Can anyone justify NOT having the Wall?

Mr. Deez said:
Furthermore, I don't think we're actually debating immigration in America. We're debating the concept of the nation state.
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Well said. That's exactly what it is.

The Left wants the United States of America to effectively disappear.

I often wonder if the George Soros of the world have thought about what happens if they dismantle the U.S. A vacuum always gets refilled, as we've seen in Libya and Iraq. Who keeps the Russians and/or the Chicoms from moving in after the Americas are just one big, borderless area?
 
Former border chief testifies that Arizona border wall cut illegal crossings by 94%

Before the Yuma fence was built, Colburn says the Yuma Border Patrol identified 2,706 times in a one year period when smugglers loaded up a vehicle with drugs and/or people and simply drove across the border. Just 13 of them were detected and stopped by immigration authorities. “The rest all got away, with no idea what or who they brought in.”

After the fence was built, however, only six vehicles tried to cross the border, and every one of them was captured or turned back.

“By 2008, Yuma Sector arrests of illicit border crossers and traffickers had dwindled down from over 138,000 down to 8,363,” Colburn states in his testimony. “The known attempts to enter and the got-aways dwindled to an equally minimal number compared to the hundreds of thousands that entered and evaded arrest in previous years.”
 
Brad Austin said:
Former border chief testifies that Arizona border wall cut illegal crossings by 94%

Before the Yuma fence was built, Colburn says the Yuma Border Patrol identified 2,706 times in a one year period when smugglers loaded up a vehicle with drugs and/or people and simply drove across the border. Just 13 of them were detected and stopped by immigration authorities. “The rest all got away, with no idea what or who they brought in.”

After the fence was built, however, only six vehicles tried to cross the border, and every one of them was captured or turned back.

“By 2008, Yuma Sector arrests of illicit border crossers and traffickers had dwindled down from over 138,000 down to 8,363,” Colburn states in his testimony. “The known attempts to enter and the got-aways dwindled to an equally minimal number compared to the hundreds of thousands that entered and evaded arrest in previous years.”
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A better description: Former border chief testifies that Arizona border wall cut illegal crossings by 94% in Yuma Sector.

That's a key point. Like water, they'll find a way in. So they moved to another spot? Does that justify the Yuma wall? It does to those in Yuma but I suspect some other area is now suffering more.
 
While I'm no fan of a wall, because I think the better move is to mandate E-Verify and enforce it on employers....A wall can be effective at substantially reducing the flow of illegal immigrants (and terrorist, and drugs).

If I put a single rock in the river the water flows around it easily. If I put 2500 rocks in the river...I have a dam.
 
Imagine the cost of not building a wall ......

I'll bet the transfer payments over the next 100 years would be many times greater than the cost of building a wall.
 
From what I've read illegal immigration cost between 50 to 100 billion a year. That's a net loss that's including the taxes we get from illegals.
 
The research results vary, but they all show that illegals cost us big money.

Of the 12 million illegals in the U.S.:
-81% come from Mexico and South America
-less than 50% pay income taxes
-less than half completed high school
-contribute less than 0.03% to GDP
-Cost 0.1% of GDP (net cost is $10billion per year)
-make up 29% of Federal Prisoners

For every 1 million we can kick out of the country, we save $1billion per year
For every 1 million we keep out (two year's worth), we save $1billion

So the obvious answer is Yes, building a wall is justified, as is kicking out illegals and their family members born in the U.S.

Go find someone else to vote for Democrats, but don't use immigrants. Maybe endorsing something other than socialism would help you.
 
iatrogenic said:
The research results vary, but they all show that illegals cost us big money.

Of the 12 million illegals in the U.S.:
-81% come from Mexico and South America
-less than 50% pay income taxes
-less than half completed high school
-contribute less than 0.03% to GDP
-Cost 0.1% of GDP (net cost is $10billion per year)
-make up 29% of Federal Prisoners

For every 1 million we can kick out of the country, we save $1billion per year
For every 1 million we keep out (two year's worth), we save $1billion

So the obvious answer is Yes, building a wall is justified, as is kicking out illegals and their family members born in the U.S.

Go find someone else to vote for Democrats, but don't use immigrants. Maybe endorsing something other than socialism would help you.
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I would add that we are paying for their children to go to our colleges, taking spots from our American citizens and driving up the cost of tuition across the board.

NPR and other stations talk about these families that are going to be separated and inevitably there is a family member "on full scholarship" to some university...As if that is a redeeming feature. Tell me the kid got 1600 on their SATs and maybe I'll say the US is lucky to have them. Reality is that most of these scholarship immigrants got a big old boost to their scholarship achievement by virtue of their socio economic and "first-gen college" status rather than their academic prowess.

However, I'm still against a wall. Don't know how problematic it really is, but heard a bit the other day about a US/Mexico treaty about impeding the waters and flood zone of the Rio Grande. Seems to be one more front for a legal battle over the wall. No such legal battles are present with E-Verify. Roll it out.
 
One argument is they will be separating immigrants from their families. So? Do we not need to send people to prison because we will be separating them from their families as well? The law is the law. Libs logic = :brickwall:
 
An agreement for a new spending bill has been reportedly reached. Dems celebrating no mention of "The Wall" in the bill. But, 1.5 billion is appropriated for "border security". Sounds like there'll be plenty of money to start the wall to me.
 
BrntOrngStmpeDe said:
Don't know how problematic it really is, but heard a bit the other day about a US/Mexico treaty about impeding the waters and flood zone of the Rio Grande.
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It doesn't have to be a solid wall. How about a double chain link fence with some space between the fences to defeat ladders?
 
I know this is "over the top" and it will NEVER HAPPEN but if we wanted to get SERIOUS about illegal immigration and recognized it as the clear and present danger to These United States of America that it is ...

Utilize that double-edged sword called eminent domain and buy-out every rural property within 5 miles of the nation's border ... reconstitute those Hawgs in the Az Bone-Yard and use 'em to support the BP officers on the ground in a free-fire zone.

All USAF base flight lines have "ECP" ... entry control points. they are painted on the ramp, there is no physical wall/fence/etc ... but try to walk across that 2' wide bright red stripe and see how many paces you get past before your face is planted into the concrete and a couple 18 year old kids have ARs pointed at yer noggin.

We should have "ECPs" at our major population centers/major highways in/out of Mexico. and that be the ONLY place anyone can cross the border who isn't Federal/State/Border County Law Enforcement.

But like I said ... we're not serious about the threat so it will continue to happen and we will continue to lose what was once a sovereign nation. The "Flag of Convenience" in airline transportation is a current issue directly related to this very topic. I'll probably retire before my job actually is taken-away by the Norwegian Air types, but it's coming.
 
Dallas paper had a short article recently about how wages are going up for construction workers because of the lack of illegal immigrants. Wow!! who could have seen that coming?? It is so crazy to me that the same lefties will gripe all day about wages and needing a guaranteed minimum wage and then the same folks will argue for essentially uncontrolled immigration and amnesty for everyone here.
 
BrntOrngStmpeDe said:
Dallas paper had a short article recently about how wages are going up for construction workers because of the lack of illegal immigrants. Wow!! who could have seen that coming?? It is so crazy to me that the same lefties will gripe all day about wages and needing a guaranteed minimum wage and then the same folks will argue for essentially uncontrolled immigration and amnesty for everyone here.
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It's called cultural Marxism.
 
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BrntOrngStmpeDe said:
It is so crazy to me that the same lefties will gripe all day about wages and needing a guaranteed minimum wage and then the same folks will argue for essentially uncontrolled immigration and amnesty for everyone here.
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This drives me nuts. We crucify companies for not paying a "living wage" and yet we're perfectly happy to allow companies to pay illegals under the table cash so they can live 10 to a room somewhere on wages no American would accept.
 
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