On domestic policy, no. On foreign policy? You're pretty close.
3 Cheers for our good ally Israel! Est. 1200 BC
- Thread starter Chop
- Start date
On domestic policy, no. On foreign policy? You're pretty close.
I commented on Deez' post, not your philosophy.
**** defending yourself. When the jackasses entire purpose is to wipe you out you don't "defend yourself". Do you not realize how stupid and naive this sounds? If the terrorists don't stop, Israel will continue to attack. They have spent their entire existence being attacked by someone and wont sit around waiting for more to die to solve the problem. Being insulated in America where we have never had to worry about this its easy to judge their approach. Spoiled is what I call it.
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Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Thanks for the clarification.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
You just gave Hamas justification for 10/7. The power balance leans humongously heavy in Israel's favor.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
So genocide? Is that what you are calling for?
Also, this is exactly what Hamas is using as justification for what they are doing.
Like I said both sides are war mad. They need external voices who are insulated from such violence to intervene and help bring peace.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
First, domestic and foreign policy are inextricably linked. I simply recognize that and advocate for a path to greater liberty and justice for Americans.
Second, what I think about war is much much closer to Augustine, Aquinas, other medieval Scholastics, and George Washington.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
George Washington Quotes
"So, likewise, a passionate attachment of one nation for another produces a variety of evils. Sympathy for the favorite nation, facilitating the illusion of an imaginary common interest in cases where no real common interest exists, and infusing into one the enmities of the other, betrays the former into a participation in the quarrels and wars of the latter without adequate inducement or justification. It leads also to concessions to the favorite nation of privileges denied to others, which is apt doubly to injure the nation making the concessions by unnecessarily parting with what ought to have been retained, and by exciting jealousy, ill will, and a disposition to retaliate in the parties from whom equal privileges are withheld"
"Taking care always to keep ourselves by suitable establishments on a respectable defensive posture, we may safely trust to temporary alliances for extraordinary emergencies."
"likewise, they will avoid the necessity of those overgrown military establishments which, under any form of government, are inauspicious to liberty, and which are to be regarded as particularly hostile to republican liberty."
"So, likewise, a passionate attachment of one nation for another produces a variety of evils. Sympathy for the favorite nation, facilitating the illusion of an imaginary common interest in cases where no real common interest exists, and infusing into one the enmities of the other, betrays the former into a participation in the quarrels and wars of the latter without adequate inducement or justification. It leads also to concessions to the favorite nation of privileges denied to others, which is apt doubly to injure the nation making the concessions by unnecessarily parting with what ought to have been retained, and by exciting jealousy, ill will, and a disposition to retaliate in the parties from whom equal privileges are withheld"
"Taking care always to keep ourselves by suitable establishments on a respectable defensive posture, we may safely trust to temporary alliances for extraordinary emergencies."
"likewise, they will avoid the necessity of those overgrown military establishments which, under any form of government, are inauspicious to liberty, and which are to be regarded as particularly hostile to republican liberty."
You call it whatever you want. I call it war. Hamas is the cause of this and they don't give a damn about the people of Gaza...who by the way brought them into power. I hate that any innocent lives are lost, but I refuse to say Israel should just back down and let those jackasses keep killing them.
It's a tough situation. If because of my religion my house could be demolished with no due process and i was denied other rights of property ownership, I might be motivated towards hatred and violence. Of course as a white European there is a chance such behavior would have been glorified...unless maybe I had been Irish prior to the last century or so.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
But there is a difference between war and genocide or ethnic cleansing.
If this is war then what is Israel doing to defeat Hamas? Reports are saying that Israel hasn't substantially changed Hamas' capability. That shows that the point isn't actually to defeat Hamas. We see that with the reports describing all the great real estate deals coming up in Gaza that are being discussed even now. 2/3s of the people killed are women and children. Israel reports the same thing. So the facts on the ground are very damning. Now Israel has a policy of killing journalists purposefully. That was considered a war crime up until the time Israel started doing it.
This isn't a binary. The choice isn't between letting Hamas run roughshod and committing repeated 10/7s or killing every last Palestinian. There is an infinite number of possibilities in between those poles. All I'm saying is back off from one pole and don't get close to the other one. That means a complicated, balance of interests with intermittent cases of violence but overall more peace, more prosperity, and more justice.
I know who voted for Hamas. But how far do you want to go back in the history? October 7, 2023? 2007? 1948? 1900? Because where you start will determine much about what you think about the situation. I would probably start at the modern Zionist movement and the early 20th Century. But I can go back into the BCs too.
You got it backward, but deep down you know that.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Yeah. That is good perspective. Looking at the both sides to see what is motivating them and how maybe to appease them is the way to go.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
No. I simply understand the history. You gave the justification that Israel uses, but you are unaware that Gazans use the same exact logic. This what I am talking about, a complete and willful refusal to look at both sides.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Golda was good at dehumanizing her enemies.
They definitely are linked, but in your case, they are not only inconsistent, they are against each other. If enacted, your foreign policy would nullify your domestic policy.
Superficially, yes, but practically, no. In the 1790s, the Middle East may well have been Neptune, and the US may as well have been Lichtenstein. US interests are much broader now. I'm not saying Washington would support every war the US has engaged, but I don't think he'd be indifferent to a region that has a massive impact on US energy access (irrelevant in his day) and access to foreign markets.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
I disagree absolutely and completely. I understand how the two are linked and how one feeds the other. The things I say actually support both at the same time.
Well, I agree with the actual words these guys wrote and their actual viewpoints. If you want to assume they would not hold to their principles and fall in line with the Neoconservative innovations of post WW2 foreign policy, I guess you have some kind of supernatural ability. I will have to stick with the actual things they wrote and ideas they thought.
Biden will order the US Military to build a make shift port in Gaza, at which ships can dock and offload truck fulls of food and relief supplies. The early reports make it sound like Israel is ok with this and will even help us coordinate to make it happen. As far as I know, the Sea Bees still “have it” and will get this big job done in short order.
The lingering concern is that Hamas will find a way to obtain and control the distribution of food and supplies.
The lingering concern is that Hamas will find a way to obtain and control the distribution of food and supplies.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
This is probably going to facilitate Western countries taking Palestinians to the US and Europe. More immigrants coming folks!
I just finished reading a good book on the Irish potato famine. British authorities delayed aid while thousands died of disease and starvation so they could design a system that assured the impoverished Irish would not resell the food. Worked out a system with soup kichens where the hungry ate soup in shifts with bowls and spoons chained to tables.
Horn2RunAgain
2,500+ Posts
Dana Perino said it best
Hamas goes into Israel and kills, rapes, and takes Americans hostage . They're in their tunnels right now saying "wow! We did these acts of terrorism and get a port, to boot! Awesome "
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
It's not really a war though, right? There is only one government and one army. The one army gets money and weapons from the most powerful military in the world. This is ethnic cleansing.
One more bit of evidence piled on top of the rest of it. The one army goes into homes and kills noncombatants in cold blood, then celebrates. In any other "war" this would be considered a war crime.
One more bit of evidence piled on top of the rest of it. The one army goes into homes and kills noncombatants in cold blood, then celebrates. In any other "war" this would be considered a war crime.
Monahorns
10,000+ Posts
Doesn't Scotty know that Israel doesn't want the hostages back? They killed some of them already and ended all negotiations for them.
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