Sooners and BCS bowls

All the sooners like Dgnr8, notreally , Octavian...

I think there is some kind of misunderstanding. The question I want to know is, you would honestly rather lose a BCS bowl than win another bowl?

Don't read into this, there aren't trade offs. Don't rationalize other scenarios. I have not motioned, MNCs, Conference champs, total win loss, etc. I’m not saying if you took the lower bowl that means your team was worse. I’m not saying if you took the better bowl your team was better. Everyone wants to play in the best bowl possible, they want to play the best team in the country. That is not my question, that is not my point.

I just want to know straight up, would you honesty rather lose in a BCS bowl than win win the Cotton or Holiday bowl?


IMHO
There is zero glory in losing.
 
texasjack,

your hypothetical isn't really relative since we don't know we are going to lose before we play.

however, would i rather take the chance to a "for sure" win in say the Holiday or Cotton (two respected non bcs bowls)? no.

see, you are only looking at the final result. which, last year meant an asskicking at the hands of west virginia. however, there is a lot more to the BCS experience.

-there is the coverage of your team nationally.
-there is the excitement of getting to play the champion (most likely) of another conference.
-there is the tradition and pageantry of playing in the rose, orange, fiesta, or sugar.
-there is the pride that you have accomplished something in order to get there (usually a conference championship but not always).
-there is something different about getting to play in a high profile game against another high profile opponent (again, not always).

there is a lot more that goes into the reasoning behind playing in those type of games rather than not. it hurts like hell when we lose to texas, but does that mean that i would rather play aTm in the cotton bowl every year instead? sure, we would win a lot more of them... but you lose something when you aren't striving to play the very best team that you can have the opportunity to play. it is the same reasoning that goes into playing a traditional power in OOC play. i, as a fan, welcome the competition. that is what this is about. it is not about playing the houston's and central floridas. it is about playing texas, tennessee, notre dame, nebraska. those are the games you want. the likelihood of meeting one of those teams in a BCS bowl is high, and the chances they will be good when you play them in a BCS bowl is also high (save FSU).

so your hypothetical is too simplistic. would i rather have played Iowa in the alamo and won, or BSU in the fiesta and lose? without a doubt, BSU.

however, i would gladly trade the USC NC game loss for your win over michigan in the rose. but only in hindsight. the game isn't played or enjoyed in hindsight texasjack.
 
I'd rather go to a BCS game and lose. As mentioned above, the question changes if the loss is a blowout.

I would rather win a second-tier bowl game (Holiday, Chic-Fil-A, Outback, Capital One, Cotton) than lose a BCS game by three touchdowns. Being in the best bowl game should obviously be the goal, but getting embarrassed is never good. Remember the Fiesta against Penn State? I would have rather won the Alamo Bowl that year after upsetting Nebraska.

The important thing, though, is that you would always rather play in the big game if you have a choice beforehand. You should always choose to measure yourself against a great opponent if possible.
 
To me, the question is what does it do to your future. The biggest impact is probably recruiting.

I would rather spin "we won the conference and played on the biggest stage and came up short" than "we lost our conference but really killed them in the Holiday bowl". Recruits consistently say playing for championships is very important. A recruit for sure would rather have the opportunity to play in a BCS game than a lower tier bowl. So I would say it is better to lose a BCS game than win a lower tier bowl.
 
Winning is always better than getting blown out. I would rather narrowly beat App State (What's up wolverines?) than have to face another Route 66 or equivalent to some of OU's recent bowl misery. After all, winning is, well, winning and losing losing. I would also rather win conference championships than lose them. Winning beating losing and all.

We rag on A&M fans all the time for their moral victories. What the heck is cherishing losing in a big game over winning a "lesser" one if not a POS moral victory? A close loss in a national championship game is one example I can imagine of a possibly "good BCS loss." I still go back to what Vince Lombardi said: "Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser." Unless we want to mail our apologies and admission of having been wrong before to the ags, I suggest we call things like they are.

Losing the conference sucks.
Losing anything sucks.
Losing a bowl sucks.
Losing a bowl in front of a national TV audience sucks.
Not all wins are equal, but
Winning does not suck.
 
okay, chance and "for sure" are contradictory. bad choice of words.

still, i would rather lose to boise state in the fiesta bowl than beat the 6-6 iowa team in the alamo.

that may not be the case every year.

would you rather lose to ohio state in a close game at the shoe, or would you rather have a win against arkie state?

i have a feeling you would prefer the latter. and this is the difference between you and me. i'm glad you are not our AD.
 
What is this .. "losing a BCS bowl?"

laugh.gif
 
This is somewhat depended on the team(s) in the BCS bowl. Due to the structure, tie-ins, and conference limits the best 8 teams are not necessarily the 8 BCS bowl teams. Notre Dame in the 2006 Sugar Bowl comes to mind as does Boise St.

If OU was winning those BCS games they wouldn't be pumping up conference titles so much. The OU fans would be saying BSC wins are the measuring stick.
 
Sooners, don't forget your lofty place as second in probations and actions taken. Your wins are tainted and this is flat out fact. I am far from jealous of Sooner victories or banners because they are so tainted it is disgusting. You can hem and haw and make excuses but the facts don't lie.

Your program is the second most cheating program of all time. It is rife, historically, with cheating and problems. Again, facts do not lie. So enjoy your denial based chest pumping. The nation and college football world knows the truth. When you stop jamming your fingers in your ears and yelling "lalala I can't hear you", you will see too.



tongue.gif
 
Then,. how about an equally compelling question for our hillbilly neighbors.

If you are an OU fan, would you rather:

1). Have your 7 national championships mixed in with your numerous probations which include, television bans, bowl bans, scholarships taken away, a coach who admitted he spied on his rival after previously lying about it, who admitted to paying players to remain at your school, and players who historically were involved in shooting guns in dorms, raping and cocaine dealing, thereby branding your school on a national scale as one of the most probation laden institutions in NCAA history? or
2). Have 4 national championships with no probations involving loss of television rights or revenue, no lost bowl games and with a much better image and reputation nationwide?

You have to choose one of the two. Which one is it?
 
Octavian-You miss the whole point! Are the accomplishments there withhout the Cheater's Drum? Many out there in the college football world believe NO! I hope many of you don't vacation in Indiana this summer because you could be shot on site for blessing them with Sampson. Sure they hired him, but you cultivated and groomed him and he was fine at blow u. They loved him and let's see, are you on probation right now? Both sports?
 
hornfans are very predictable. here is a perfectly good thread with lots of good opinions and hypotheticals.... and all you can offer is probations smack.... and then i really love this... "criminal player" smack. i got a laugh out of that one.

what's next.... let me guess... academic smack. come on, tell us about your tier 1 university and the endowment. please, i love to hear how you are better than oklahoma in every way except football.... which is of course because of cheating.

you just can't stand it, can you?

it is true. we have cheated in the past. most programs have. are we supposed to just forget about the badass football teams we have had because there was some of that stuff going on? every single team in the SEC has paid players to come play at their university and while it certainly is nothing to be proud of, it doesn't make alabama any less of a traditional football powerhouse. so sit up there on your pedestal and.... no wait... we are on the pedastal. ... you sit up there on your high horse.

thanks for ruining a pretty good thread btw.
 
notreally.. your medication must be off today. Just once.. just once time, I would love to hear a hardcore sooner supporter say, "Yes, I am embarrassed about our history of indiscretions, how we were banned from being on television.. how we missed bowl games, because we cheated and were caught. And, whereas I will not apologize for our championships, I am aware of this history and if history repeats itself, I will be the first one in line to crucify the appropriate parties." Instead, we get the same, tired, crap.. "wah wah wah.. well EVERYONE does it, we just got caught." again.... and again... and again... and again... and again and again.

Where is the indignation about proven past transgressions? When the latest Big Red scandal happened, where was the "oh no, not again! What does it take to keep our alumni and supporters in line?!"

Now, moving back on topic.. first, I don't believe any one doubts that OU should be commended for their BCS appearances. Congratulations. Having said that, OU's history of failure in BCS bowls should be a cause for great concern amongst OU types, and fodder for schadenfreude elation amongst Longhorn faithful.

Finally, as to the question asked earlier in this thread, would I take a conference championship and then a BCS bowl loss, or would I take a loss to OU and a BCS bowl win... there are many variables which need to be answered. First, is that bowl loss for the MNC? Even without all of the relevant facts, I do know this.. it is very difficult to top the elation of a BCS bowl win.
 
Yes, I am embarrassed about our history of indiscretions. And, whereas I will not apologize for our championships, I am aware of this history and if history repeats itself, I will be the first one in line to crucify the appropriate parties

There I said it. And I know tons of Sooners that feel the same way. Most Sooners, including myself, feel like most of the other powerhouses were giving above and beyond the normal scholarships at the time. I am fairly sure that most will agree here. Hell, just look at the SWC. TONS of cheating going on in that conference. It is true that I don't feel too much guilt for the cheating in the 70's and 80's because it was a level playing field in my opinion. Alabama, Auburn, FSU, Miami, Houston, aTm, Colorado.... the list goes on and on and on. At one time, Baylor was the only school in the old Southwest Conference not on probation. Texas was never caught doing anything too big, and I am not accusing them of doing so, but there were accusations from other schools/players and that is public knowledge. I think Royal, although an *******, was a stand up guy and I sincerely don't believe he or Mack would approve of anything like that. I think it is safe to say that Switzer embraced it somewhat.

But you bring up Big Red Sports interestingly enough. Just as I think Royal can sleep at night, I believe Bob Stoops can sleep at night. That was an ******** jocksniffer that wanted to hook up the players at OU. He wanted to be cool. They were already playing at OU and didn't need extra incentive to stay there. So in this case, acting like the university was in on it is not accurate.

That being said, the people in charge of monitoring this stuff failed miserably. miserably. They should have been fired. The funny thing is, you are surrounded by anti OU talk most of the time.... so in your mind you think that all the fans at OU were okay with this.

THEY WEREN'T. The dude got death threats and couldn't show his face around OKC for some time. People were pissed. But you wouldn't know that, because you probably don't go to OU boards and you probably didn't bother to check. You just assume because we are not groveling over past infractions that we all just said "everyone was doing it".

We (SoonerFans) didn't do that at all. We were pissed because we believed we were doing all of this the right way. Today's game is different, at least in the big12 and I expect our team and university to play by the rules.

I don't know of any Sooner fans that disagree with that. But that doesn't fit your stereotype so I am sure you will disregard.
 
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