I’m still ok.

ShAArk92 said:
without rehashing the entire tenure ...

CS enters Bellmont ... then AD refuses to entertain at least 2 of CS's list for OC ... then practice begins ... summer ... and a significant part of the starting line-up is not only demoted, but dismissed ... for disciplinary issues ... so year one is REALLY a wash. Get through the first year establishing what is means to be a ball player/team at Texas ... then the second year and his first with his recruiting class on campus (which was a fantastic class if you'll recall) ... and the offense just can't get out of its own way; defense begins to improve sporadically (yeah, the blowouts) ...

by the 3rd year, the handwriting is on the wall.

perhaps CS could have grown into the job, too ... as has been said of TH in his second year (and second fully supported)

Anyhow ... it IS water under the bridge for the personalities ... but the underbelly of what caused it remains ... those that hired Fenves are still calling the shots and it was only the waning athletic dollars being spent which has motivated the "cigars" as some call 'em ... to get on with it.

it's discussion worthy if nothing else. ... but to reiterate ... "I'm Still OK."
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It may be that is all Charlie was capable of at Texas was cleanup duty. If he showed any promise other than that maybe a big time program will pick him up. If he stays at south Florida and goes 100-20 and no one takes a look it’s because they don’t want the same thing that happened to Texas to happen at their school. I think applewhite has beaten him twice now....
 
Sangre Naranjada said:
CDC is a HUGE difference maker compared to the admin support Charlie had to work with.
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In the end, Charlie had football players to coach and win games. He lost more than he won so he was let go. No administrator ever fumbled the ball or missed a tackle. We all hear about Herman needing to coach up Charlie Strongs players. Charlie was expected to coach up Mack’s players. Sheesh.
 
Charlie was supposed to restore discipline in the team. He dismissed a significant number of Mack's players. We were having rampant civil involvements (have we forgotten all the 1/2 time shows from bands who weren't Rice?) ... rivaling Miami. He had done a good job of cleaning-out ... but wasn't given time nor support to recover from that. I don't understand the resistance to acknowledging "we" didn't give him a chance to do his job ...

Which is why I won't ... and acknowledged I wouldn't ... call for Herman's job short of some criminal activity on his part ... or that of which he was aware/should have been aware and failed to take appropriate action ... for the duration of his first contract.

I'm still OK.
 
CS enters Bellmont ... then AD refuses to entertain at least 2 of CS's list for OC ... then practice begins ... summer ... and a significant part of the starting line-up is not only demoted, but dismissed ... for disciplinary issues ... so year one is REALLY a wash. Get through the first year establishing what is means to be a ball player/team at Texas ... then the second year and his first with his recruiting class on campus (which was a fantastic class if you'll recall)
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Yep. That's why I was mostly on-board with him despite the silly game-day mistakes (which were still giving me reservations), up until the last two games: We were 5-5 and looked to have a good chance to finish 7-5, maybe even 8-5 with a bowl. Instead we lose to Kansas, one of the worst teams in the nation and not just in P5 that year, and then were completely dominated at home by a TCU team that finished with a losing record.
 
Ironically ... I just learned why a college buddy of mine has been so aloof ...

fired from his job he'd held for the last 4 months! SMH. His outfit (my former) has gone STUPID with PC. Out of respect for him, I'm not going to name him ... but his experience AFA tenure seems similar to Strong's here at UT. That is ... entered a fray which was not completely known to 'em ... expectations high and in CS's case, no support, in my buddy's ... superiors who are more concerned with their own than leading a unique organization.
 
ShAArk92 said:
I think the writing was already on the wall and we just didn't know it.

He should have whipped KS, you're right ... but in hind-sight I can see where he was distracted.

But I'm Still OK! \m/
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Wow man you’re so right.
ShAArk92 said:
Charlie was supposed to restore discipline in the team. He dismissed a significant number of Mack's players. We were having rampant civil involvements (have we forgotten all the 1/2 time shows from bands who weren't Rice?) ... rivaling Miami. He had done a good job of cleaning-out ... but wasn't given time nor support to recover from that. I don't understand the resistance to acknowledging "we" didn't give him a chance to do his job ...

Which is why I won't ... and acknowledged I wouldn't ... call for Herman's job short of some criminal activity on his part ... or that of which he was aware/should have been aware and failed to take appropriate action ... for the duration of his first contract.

I'm still OK.
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Let it alone let it alone let it alone, nope can't do it....ShAArk92, that's awesome, you should be Charlie's agent or pr man/hype man...."Not Charlie's fault, didn't give him a chance, he's a winner"......He's a winner at Louisville and South Florida, that's it. I'll acknowledge him as a great coach when/if he gets a chance at Ohio State/Alabama/etc, but I'll go one better....since it was so unfair how he was treated, let's get Herman to get us up to double digits each year in wins....maybe get a conference title or two and then fire him and put Charlie in charge with a loaded team. After he dipped below 10 wins the very next season and having that lost look on his face during big losses to big time opponents, we could all say that somehow it wasn't fair, he didn't really get a chance he really knows what he's doing......football coaching welfare....
 
SMH.

Sorry you feel threatened by my posts. Wasn't my intention. Just trying to provide another perspective. You disagree with it. Fine.

Odd that it's OK for Herman to grow into the job ... but not Charlie. whatever.

i've said all I need to ... but it clearly is a burr under your saddle. Eat some halloween candy, maybe that'll make it all better.

BOO
 
ShAArk92 said:
I think the writing was already on the wall and we just didn't know it.

He should have whipped KS, you're right ... but in hind-sight I can see where he was distracted.

But I'm Still OK! \m/
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ShAArk92 said:
SMH.

Sorry you feel threatened by my posts. Wasn't my intention. Just trying to provide another perspective. You disagree with it. Fine.

Odd that it's OK for Herman to grow into the job ... but not Charlie. whatever.

i've said all I need to ... but it clearly is a burr under your saddle. Eat some halloween candy, maybe that'll make it all better.

BOO
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Herman immediately won more games than Charlie ever did at Texas, and now has 13 in less than 2 seasons.....if that's allowing him to grow into the job, he's growing by leaps and bounds.....Happy Halloween to you as well.....Hook 'em!
 
ShAArk92 said:
Odd that it's OK for Herman to grow into the job ... but not Charlie. whatever.
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Come on, Shark. Charlie had three years and never showed signs of improvement.
And losing to Kansas in year 3 might be interpreted as a sign of regression.
And when you're regressing from two previous losing seasons, I don't care if you're the second coming of Saint DKR, at The University of bygawd Texas your *** is going to get fired.
 
Sangre Naranjada said:
Charlie had three years
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Sangre ... guess you missed my exchange with @Statalyzer ... Yes, you're right, too ... we shouldn't have gotten beat by KS. to repeat, given what we know now ... he was clearly distracted.

he didn't get 3 years, he got at least 1, but no more than 2. First year was cleanout ... losing starters ... not getting the assistants he wanted ... year two (defense did improve dramatically over year 1) ... year 3 ... at some point he was told 2016 was his last.

I guess we can blast him for not doing his best all the way through. I'm sure anyone reaassigned/terminated here has "done their best" to the last minute ... ????

I'm not even saying Charlie was a long term solution ... but he wasn't even allowed a short term and it speaks ill of our "deciders." We should be concerned about THAT.
 
ShAArk92 said:
Sangre ... guess you missed my exchange with @Statalyzer ... Yes, you're right, too ... we shouldn't have gotten beat by KS. to repeat, given what we know now ... he was clearly distracted.

he didn't get 3 years, he got at least 1, but no more than 2. First year was cleanout ... losing starters ... not getting the assistants he wanted ... year two (defense did improve dramatically over year 1) ... year 3 ... at some point he was told 2016 was his last.

I guess we can blast him for not doing his best all the way through. I'm sure anyone reaassigned/terminated here has "done their best" to the last minute ... ????

I'm not even saying Charlie was a long term solution ... but he wasn't even allowed a short term and it speaks ill of our "deciders." We should be concerned about THAT.
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Peace offering, Shaark, Charlie really is a good man, just frustrated that he was hired in the first place, knowing now what is known...I thought he'd coach players up more, turn 2s 3s & 4s into 3s 4s & 5s...but it wasn't to be....
 
Shark, this is craziness. As a person I love Strong. He’s a good man. But geez, he was a totally ineffective HC at Texas, and that is solely on him, not the BMDs, not the administration, not “what Mack left him,” not the stadium, not global warming, nada. The dude had a losing record — for Three Years — at the University of Texas! What more do you need to see?

Whose fault was it that Strong insisted in bringing Shawn Watson with him? And then, was it a lack of support when they paid a King’s ransom to secure Sterlin Gilbert?

This has nothing to do with anything but results. And Strong could not produce them at Texas.

Like Zuck said, SHEESH!
 
Austin_Bill said:
Took Mack Brown 4 seasons to hit 10 wins. If Herman can do it in just 2 seasons I'm really happy.
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I think we'd all be very, very happy. I do not see how we win out, though.

wvu, isu and ttu all have a 50-50 shot to beat us. Which means we could win out, but after all the close games (bu, tulsa, ksu) that shouldn't have been close, and the two losses that shouldn't have been losses (md. and osu) I just can't see winning out, as much as I would love to see it.

On the other hand, I picked us to lose to usc, tcu, and ou; and we kicked each one's ***. So I know nothing. Anything is possible this season.
 
caryhorn said:
I think we'd all be very, very happy. I do not see how we win out, though.

wvu, isu and ttu all have a 50-50 shot to beat us. Which means we could win out, but after all the close games (bu, tulsa, ksu) that shouldn't have been close, and the two losses that shouldn't have been losses (md. and osu) I just can't see winning out, as much as I would love to see it.

On the other hand, I picked us to lose to usc, tcu, and ou; and we kicked each one's ***. So I know nothing. Anything is possible this season.
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I’m with you cary and absolutely agree. The next three games are a possession, turnover type game. Win or lose will matter on every possession, or fielding a punt inside our 2 yard line.
But like most here, progress. I circle the game at Tech as the one I absolutely want to win.
 
Strong was the worst head coach in Texas football history.
He was an incompetent boob and should never have been given a second year.

I am loving this season, this coach and this team. We are in every game.
Herman is getting it done on the recruiting trail and we are going to get better as he gets the players to compete at the highest level. Fact is, he is winning with what he was left with. There aren’t any All American defensive or offensive linemen trotting out on the field on Saturdays. But they are coming.

We could have lost to OU, Baylor, Tulsa, KState, and won at Maryland and Okla St. We have a coaching staff that has done an outstanding job with what they were left with and are relevant in recruiting.

Will we beat WVa, Tech and Iowa State ? No idea. But I know we will put a team on the field that is well coached and give everything they have. I am sure they will have us on the edge of our seat from the start To the end of each of those games.
Enjoy the ride, it’s only going to get better.
 
Odd that it's OK for Herman to grow into the job ... but not Charlie. whatever.
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CS had a maddening habit of blowing any positive vibe he ever gained. He beats OU and K-State, then gets shut out by Iowa State the next week, for example. He had a LOT of blowouts as well. The job was just too big for him. I am not sure how that happens, but it does. See Turner Gill at Kansas.

If TH is being given more slack, it's because we can see improvement week to week. I never felt that way with CS.
 
The concern I have - and it's a very real concern - is that this team could play at its current level (not digressing) and lose three more games. West Virginia, Tech, and Iowa State are all solid, dangerous teams, and I'd be pretty surprised if we ran the table. Right now I'd put odds at 75 percent chance of losing one game, 40-45 percent chance of losing two, and 20 percent chance of losing three.

if the worst case happens, that puts us at 7-5 - a game lower than I initially predicted and only one game better than last year's regular season. I would argue that the team is in measurably better condition now than it was last year, and there's definite progress. But an if this team ends up at 8-5 or 7-6 after a bowl game, it's going to be a long off-season of complaining and hand-wringing.
 
If we end up 8-5 when all is said and done, I am still OK. I just want to see improvement and that is 1 win better than last year.
 
I've already seen improvement, just not consistent enough to be better than good, especially for 4 qtrs. I am hopefully optimistic though and for that to be true this late in season is a great uplift.
BthoWVa!
 
My Mendoza Line before the season was 9 wins, and it still is. I predicted 10 and based on where we are now, at 6, we would need to win at least four of the next six games, which assumes an appearance in the conference championship game, and a bowl game.

Like most of us though, I have no idea what to expect the rest of the way. I tend to agree with PH’s percentages above but then again, what was the probability of our reaching 6-1 after Maryland and Tulsa? Probably about 5%. So who knows? One thing I am very sure of. I’ll really be OK if we win out.

:coolnana:
 
Winning more than 2 games in a row was a significant step in the right direction that Charlie could never take.
It was maddening, and inexplicable at times. We'd follow up on a "signature" win losing in such a fashion that it undid any momentum we had.
Every time he got his shirt buttoned up his pants would fall down.


Herman, winning 6 in a row, shows consistency. We could lose the rest of our games, and I would still see this season a step forward (as disappointing as that would be)
We won't, however, lose the rest of our games. And we won't get blown out. We might have taken a step or two back with the last two games. But they weren't complete and utter inexplicable collapses. We can build on a loss like the one we had last week, believe it or not...

And this is from someone who wanted Charlie and held on to hope until that Kansas game.
 
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ShAArk92 said:
he didn't get 3 years, he got at least 1, but no more than 2. First year was cleanout ... losing starters ... not getting the assistants he wanted ... year two (defense did improve dramatically over year 1) ... year 3 ... at some point he was told 2016 was his last.
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Let's be real, real clear here. If Strong wasnt such a dumba$$ on the sideline and hard headed in his initial coaching hires (and trying to save their jobs) he could have won 5-8 more games here easily with what he had. And that would have bought him another year maybe two.

He did clean up a lot, but I often wonder how many of his dismissals were because of something bad and not just him trying to live up to the hard *** image he put out there. I read a few old articles and almost all of the reasons were for breaking team rules with a couple being insinuated to be linked to drugs and a couple had to do with breaking other laws. 10 were dismissed the first year alone.

He was also terrible at relationship building and press conferences. The players he brought in thought he was their buddy and not a respected coach. Strong was his own worst enemy.
 
Vol Horn 4 Life said:
Let's be real, real clear here. If Strong wasnt such a dumba$$ on the sideline and hard headed in his initial coaching hires (and trying to save their jobs) he could have won 5-8 more games here easily with what he had. And that would have bought him another year maybe two.

He did clean up a lot, but I often wonder how many of his dismissals were because of something bad and not just him trying to live up to the hard *** image he put out there. I read a few old articles and almost all of the reasons were for breaking team rules with a couple being insinuated to be linked to drugs and a couple had to do with breaking other laws. 10 were dismissed the first year alone.

He was also terrible at relationship building and press conferences. The players he brought in thought he was their buddy and not a respected coach. Strong was his own worst enemy.
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Vol, good post, with one glaring flaw. You used reason and logic.
 
Season (conference)

6-7 (5-4)
5-7 (4-5)
5-7 (3-6)

You don't have to be Laplace to see a trend there, though a relatively small data set, with large consequences.
 
Good Lord.
I can't believe we are still arguing over Strong.
He was offered a multi-million dollar job and accepted.
And, while apparently a good and honest man, it was more than he could handle and he was let go.
End of story.
Offer me $5 million a year and I'll give it my best shot, as well.
Probably be released before mid-season of first year.
But I'll have a nice buy out. :)
 
Not to be unkind to Charlie but quite candidly, how many of the posters on HF, if given the job of HC at Texas, couldn’t go at least 6-7, 5-7 & 5-7?
 
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