Constitutional Props-- all but 1 passed -- THE PEOPLE HAVE SPOKEN

I voted AGAINST many more than Chop suggested. AGAINST anything that gives government more money, land, or power. Vote FOR anything that does the opposite.
 
ViperHorn said:
Vote for Prop 9.

Teachers' retirement is based on their last 3 years pay. Then that is it. Think of the teachers you had in the 60s to 80s and retired in that period. What they received in their first check is what they are getting this month.
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How old are they?
 
Sangre Naranjada said:
You clearly do not know any dedicated teachers, nor are married to one.
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I actually am married to one. I have also looked at the economics of government vs private, and how artificially high labor rates in one industry (usually due to unions) reduce the labor rates in other industries in order to compensate for it.
 
Monahorns said:
Salaries are determined by marginal utility of one teacher compared to the next.
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Only in theory.

If that was true in reality, then HS math teachers, special ed teachers, and some others might make 150% (or more) of the salaries of the other teachers with the same number of years of experience. But the school districts don't hire on a competitive $ basis. Usually, all the new teachers will make the same $, regardless of their subject and the supply/demand of that type of teacher. There's a small $ kicker for bilingual teachers, I believe.

One result--plenty of unqualified, or just plain lousy, math and science teachers (along with the good ones).
 
guy4321 said:
A $55k (new hire) to $69k (30 years' experience) teacher
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Those numbers show:

1. Not too bad starting out with a bachelor's degree (not far below market for a B.A.);
2. A really lousy salary progression as they get more experience (far below market for experienced professionals).

This would tend to lead to a younger and younger median age of teachers.
 
Chop said:
Only in theory.

If that was true in reality, then HS math teachers, special ed teachers, and some others might make 150% (or more) of the salaries of the other teachers with the same number of years of experience. But the school districts don't hire on a competitive $ basis. Usually, all the new teachers will make the same $, regardless of their subject and the supply/demand of that type of teacher. There's a small $ kicker for bilingual teachers, I believe.

One result--plenty of unqualified, or just plain lousy, math and science teachers (along with the good ones).
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That doesn't negate the role of marginal utility in setting the salaries of teachers. It doesn't mean each teacher gets a specific salary. It means that the salary level is set compared to other jobs. It is also why teacher rates are different in different areas.
 
Horn6721 said:
How does the state teachers retirement pay out compare to SS?
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I can only relate to me and my wife. She only taught 17 years before retiring the 1rst time (she's called it quits twice and will finally be done in may... I hope). Her trs retirement is almost as much as my SS but not quite. What she couldnt benefit from is a company matching 401k program like I had. Or stock options, or bonuses tied to company stock

What trs does provide is a pretty good health insurance policy. But we pay over $500 in monthly premiums for it whereas in 2017 when she first retired it was about $125 I think
 
Chop said:
Those numbers show:

1. Not too bad starting out with a bachelor's degree (not far below market for a B.A.);
2. A really lousy salary progression as they get more experience (far below market for experienced professionals).

This would tend to lead to a younger and younger median age of teachers.
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A lot of teachers get out of teaching within a year or 2. A lot. It's not for everyone and it certainly wouldn't be for me. Never tried it but I'm married to a math teacher. Different world
 
Can we give them the COLA but fund it with a tax on current school administrators? I could certainly go along with that.
 
Chop said:
Those numbers show:

1. Not too bad starting out with a bachelor's degree (not far below market for a B.A.);
2. A really lousy salary progression as they get more experience (far below market for experienced professionals).

This would tend to lead to a younger and younger median age of teachers.
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What it leads to is a whole lot of woefully inexperienced and unqualified people leaving the classroom early in their careers so they can angle for a better paying job in school administration. There ought to be a pre-hire requirement that any administrator must have a given amount of time in the classroom; I would set that bar at 10 years.
 
Sangre Naranjada said:
What it leads to is a whole lot of woefully inexperienced and unqualified people leaving the classroom early in their careers so they can angle for a better paying job in school administration. There ought to be a pre-hire requirement that any administrator must have a given amount of time in the classroom; I would set that bar at 10 years.
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I think a fairly high % of teachers would make good managers.

They are responsible for a lot of different things, they have many irons in the fire at any given time, they explain stuff to people, they motivate, and they deal with difficult people a lot.
 
Don't anybody think that the teachers' union has any real power in Texas. In many states they do. Not here in Texas.
 
Chop said:
Don't anybody think that the teachers' union has any real power in Texas. In many states they do. Not here in Texas.
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They are getting Democrats elected in the state and the Texas Republicans haven't passed a school choice bill yet because of their influence. They also got a governor replaced in the 80s for pissing off the teachers union.
 
I hated how vague most of the 14 were.

And what do people have against the Galveston County Treasurer anyhow?
 
Chop said:
Don't anybody think that the teachers' union has any real power in Texas. In many states they do. Not here in Texas.
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The teacher groups (I don't call them unions because they don't have collective bargaining power or the ability to strike.) don't have the political power they have in blue states (where they have enormous power), but that doesn't mean they don't have any real power. They've been able to pull off all kinds of things.

We've had a GOP legislature since 2003 (and usually with big majorities) and yet they've always managed to kill school choice legislation and avoid meaningful oversight and accountability of teachers and administrators. There have been some funding battles, but they've typically ended in a draw, not defeat. They've been able to get teacher pay raises multiple times and got the state to take over their medical insurance.

They've accomplished it by being very shrewd in GOP primary elections. They've massively pushed the narrative that school choice is Armageddon to rural areas and opens private schools to heavy state regulation. That has created significant reluctance, if not always full blown opposition, on the Right. They've also been supportive of state legislative candidates who have a conservative persona and are often even pretty conservative on issues not related to education. The result has been the election of a lot of rural Republicans who don't often vote with Democrats across the board but will team up with them to kill school choice.

So can the teacher groups basically rob the store like they can in California, Illinois, or New York? No, but they can certainly play defense very effectively and can often get at least modest gains.
 
mb227 said:
I hated how vague most of the 14 were.

And what do people have against the Galveston County Treasurer anyhow?
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The current Treasurer said the position is redundant with existing positions and offered to eliminate it to save money. For some dumb reason, both the county and the state have to approve it. Same issue I have with Prop 11 - that's El Paso's business, not mine.
 
Interestingly with regard to Galveston County (or is it the City of Galveston?), many decades ago, they opted out of the Social Security System and funded their own municipal employee retirement system (as they were allowed to do as a municipality). Their fund made good $ and their retirees get a lot more $$$ than they would have received under Social Security.
 
I don't like to vote in County specific elections unless I am living in that County at that time. It's their business.
 
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