Next seasons roster/scholarships?
- Thread starter longwolf
- Start date
I'll answer in a bit. It's a fairly long response, and I have some other things I'm doing right now.
Understand I haven't been talking about what the staff is doing now. I'm talking about what they did a year or more ago. Things like getting Durant transferred to Montrose Christian, or Avery Bradley to Findlay Prep, or putting together a detailed plan for Jordan Hamilton. That's not the kind of stuff you do at this late stage of the game.
At this point, he's either going to get through the clearinghouse or not, but I know a bunch of people looked at that transcript before it was sent off, and unless the clearinghouse decides some of the classes aren't valid as core classes, J'Covan should eventually be cleared.
I'll have more later.
Understand I haven't been talking about what the staff is doing now. I'm talking about what they did a year or more ago. Things like getting Durant transferred to Montrose Christian, or Avery Bradley to Findlay Prep, or putting together a detailed plan for Jordan Hamilton. That's not the kind of stuff you do at this late stage of the game.
At this point, he's either going to get through the clearinghouse or not, but I know a bunch of people looked at that transcript before it was sent off, and unless the clearinghouse decides some of the classes aren't valid as core classes, J'Covan should eventually be cleared.
I'll have more later.
First, on Dexter Pittman, because I've used Pittman as an example of what can potentially happen for J'Covan Brown from day one.
I got to watch Pittman several times over the course of his last two years, since he's right around the corner from me --- Rosenberg to my Sugar Land.
He was remarkable, and not necessarily in the good sense. He was just incredibly obese. Yet, watching him in warmups, he could do the splits. Mind you, it wasn't a pretty sight, but all the more incredible because of it. During games, he clearly overmatched his opponents, as you can imagine. He was so much taller and bigger than everyone else --- it was like watching an adult play among elementary kids on a lowered goal. But what really leapt out was his footwork. He just had incredibly quick feet for a large person. Of course, he hardly ever spent any time on the defensive end, never really making it over halfcourt.
I also saw him dominate Hasheem Thabeet in a local all star game in Houston featuring a multitude of other Div I players.
I had some pretty lengthy discussions about Pittman on Orangebloods. A guy by the name of The Weatherman in particular dismissed the idea that Pittman would ever lose his weight, since he hadn't done so already.
However, Pittman had shown signs of wanting to lose the weight. In each of the summers prior to his junior and senior seasons, he had lost about 30 pounds. Not the vast transformation he underwent once he made it to UT, but a promising sign to me nonetheless.
I can't say I predicted Pittman would make all the progress he's had. In fact, I'd say I've been wrong about his rate of progress, since I felt like he'd make a bigger impact on the program than he has. To his credit, he's not only reshaped his body, but his work on his free throw shooting deserves similar accolades, but always seems to be overlooked. His free throw shooting was TERRIBLE in high school.
Pittman's problem --- in many ways as serious as his weight issues --- are that he a) gets called for fouls because he's so much bigger than everyone else and b) he doesn't know how to play defense.
I mean, he's horrible at it. He constantly loses his player, his hedges are atrocious, and leaves the rest of the players scrambling, and he doesn't move his feet all that well when going against a smaller player. However, he tends to be excellent against other big men who simply aren't as quick as he is, and they're not used to going up against someone who bigger, stronger, with quicker feet. Players like the Lopez's, Blake Griffin, or Cole Aldrich, et al, have tremendous difficulties.
Still, I'm hopeful he can be a little improved this season. Not giving up points on the other end will help him stay on the floor as much as reducing his fouls and better conditioning. I do think Texas will have the personnel to put together their best 2-3 look since Barnes started employing it during the 2003-4 season, so that will help in some ways.
Getting back to J'Covan for a second, the staff has been fine for the last few months. Also, understand I've probably thrown them under the bus on this thread a little unfairly, because I've been angry about the situation the whole time --- but not too unfairly. I just watched them act way too confidently after bringing in J'Covan for the Elite Camp prior to his junior year. During that camp he absolutely crushed DJ Augustin trying to defend him. Not that defense is DJ's greatest strength, but J'Covan just made him look foolish, and this was when DJ was entering his sophomore year in college, while J'Covan was just finishing his sophomore year in high school.
He was ready to commit then, but the staff chose to hold off for their own reasons, which opened the door to all the crap which happened over the next year.
It's at this time that things started getting immensely complex. I can't get into all the details, but suffice to say that people around J'Covan had a different agenda than J'Covan did in terms of which school he'd attend, and the Texas staff did a really bad job of cultivating relationships with people who could and would help J'Covan despite these other influences.
One of the main weapons of choice for the people trying to direct J'Covan's eventual commitment was to attempt to muddy up the qualifying process. The Texas staff did a horrible job of involving people who could have helped J'Covan make some smarter decisions, and get paperwork turned in which would have kept this from going on as long as it has. There are various reasons for this, but IMO none of them are good ones, although maybe it will all work out in the end.
I do want to make some more comparisons between Pittman and J'Covan's situation, but I'll have to do it at another time, since I'm running late.
I got to watch Pittman several times over the course of his last two years, since he's right around the corner from me --- Rosenberg to my Sugar Land.
He was remarkable, and not necessarily in the good sense. He was just incredibly obese. Yet, watching him in warmups, he could do the splits. Mind you, it wasn't a pretty sight, but all the more incredible because of it. During games, he clearly overmatched his opponents, as you can imagine. He was so much taller and bigger than everyone else --- it was like watching an adult play among elementary kids on a lowered goal. But what really leapt out was his footwork. He just had incredibly quick feet for a large person. Of course, he hardly ever spent any time on the defensive end, never really making it over halfcourt.
I also saw him dominate Hasheem Thabeet in a local all star game in Houston featuring a multitude of other Div I players.
I had some pretty lengthy discussions about Pittman on Orangebloods. A guy by the name of The Weatherman in particular dismissed the idea that Pittman would ever lose his weight, since he hadn't done so already.
However, Pittman had shown signs of wanting to lose the weight. In each of the summers prior to his junior and senior seasons, he had lost about 30 pounds. Not the vast transformation he underwent once he made it to UT, but a promising sign to me nonetheless.
I can't say I predicted Pittman would make all the progress he's had. In fact, I'd say I've been wrong about his rate of progress, since I felt like he'd make a bigger impact on the program than he has. To his credit, he's not only reshaped his body, but his work on his free throw shooting deserves similar accolades, but always seems to be overlooked. His free throw shooting was TERRIBLE in high school.
Pittman's problem --- in many ways as serious as his weight issues --- are that he a) gets called for fouls because he's so much bigger than everyone else and b) he doesn't know how to play defense.
I mean, he's horrible at it. He constantly loses his player, his hedges are atrocious, and leaves the rest of the players scrambling, and he doesn't move his feet all that well when going against a smaller player. However, he tends to be excellent against other big men who simply aren't as quick as he is, and they're not used to going up against someone who bigger, stronger, with quicker feet. Players like the Lopez's, Blake Griffin, or Cole Aldrich, et al, have tremendous difficulties.
Still, I'm hopeful he can be a little improved this season. Not giving up points on the other end will help him stay on the floor as much as reducing his fouls and better conditioning. I do think Texas will have the personnel to put together their best 2-3 look since Barnes started employing it during the 2003-4 season, so that will help in some ways.
Getting back to J'Covan for a second, the staff has been fine for the last few months. Also, understand I've probably thrown them under the bus on this thread a little unfairly, because I've been angry about the situation the whole time --- but not too unfairly. I just watched them act way too confidently after bringing in J'Covan for the Elite Camp prior to his junior year. During that camp he absolutely crushed DJ Augustin trying to defend him. Not that defense is DJ's greatest strength, but J'Covan just made him look foolish, and this was when DJ was entering his sophomore year in college, while J'Covan was just finishing his sophomore year in high school.
He was ready to commit then, but the staff chose to hold off for their own reasons, which opened the door to all the crap which happened over the next year.
It's at this time that things started getting immensely complex. I can't get into all the details, but suffice to say that people around J'Covan had a different agenda than J'Covan did in terms of which school he'd attend, and the Texas staff did a really bad job of cultivating relationships with people who could and would help J'Covan despite these other influences.
One of the main weapons of choice for the people trying to direct J'Covan's eventual commitment was to attempt to muddy up the qualifying process. The Texas staff did a horrible job of involving people who could have helped J'Covan make some smarter decisions, and get paperwork turned in which would have kept this from going on as long as it has. There are various reasons for this, but IMO none of them are good ones, although maybe it will all work out in the end.
I do want to make some more comparisons between Pittman and J'Covan's situation, but I'll have to do it at another time, since I'm running late.
Okay, so getting back to the J'Covan Brown/Dexter Pittman comparison.
What Aces_Full posted above is pretty much true. There are a number of other incidents as well, but I just don't see much of a point in rolling up a list of times where J'Covan behaved poorly. While Aces_Full insinuates something different, I've never tried to paint J'Covan as an angel. Instead, I've always said the kid has had on court behavior problems, and I hope Texas is just the place to get them ironed out.
I felt like part of the issue with Pittman's weight, was something in his home environment allowed him to get that big. I've known families where food = love. I have no idea if that was the case with Pittman, but it might have been. Then I feel like his high school coach was an enabler in some ways. I won't get into my opinion of the guy much more than that, other than to say I've seen people I thought more highly of as high school coaches. He wasn't a bad person by any stretch of the imagination, but he was someone I'd watch on the sidelines and often wonder what he was doing.
When Pittman played for his summer team, he played for a coach that he responded to better, and so he lost some weight. This was a tacit acknowledgement that a) he knew he needed to lose the weight and b) under the right circumstances, he could.
I didn't think it would take until late his junior year and going into his senior season for him to truly start tapping his potential, but I'm glad to see it nonetheless.
With J'Covan, I've also seen him in settings where you can tell there's some part of him that craves having boundaries set for him. He can be respectful and polite. He's never going to be a Dale Carnegie acolyte, but he doesn't have to be in order to fulfill his potential.
The people at Texas aren't going to be concerned with having their hands out. There aren't going to be any hidden agendas. J'Covan can help the program --- heck, he can help the program immensely --- but Texas will be fine whether J'Covan works out or not. Some of the other programs he could have ended up at, he would have easily been the most talented player in the program at that time, by far, and so the program and coach would have had to act in ways that in the end would have been to J'Covan's detriment, simply out of fear that J'Covan might not like having boundaries set for him. In other words, the same dynamic would have played out that's been going on throughout J'Covan's life.
The one thing I don't know, though, is how is J'Covan going to react at the first setback? I'm concerned the people around him are going to be willing to pull him out of Texas at the first sign of difficulty, rather than encouraging him to push forward, deal with the setback, and just keep working hard. I remember the story about Gillispie going to Acie Law's mother prior to the summer workouts, and telling her not to let Acie Law quit, no matter what he said. I don't know that J'Covan has that same kind of support group. They're supportive of J'Covan, and there's a lot of love and pride regarding J'Covan, but I think it's clear it's sometimes been enabling for J'Covan's worst behavior.
My hope is that the combination of:
1) J'Covan having a lifelong dream to play for UT
2) J'Covan understanding he does have on court issues --- and he does understand that, make no mistake
3) some part of J'Covan wanting to change the worst parts of his on court behavior
4) Having a structured environment where responses to poor behavior are consistent, with J'Covan's best interests at heart, and no hidden agendas
5) Being around other players who are talented in their own right, and do act in more socially acceptable ways when things don't go the way they'd like for them to, and taking J'Covan aside when he needs it...
...all add up to the kind of environment where J'Covan can succeed. I don't know if it's going to happen or not. All I've ever wanted is to see J'Covan get the opportunity. What he makes of it is entirely up to him at the end of the day.
However, getting qualified was the first step, and there were plenty of forces at work beyond J'Covan's control which were hurting his chances of doing so.
What Aces_Full posted above is pretty much true. There are a number of other incidents as well, but I just don't see much of a point in rolling up a list of times where J'Covan behaved poorly. While Aces_Full insinuates something different, I've never tried to paint J'Covan as an angel. Instead, I've always said the kid has had on court behavior problems, and I hope Texas is just the place to get them ironed out.
I felt like part of the issue with Pittman's weight, was something in his home environment allowed him to get that big. I've known families where food = love. I have no idea if that was the case with Pittman, but it might have been. Then I feel like his high school coach was an enabler in some ways. I won't get into my opinion of the guy much more than that, other than to say I've seen people I thought more highly of as high school coaches. He wasn't a bad person by any stretch of the imagination, but he was someone I'd watch on the sidelines and often wonder what he was doing.
When Pittman played for his summer team, he played for a coach that he responded to better, and so he lost some weight. This was a tacit acknowledgement that a) he knew he needed to lose the weight and b) under the right circumstances, he could.
I didn't think it would take until late his junior year and going into his senior season for him to truly start tapping his potential, but I'm glad to see it nonetheless.
With J'Covan, I've also seen him in settings where you can tell there's some part of him that craves having boundaries set for him. He can be respectful and polite. He's never going to be a Dale Carnegie acolyte, but he doesn't have to be in order to fulfill his potential.
The people at Texas aren't going to be concerned with having their hands out. There aren't going to be any hidden agendas. J'Covan can help the program --- heck, he can help the program immensely --- but Texas will be fine whether J'Covan works out or not. Some of the other programs he could have ended up at, he would have easily been the most talented player in the program at that time, by far, and so the program and coach would have had to act in ways that in the end would have been to J'Covan's detriment, simply out of fear that J'Covan might not like having boundaries set for him. In other words, the same dynamic would have played out that's been going on throughout J'Covan's life.
The one thing I don't know, though, is how is J'Covan going to react at the first setback? I'm concerned the people around him are going to be willing to pull him out of Texas at the first sign of difficulty, rather than encouraging him to push forward, deal with the setback, and just keep working hard. I remember the story about Gillispie going to Acie Law's mother prior to the summer workouts, and telling her not to let Acie Law quit, no matter what he said. I don't know that J'Covan has that same kind of support group. They're supportive of J'Covan, and there's a lot of love and pride regarding J'Covan, but I think it's clear it's sometimes been enabling for J'Covan's worst behavior.
My hope is that the combination of:
1) J'Covan having a lifelong dream to play for UT
2) J'Covan understanding he does have on court issues --- and he does understand that, make no mistake
3) some part of J'Covan wanting to change the worst parts of his on court behavior
4) Having a structured environment where responses to poor behavior are consistent, with J'Covan's best interests at heart, and no hidden agendas
5) Being around other players who are talented in their own right, and do act in more socially acceptable ways when things don't go the way they'd like for them to, and taking J'Covan aside when he needs it...
...all add up to the kind of environment where J'Covan can succeed. I don't know if it's going to happen or not. All I've ever wanted is to see J'Covan get the opportunity. What he makes of it is entirely up to him at the end of the day.
However, getting qualified was the first step, and there were plenty of forces at work beyond J'Covan's control which were hurting his chances of doing so.
Statalyzer
10,000+ Posts
That's not what I mean by hedging.
I'm talking about a method for defending against screening action in man to man. I indicated I felt like Pittman was very good defending against other post scorers. It's when he's pulled away from the interior and/or has some complexity involved in his defensive assignments that he comes up way short.
I'm talking about a method for defending against screening action in man to man. I indicated I felt like Pittman was very good defending against other post scorers. It's when he's pulled away from the interior and/or has some complexity involved in his defensive assignments that he comes up way short.
Bob in Houston
2,500+ Posts
Based on the description of J'Covan as a firecracker, I would expect something like this to occur (assuming he makes it in, of course):
Blowups with teammates (handled within the team)
Blowups with assistants (also within the team, unless it's a lack-of-respect issue)
Ultimately, a couple of blowups with RB (who, I assume, already has thought through how he'd deal with them)
Assuming those are patched up, some limited number of technical fouls, that may or may not be game-turning.
Once he turns a game, that's when we'll know what RB thinks of him.
I mean, if the guy plays like Rasheed Wallace, they'll deal with it. If not...
Blowups with teammates (handled within the team)
Blowups with assistants (also within the team, unless it's a lack-of-respect issue)
Ultimately, a couple of blowups with RB (who, I assume, already has thought through how he'd deal with them)
Assuming those are patched up, some limited number of technical fouls, that may or may not be game-turning.
Once he turns a game, that's when we'll know what RB thinks of him.
I mean, if the guy plays like Rasheed Wallace, they'll deal with it. If not...
Yeah, I think he can be better than Gibson in college. Not as athletic, although Gibson didn't show his athleticism as much as he could have. Gibson was a balls out defender by his sophomore season. I think J'Covan can develop into a good defensive player, but I don't think he'll ever be as good as Gibson was his second season.
Gibson was such a terrific shooter, it's easy to give him the edge there, except that J'Covan is really good himself.
The key areas where J'Covan is better IMO are:
a) J'Covan is flat out more ruthless. He wants to win more, and he doesn't just want to win. He wants to dominate his opponent. If he finds a weakness in a defender, he'll exploit it over and over again.
b) J'Covan is much more aggressive in attacking the rim. Frankly, Gibson didn't set the standard as high as he should have been able to given his talent, but J'Covan is really good in this area.
c) J'Covan has a much better feel for the game. I always thought Gibson was very good passer on the break, but not so good in half court. J'Covan can be an excellent distributor in both cases.
J'Covan also has a very good midrange game.
I don't see him as a lottery pick, a la Durant/Augustin/Ford/Aldridge, but there's still room to make a heck of an impact without reaching those kinds of heights.
Gibson was such a terrific shooter, it's easy to give him the edge there, except that J'Covan is really good himself.
The key areas where J'Covan is better IMO are:
a) J'Covan is flat out more ruthless. He wants to win more, and he doesn't just want to win. He wants to dominate his opponent. If he finds a weakness in a defender, he'll exploit it over and over again.
b) J'Covan is much more aggressive in attacking the rim. Frankly, Gibson didn't set the standard as high as he should have been able to given his talent, but J'Covan is really good in this area.
c) J'Covan has a much better feel for the game. I always thought Gibson was very good passer on the break, but not so good in half court. J'Covan can be an excellent distributor in both cases.
J'Covan also has a very good midrange game.
I don't see him as a lottery pick, a la Durant/Augustin/Ford/Aldridge, but there's still room to make a heck of an impact without reaching those kinds of heights.
Statalyzer
10,000+ Posts
I don't think it was a matter of choosing J'Covan Brown over Willie Warren.
The Willie Warren recruitment went sideways early on, and was never really able to get back on track. Even if it did, when OU hired the assistant off of Stan Heath's staff at Arkansas, that really did help seal the deal for them.
I felt like Brown as a better player in some respects than Willie Warren --- although I always thought Warren was a better NBA prospect --- but I no longer feel like that's a fair assessment after Warren's spectacular freshman season. I thought he would be affected a lot more by a need to be the main guy, by a really really low release point on his shot, and by an inability to go his left. None of those factors were important, and Warren was consistently outstanding.
Brown does have better point guard instincts, IMO, and he's also a heck of a scorer, but he's never going to have the athleticism that Warren possesses, and Warren is a bigger player.
The Willie Warren recruitment went sideways early on, and was never really able to get back on track. Even if it did, when OU hired the assistant off of Stan Heath's staff at Arkansas, that really did help seal the deal for them.
I felt like Brown as a better player in some respects than Willie Warren --- although I always thought Warren was a better NBA prospect --- but I no longer feel like that's a fair assessment after Warren's spectacular freshman season. I thought he would be affected a lot more by a need to be the main guy, by a really really low release point on his shot, and by an inability to go his left. None of those factors were important, and Warren was consistently outstanding.
Brown does have better point guard instincts, IMO, and he's also a heck of a scorer, but he's never going to have the athleticism that Warren possesses, and Warren is a bigger player.
JesterHorn
100+ Posts
Well according to Gerry Hamilton and Scout he's in!
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