Way too early democrat primary thread

Larry T Spider said:
I think it speaks to a portion of the dem base trying so desperately to not support Hillary that they will turn to any other dem. If somebody more viable than sanders gets some traction, I really think hrc could be in trouble.
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Liz Warren was their great hope. She brought the same appeal as Sanders brings but didn't always look like she just got out of bed.
 
As much as I'd like to like Biden, the guy is a buffoon. Not only that, he creates a legit security nightmare for the country by commuting to his Delaware home rather than living in the Naval Observatory. I know he wants to be a "regular Joe" but there has to be some component of self sacrifice for high level public service.
 
Biden will jump in soon- just waiting for the final HRC implosion. Even the most loyal Dems are starting to openly question her honesty and unwillingness to answer questions.
 
Crockett said:
As much as I'd like to like Biden, the guy is a buffoon. Not only that, he creates a legit security nightmare for the country by commuting to his Delaware home rather than living in the Naval Observatory.
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I'm not sure that buffoonery matters as much as perceived buffoonery. The media likes Biden, so they just portray him as lovable Uncle Joe when he says goofy things. Republican partisans think he's a buffoon, but they'd think that regardless of whether he actually was. Most other people don't think he is.

As for his residence, I didn't know that he commuted from Delaware. I'd be shocked if he didn't move into the White House of he actually won the presidency.
 
theiioftx said:
Biden will jump in soon- just waiting for the final HRC implosion. Even the most loyal Dems are starting to openly question her honesty and unwillingness to answer questions.
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He'd fill the void that Jim Webb is trying to fill. He'd try to attract middle and lower middle class white voters who have started voting Republican in the last few years. Even though I think Webb is a decent guy, Biden is a lot more charismatic and would probably be more successful at attracting those voters.
 
Here's a link to the Dowd article discussed in the other link. Biden has his issues, but I think he'd be a tougher opponent than Hillary. She is sketchy, uninspiring, aloof, and has questionable motives. Biden is affable, has a remarkable personal story of overcoming tragedy, and people don't question his integrity or patriotism. Also, though I think he's older than HRC, he seems younger. Maybe it's his persona or his hair transplant, but he just doesn't seem as old.
 
I have trouble seeing Biden jump in this late in the game. The war chest that Hillary has build must be seen as insurmountable, unfortunately. Though she's all the things we've stated on this thread, I don't see the Clintons going quietly. I doubt Biden has the backing that Obama did to step out of the Clinton line and oppose them. Simply, Biden can't remotely tap the "hope and change" grass roots element that Obama rode to the office. None of the candidates on the left can.

I don't see Hillary winning but I think Bill would sacrifice nearly everything to get Hillary into the White House, including a torch and burn approach to the Democratic Party.
 
Seattle Husker said:
I have trouble seeing Biden jump in this late in the game. The war chest that Hillary has build must be seen as insurmountable, unfortunately. Though she's all the things we've stated on this thread, I don't see the Clintons going quietly. I doubt Biden has the backing that Obama did to step out of the Clinton line and oppose them. Simply, Biden can't remotely tap the "hope and change" grass roots element that Obama rode to the office. None of the candidates on the left can.

I don't see Hillary winning but I think Bill would sacrifice nearly everything to get Hillary into the White House, including a torch and burn approach to the Democratic Party.
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You may be right. HRC is undoubtedly still pissed about what happened in 2008, and if there's a chance of her being denied again in 2016 (which would presumably be her last shot at the White House), she and Bill would probably raise holy hell.
 
Hrc has money, but I'm not sure that's going to help her overcome her high negatives. Money helps more to get your brand out there, especially if you are relatively unknown. Everybody knows hrc, her history, and her brand already. Many have decided they don't like it and are unlikely to change their mind. I think some dems are starting to realize that she will be a tough sell in the general and are looking for another direction to go. There just aren't many compelling options at the moment. Hell, people on my Facebook are jumping on the sanders wagon just to avoid her.
 
I see the same Sanders bandwagon on Facebook. Hillary hasn't started to use her warchest yet. She hasn't had to. As soon as she begins to use that $$$ the numbers will turn around slightly. To date she's been letting the media shape her perception. If/when she goes on offense that will be neutralized a bit. With that said, I sincerely hope I'm wrong and someone other than Hillary is the Democratic nominee.
 
Joe Biden as president? Sounds like the genesis of a really good comedy movie, though with Leslie Nielsen passed on to the next plane, what character actor can we find goofy enough to play Joe Biden?
 
theiioftx said:
HRC has much bigger trouble than losing to a Socialist.
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This is undoubtedly one of the reasons she's losing to a Socialist.

Prediction - nothing severely incriminating will be found on the server. Clinton apologists in the media and elsewhere will blab that there's "no evidence" of wrongdoing and call it a "fake scandal." Republicans will understandably and probably rightly assume that anything incriminating would have been deleted from the server in the 5 months she delayed turning it over and question why she'd have the private server for government use and why she'd delay if she wasn't hiding something. In classic Clinton fashion, she has acted very guilty but will leave no way to prove nor disprove her guilt one way or the other.
 
I expect you are right, but this will haunt HRC. Would the average person get the same treatment from a federal investigation? I expect Trump and the Republican nominee will be all over that if she survives through the primary.
 
I'll type up my reasoning when I have a chance but this time of year is really busy for me. I am becoming convinced that hrc has real problems and will not be the next potus. In short, I think she is going to lose momentum in the primary, continue to be unrelatable (high negatives) and face a candidate in the general from a swing state. Certain key demographics likely won't turn out well for her and I'm not sure women are as in love with her as people think.
 
Larry T Spider said:
Certain key demographics likely won't turn out well for her and I'm not sure women are as in love with her as people think.
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You're right. The identity politics racket will work with some women but not most, and those women who do vote with their genitals are almost entirely staunch Democrats anyway. They're already turning out, and they're already blindly voting Democratic.
 
Interesting article on HRCs campaign team and silly strategies. I've never understood why campaigns announce when they're going to make changes to the candidate's personality or other superficialities. It basically admits that the candidate is a phony.
 
Based on the Sunday morning news shows, the HRC campaign didn't expect it to sound so contrived even though it is. How can it not sound that way? Is this a situation where they are spoon-feeding a storyline to the press and one of the more rare occurrences where the press actually questions what they are being fed?
 
More news on HRC, her support among Democratic women is in free fall - now at 42 percent. Link. I just don't see how she wins the nomination without stronger support from her biggest constituency. Furthermore, even if she gets the nomination, I don't see how she wins the general without enthusiastic sorry and turnout from this same group.
 
the server has likely been shaped now, over the past X amount of months in preparation, to show what HRC wants it to show now that the typical Clinton BS didn't work to make it go away. This is plan B. The only hope for rationality is that the FBI doesn't fall for the BS and does their job.
 
Bernie Sanders spoke at Liberty University and apparently was well received. It took balls both to invite him and for him to show up. Even conservatives can't help but respect the guy for being real. He may be wrong, but at least he's not a fraud.
 
Don't have a link, but read a report stating that his proposals would cost 18 trillion over the course of a decade. Not sure if numbers matter at all in a dem primary, but they are so glaring that I think some will come to their senses about him. Others just dont like HRC and dont really think that he would get everything that he wants so they can go along with it I guess.
 
Larry T Spider said:
Don't have a link, but read a report stating that his proposals would cost 18 trillion over the course of a decade. Not sure if numbers matter at all in a dem primary, but they are so glaring that I think some will come to their senses about him. Others just dont like HRC and dont really think that he would get everything that he wants so they can go along with it I guess.
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in a primary, nobody's going to care just like they don't care about tax cut proposals' costs in GOP primaries. They'll say just to tax the wealthy harder to pay for the proposals. Furthermore, your average primary voter is too dumb to know if $18T is a lot of money anyway.
 
Larry T Spider said:
Not sure if numbers matter at all in a dem primary, but they are so glaring that I think some will come to their senses about him.
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I think the "anybody but a Washington D.C insider" mantra that has the Republicans literally running towards any outsider with a pulse is taking hold in the Democrats too. Then again, it could simply be that Dems simply aren't enamored with HRC. Dem primary voters crave authenticity. Obama recognized this and rode it to the Whitehouse. Heck, Bill Clinton had an uncanny ability to show act authentic. HRC has none of this. The fact that she has to play up her role as a Grandmother and Mother to be "authentic" shows just how vapid she really is. I've long suspected she's been the ambitious one behind Billy. It's why she forgave him after the Lewisky scandal. It's why she ran for office immediately after his term ended. She's been pushing Billy for years and now wants the limelight to herself.
 
Seattle Husker said:
I think the "anybody but a Washington D.C insider" mantra that has the Republicans literally running towards any outsider with a pulse is taking hold in the Democrats too. Then again, it could simply be that Dems simply aren't enamored with HRC. Dem primary voters crave authenticity. Obama recognized this and rode it to the Whitehouse. Heck, Bill Clinton had an uncanny ability to show act authentic. HRC has none of this. The fact that she has to play up her role as a Grandmother and Mother to be "authentic" shows just how vapid she really is. I've long suspected she's been the ambitious one behind Billy. It's why she forgave him after the Lewisky scandal. It's why she ran for office immediately after his term ended. She's been pushing Billy for years and now wants the limelight to herself.
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Agree with all of this. She just isn't that likable. It never really mattered because she was seen as competent and trustworthy to dems. I don't mean trustworthy in an honest way, its more that they trusted her to be able to get the job done. That has faded some with the recent scandals and when combined with how unlikable she is, its a recipe for uncle Bernie.
 
All Bernie has to do is raise the deficit in year one by about 5 trillion and then work it down to about only 2.5 more each year say in year 3. Then he can run on the theme that he cut the budget deficit in HALF! Hey, it worked for Obama.
 
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