Impeachment

I know POTUS wants to drag this thing out so he can get his side heard, but that is not going to change anyone's mind. Just hold the vote so we can end this charade and move on.
 
horninchicago said:
I know I shouldn't be amazed that the Rs supposedly are in the majority in the Senate but are allowing tases so-called fitness negotiations.

Ridiculous. I don't care about McConnell et al being Statesmen. Screw the Dems. They were allowed to run amok in the House. I know...the Senate is the big boy body of Congress. Nonetheless, it's amazing how the Dems are constantly allowed to run things.
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I dont think having witnesses will be bad for Trump. It might be bad for some in the Senate and some not in the Senate (like the families of Kerry, Pelosi). But Trump has wanted witnesses the whole time (and he can block Bolton if he wants).

Although some correction of the ratio might be in order
 
Joe Fan said:
I dont think having witnesses will be bad for Trump. It might be bad for some in the Senate and some not in the Senate (like the families of Kerry, Pelosi). But Trump has wanted witnesses the whole time (and he can block Bolton if he wants).

Although some correction of the ratio might be in order
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Refresh my memory. Were the Rs allowed to negotiate for what witnesses were called during the House proceedings? I don't recall that they were. They were told By Shifty et al who would be called and had to plan accordingly.

But the nice guy/gal Senate Rs are so willing to bend over backwards. And the likes of Romney who wants to hear from Bolton but will not comment about Schiff, Whistleblower, and others being called.
 
back on planet Earth, the CBO says we will run trillion dollar deficits for the rest of the decade (over a trillion this year thanks to tax cuts and more spending) and the debt will equal the GDP by around 2028. Congress has better things to do than paying attention to little, short term things like this, don't they?

I am sure Warren has a plan to spend our way out of this oncoming trainwreck and Bernie will just say it is the capitalists fault and President Bone Spur will remind us that he promised to balance the budget and pay off the debt-----like he did with the casinos, etc.

meanwhile, the kabuki theater of impeachment proceeds as we all expected: lots of sound and fury leading to impeachment and then a failure to convict a few months before an election that will decide whether Bone Spur is put back in office or some Red gets a shot at the magic rings.

This is not as much fun as 1860 but it will do.
 
huisache said:
back on planet Earth, the CBO says we will run trillion dollar deficits for the rest of the decade (over a trillion this year thanks to tax cuts and more spending) and the debt will equal the GDP by around 2028. Congress has better things to do than paying attention to little, short term things like this, don't they?

I am sure Warren has a plan to spend our way out of this oncoming trainwreck and Bernie will just say it is the capitalists fault and President Bone Spur will remind us that he promised to balance the budget and pay off the debt-----like he did with the casinos, etc.

meanwhile, the kabuki theater of impeachment proceeds as we all expected: lots of sound and fury leading to impeachment and then a failure to convict a few months before an election that will decide whether Bone Spur is put back in office or some Red gets a shot at the magic rings.

This is not as much fun as 1860 but it will do.
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Deficits is entirely due to entitlements, as I will post something shortly to show that. Discretionary spending and tax cuts are not the issue, but it is talking point for Dems.
 
huisache said:
back on planet Earth, the CBO says we will run trillion dollar deficits for the rest of the decade (over a trillion this year thanks to tax cuts and more spending) and the debt will equal the GDP by around 2028. Congress has better things to do than paying attention to little, short term things like this, don't they?

I am sure Warren has a plan to spend our way out of this oncoming trainwreck and Bernie will just say it is the capitalists fault and President Bone Spur will remind us that he promised to balance the budget and pay off the debt-----like he did with the casinos, etc.

meanwhile, the kabuki theater of impeachment proceeds as we all expected: lots of sound and fury leading to impeachment and then a failure to convict a few months before an election that will decide whether Bone Spur is put back in office or some Red gets a shot at the magic rings.

This is not as much fun as 1860 but it will do.
Click to expand...
 
huisache said:
back on planet Earth, the CBO says we will run trillion dollar deficits for the rest of the decade (over a trillion this year thanks to tax cuts and more spending) and the debt will equal the GDP by around 2028. Congress has better things to do than paying attention to little, short term things like this, don't they?

I am sure Warren has a plan to spend our way out of this oncoming trainwreck and Bernie will just say it is the capitalists fault and President Bone Spur will remind us that he promised to balance the budget and pay off the debt-----like he did with the casinos, etc.

meanwhile, the kabuki theater of impeachment proceeds as we all expected: lots of sound and fury leading to impeachment and then a failure to convict a few months before an election that will decide whether Bone Spur is put back in office or some Red gets a shot at the magic rings.

This is not as much fun as 1860 but it will do.
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The solution is to raise the payroll tax. “Social” in social security and Medicare means everyone has to pay, not just the rich.
 
mchammer said:
Quid pro quo was used by Dems to sound nefarious. It all goes to intent. Intent to root corruption as it relates to foreign aid is not new. Frankly anyone who mentions quid pro quo at this point is someone who either hasn’t paid attention or being duplicitous.
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The flaw in your argument is that he did not give two poops about actual corruption. He cared about an announcement of an investigation into corruption that mentioned Biden. The evidence is pretty strong in that regard. Hence, “drug deal”.
 
horninchicago said:
Refresh my memory. Were the Rs allowed to negotiate for what witnesses were called during the House proceedings? I don't recall that they were. They were told By Shifty et al who would be called and had to plan accordingly.

But the nice guy/gal Senate Rs are so willing to bend over backwards. And the likes of Romney who wants to hear from Bolton but will not comment about Schiff, Whistleblower, and others being called.
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I think Democrats called 17 witnesses total
While Republicans were allowed 0 of their own
Making the 'witness ratio' 17-0
 
horninchicago said:
Yet the Senate is allowing all this BS negotiating. Got it.
RINOs trying to placate the media but the media will still hate them.
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Trump wants to not just gain acquittal but expose and hopefully blow up part of the Swamp in the process

I see his point but still disagree. The whole thing should be dismissed for the lack of due process. I see it as a much larger issue than just Trump.
 
So we have moved the goalposts? We’ve gone from “no quid pro quo” to “it’s ok because it’s foreign policy”.
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Bubba, know who you are responding to. I never said there wasn't quid pro quo. I have always thought there was. There is in 100% of negotiations. You ever negotiated without it?
 
OUBubba said:
The flaw in your argument is that he did not give two poops about actual corruption. He cared about an announcement of an investigation into corruption that mentioned Biden. The evidence is pretty strong in that regard. Hence, “drug deal”.
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The record shows that many people in the admin were concerned about corruption. It was also testified last week that Trump believed in Ukraine intervention in 2016. Trump wanted the announcement to get buy-in to do the investigation. Finally, your argument relies on mind reading. Where is the actual evidence for your argument?
 
Ha, Schiff claiming they tried to get Bolton to testify. He refused. His deputy refused. So, who do they get to testify but Fiona Hill, the deputy's deputy. What a joke.
 
LongestHorn said:
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The problem is that Sondland nullified this testimony when he said this:

GOLDMAN: Giuliani and President Trump didn’t actually care if they did them, right?

SONDLAND: I never heard, Mr. Goldman, anyone say that the investigations had to start or be completed. The only thing I heard from Mr. Giuliani or otherwise was that they had to be announced. ... President Trump presumably, communicated through Mr. Giuliani, wanted the Ukrainians on-record publicly that they were going to do those investigations.

GOLDMAN: You never heard anyone say that they really wanted them to do the investigations.

SONDLAND: I didn’t hear either way.

Nobody actually told him that the investigations did or didn't have to happen. Like he said, he never heard either way. And it makes sense. He wasn't part of the real decision-making process. People closer to the White House were, but nobody tried to get testimony from them.
 
Garmel said:
From a right wing site but check out the video of Bolton saying the conversation between Trump and Zelensky was warm and cordial. Uh Oh: Here's Video of John Bolton Saying Trump's Call with Ukraine was 'Warm and Cordial'
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He was obviously pressured by Trump to say all that, so he is a liar. So, therefore, the Dems ought to believe him now if he says Trump did want Biden investigated in exchange for the aid money.

My head is spinning just writing that sarcastic bit.
 
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