 5, "Freedom in Christ," and the not-so-simple process of fashioning your own unique offering of your life, after you are saved. We all tend toward creative laziness, wanting someone to just tell us what to do or not do, yet we are called to be creative in our lives, led by the Spirit and applying our gifts to the callings of helping others, setting examples, and glorifying God. We were reminded that we don't come to church to be told what to do or not to do.

In the main church, we had fabulous music, as always, and discussed submission and honor from some passages of Ephesians. Honoring honorable people is not so hard; we must be ready to submit also in situations where it is not so easy, because where there is honor, there is order...where there is dishonor, there is chaos. (I actually stole that summary from another sermon I listened to, in case you think my preacher stole it from your preacher...I just thought it was pithy to the issue we studied yesterday.)

So, yes, it was definitely the highlight of the week; can't wait until next Sunday.
 
there is precious little of substance in this thread that supports the OP. but i still appreciate the attempts to answer the somewhat awkward points that were put forth.
 
It's funny that same people using the bible to call republicans hypocrites are the same posters that want christmas trees and scriptures removed from public places due to their irrelevance.

BUT if you must use some references I like Paul:
"if any would not work, neither should he eat." (2 Thes 3:10) That might not apply to every family of 4 at the poverty line but it certainly would apply to all of those sucking on the government tit.
 
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