PITCHING
- Thread starter Chop
- Start date
Takes from Game 2 of the Manhattan series:
Zane Morehouse -- an off day. Still showing the tendency to dig holes and then have to dig himself out of them. It wasn't so much that Zane was getting behind in the counts, its just that he kept putting men no base with no outs or one outs. He's our guy as a weekend starter and a legitimate Big 12 weekend starter no doubt, although LBJ might make a move up if he keeps throwing like he's been throwing. If that happens, then either Zane or Sthele may be starting mid-week games.
Max Grubbs -- living dangerously today, but no damage. Beaned a man, then didn't do anything else wrong. He gave up a really weird infield hit that would have been an impossible play for the pitcher to make -- effectively, it was a bunt. Then Grubbs turned in a great fielding play scooping up a very short grounder and flipping it to Galvan at the plate for an out. Grubbs gave up zero runs, so all's well that ends well. Grubbs preserved his 0.00 ERA. Grubbs isn't the 2nd coming of Roger Clemens, but what Grubbs is (for this year at least) is a guy who can come in, throw strikes, and get a bunch of ground outs. I think this year he'll be one of our most valuable middle relievers, and will likely be used about like Burke is being used now. Long-term, Grubbs has starter written all over him. As Geno Gordon put it in his interview today: Grubbs is "a strike-thrower who gets A LOT of ground outs." Gordon then favorably compared Grubbs to Tristan Stevens.
David Shaw -- this was an off day for Shaw. Worst he's done this year. Surrendered 2 runs. Shaw did get screwed by some rare Errors by Daly (only one of them was scored an Error on the books, the other..........well, anyone watching the game would have considered it an error). Still, Shaw is probably one of our top 2 go-to guys in relief right now, the other being Burke.
Heston Tole -- Good outing today. Ate innings without giving up runs and sustaining damage. His stock is rising. Another one of our go-to guys. His breaking ball was crossing the plate and getting outs. He also strikes me as a smart pitcher.
Zane Morehouse -- an off day. Still showing the tendency to dig holes and then have to dig himself out of them. It wasn't so much that Zane was getting behind in the counts, its just that he kept putting men no base with no outs or one outs. He's our guy as a weekend starter and a legitimate Big 12 weekend starter no doubt, although LBJ might make a move up if he keeps throwing like he's been throwing. If that happens, then either Zane or Sthele may be starting mid-week games.
Max Grubbs -- living dangerously today, but no damage. Beaned a man, then didn't do anything else wrong. He gave up a really weird infield hit that would have been an impossible play for the pitcher to make -- effectively, it was a bunt. Then Grubbs turned in a great fielding play scooping up a very short grounder and flipping it to Galvan at the plate for an out. Grubbs gave up zero runs, so all's well that ends well. Grubbs preserved his 0.00 ERA. Grubbs isn't the 2nd coming of Roger Clemens, but what Grubbs is (for this year at least) is a guy who can come in, throw strikes, and get a bunch of ground outs. I think this year he'll be one of our most valuable middle relievers, and will likely be used about like Burke is being used now. Long-term, Grubbs has starter written all over him. As Geno Gordon put it in his interview today: Grubbs is "a strike-thrower who gets A LOT of ground outs." Gordon then favorably compared Grubbs to Tristan Stevens.
David Shaw -- this was an off day for Shaw. Worst he's done this year. Surrendered 2 runs. Shaw did get screwed by some rare Errors by Daly (only one of them was scored an Error on the books, the other..........well, anyone watching the game would have considered it an error). Still, Shaw is probably one of our top 2 go-to guys in relief right now, the other being Burke.
Heston Tole -- Good outing today. Ate innings without giving up runs and sustaining damage. His stock is rising. Another one of our go-to guys. His breaking ball was crossing the plate and getting outs. He also strikes me as a smart pitcher.
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As of 3/13/2023
Starters:
(Starter and Reliever Ace status indicated in bold)
Pitcher.....ERA....WHIP..SO...Walks
Gordon......1.77.....1.08....25......11
LBJ...............2.50.....1.33....20......7
Morehouse.3.71.....1.59....18......9
Sthele..........5.40.....1.36....17.....4
Relievers:
Pitcher.....ERA...WHIP..SO..Walks
Grubbs.......0.00.....0.67.....1......0
Ace W.........0.00......0.50....4......0
Howard......0.00......1.00....3......1
Shaw..........0.90......0.90...16.....2
Hurley.........2.30......1.02...14.....5
Tole.............2.57......1.29...11.....1
Lummus......2.70......0.90....2......2
Burke..........3.24......1.20....8......2
DuP.............3.38......1.31....6......4
Stuart..........5.87......1.83...10.....8
Walbridge...12.00....3.00....4......2
George........27.00.....4.00....1......2
LBJ has been making a statement thus far. I hope he is heard.
Gordon is Gordon = the best starting pitcher in the Big 12--AGAIN
Morehouse -- good, but not exceptional stats thus far
Relievers' low WHIPs, AND LOW WALKS, are great news!
Shaw's on fire. Sub 1.00 ERA and WHIP. 16 Strikeouts with 2 Walks.
DuPlantier isn't nearly as bad as a lot of people on the boards make him out to be. It's just that, when he has a bad inning, he has a BAD inning. Overall, his stats thus far aren't good, but they're ok. Woodrow's got to find a way to utilize DuP and keep his mind in the game. As other posters have pointed out, DuP's strength is his breaking stuff--not his fastball. Maybe he should just go out there a few innings and throw almost all breaking stuff. It seems like that's what Tole (and Hurley) do a lot of the time, and it's working pretty well for them.
Before conference play hits: More Ace Whitehead, more Grubbs, more Howard, and let's see Minchey and O'Banan. By giving Grubbs and Ace Whitehead shots in recent games, we've "discovered" that we have a couple more good relievers--something we're going to need a lot of. Gotta check out Minchey and O'Banan in real game action too. George should get an occasional shot in blow outs to get his stuff together in real games. Big dude throws really hard. Remember, Nolan Ryan wasn't exactly known for his control--especially early on in his career.
Stuart's struggling lately. The dam burst on the Dutchman.
Starters:
(Starter and Reliever Ace status indicated in bold)
Pitcher.....ERA....WHIP..SO...Walks
Gordon......1.77.....1.08....25......11
LBJ...............2.50.....1.33....20......7
Morehouse.3.71.....1.59....18......9
Sthele..........5.40.....1.36....17.....4
Relievers:
Pitcher.....ERA...WHIP..SO..Walks
Grubbs.......0.00.....0.67.....1......0
Ace W.........0.00......0.50....4......0
Howard......0.00......1.00....3......1
Shaw..........0.90......0.90...16.....2
Hurley.........2.30......1.02...14.....5
Tole.............2.57......1.29...11.....1
Lummus......2.70......0.90....2......2
Burke..........3.24......1.20....8......2
DuP.............3.38......1.31....6......4
Stuart..........5.87......1.83...10.....8
Walbridge...12.00....3.00....4......2
George........27.00.....4.00....1......2
LBJ has been making a statement thus far. I hope he is heard.
Gordon is Gordon = the best starting pitcher in the Big 12--AGAIN
Morehouse -- good, but not exceptional stats thus far
Relievers' low WHIPs, AND LOW WALKS, are great news!
Shaw's on fire. Sub 1.00 ERA and WHIP. 16 Strikeouts with 2 Walks.
DuPlantier isn't nearly as bad as a lot of people on the boards make him out to be. It's just that, when he has a bad inning, he has a BAD inning. Overall, his stats thus far aren't good, but they're ok. Woodrow's got to find a way to utilize DuP and keep his mind in the game. As other posters have pointed out, DuP's strength is his breaking stuff--not his fastball. Maybe he should just go out there a few innings and throw almost all breaking stuff. It seems like that's what Tole (and Hurley) do a lot of the time, and it's working pretty well for them.
Before conference play hits: More Ace Whitehead, more Grubbs, more Howard, and let's see Minchey and O'Banan. By giving Grubbs and Ace Whitehead shots in recent games, we've "discovered" that we have a couple more good relievers--something we're going to need a lot of. Gotta check out Minchey and O'Banan in real game action too. George should get an occasional shot in blow outs to get his stuff together in real games. Big dude throws really hard. Remember, Nolan Ryan wasn't exactly known for his control--especially early on in his career.
Stuart's struggling lately. The dam burst on the Dutchman.
As of the morning of The Ides of March, 2023:
Team pitching in the Big 12 (by ERA):
Tech....................3.16
Texas..................3.18
WV.......................4.20
Kansas.................4.25
OU.......................4.37
TCU......................4.47
OSU.....................4.50
KSU......................4.60
Baylor..................6.79
That's pretty impressive for Tech and UT. Then there's a big drop off of over 1 point to the middle-dwellers led by WV. OSU will have a hard time challenging for the title with a 4.50 ERA. They're going to have to light up the scoreboards (which they may very well do...).
Big 12 Conference
Team pitching in the Big 12 (by ERA):
Tech....................3.16
Texas..................3.18
WV.......................4.20
Kansas.................4.25
OU.......................4.37
TCU......................4.47
OSU.....................4.50
KSU......................4.60
Baylor..................6.79
That's pretty impressive for Tech and UT. Then there's a big drop off of over 1 point to the middle-dwellers led by WV. OSU will have a hard time challenging for the title with a 4.50 ERA. They're going to have to light up the scoreboards (which they may very well do...).
Big 12 Conference
(cross-posted from another thread)
Hurley's pretty good. For some reason, some seem to be really skeptical of Hurley.
Hurley had a 4.19 ERA last year at USC, and a 4.29 ERA in 2020. These are above-average college ERAs. Not great, but pretty good. He held down a weekend starting position at USC in the PAC 12 (which is not much off the Big 12, maybe better this year). This year, he has more innings than Gordon with a lower ERA (thus far).
Actually, Hurley's numbers this year are really good.
as of 3/15/2023
1.71 ERA (1.77 Gordon)
1.00 WHIP (1.08 Gordon)
in 21.0 inning pitched (20.1 Gordon)
19 Strikeouts (25 Gordon)
7 Walks (11 Gordon)
0.187 opponents' batting avg (0.162 Gordon)
It seems that Hurley's the one knocking on the door for a weekend starter spot. Although Coach may see Hurley as too valuable as a workhorse middle reliever / setup man.
If we had 3 Hurley clones for our weekend starters, we'd probably still be the best pitching staff in the Big 12. By the numbers, it would be like having a 2nd Gordon.
2023 Baseball Cumulative Statistics - University of Texas Athletics
Hurley's pretty good. For some reason, some seem to be really skeptical of Hurley.
Hurley had a 4.19 ERA last year at USC, and a 4.29 ERA in 2020. These are above-average college ERAs. Not great, but pretty good. He held down a weekend starting position at USC in the PAC 12 (which is not much off the Big 12, maybe better this year). This year, he has more innings than Gordon with a lower ERA (thus far).
Actually, Hurley's numbers this year are really good.
as of 3/15/2023
1.71 ERA (1.77 Gordon)
1.00 WHIP (1.08 Gordon)
in 21.0 inning pitched (20.1 Gordon)
19 Strikeouts (25 Gordon)
7 Walks (11 Gordon)
0.187 opponents' batting avg (0.162 Gordon)
It seems that Hurley's the one knocking on the door for a weekend starter spot. Although Coach may see Hurley as too valuable as a workhorse middle reliever / setup man.
If we had 3 Hurley clones for our weekend starters, we'd probably still be the best pitching staff in the Big 12. By the numbers, it would be like having a 2nd Gordon.
2023 Baseball Cumulative Statistics - University of Texas Athletics
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3/15 - 2nd game vs NDSU
Most pitchers we put in there were way off, and we put in quite a few. We put lots of runners on the bags. A little bit of good fortune kept many of them from being driven in to score.
Forgettable nights:
Ace Whitehead
Grubbs (screwed himself with an error)
DuPlantier (beaned a batter)
even Shaw was off last night
Howard did so-so, then Morehouse had to come in to get the save in the 9th inning.
Weird game. We were fortunate to keep them to only 4 runs. And our bats did their job with 7 runs scored on 10 hits, including 3 homeruns (Campbell and Kennedy x2). We'll take the win how we can get it. A 'W' is a 'W'.
Most pitchers we put in there were way off, and we put in quite a few. We put lots of runners on the bags. A little bit of good fortune kept many of them from being driven in to score.
Forgettable nights:
Ace Whitehead
Grubbs (screwed himself with an error)
DuPlantier (beaned a batter)
even Shaw was off last night
Howard did so-so, then Morehouse had to come in to get the save in the 9th inning.
Weird game. We were fortunate to keep them to only 4 runs. And our bats did their job with 7 runs scored on 10 hits, including 3 homeruns (Campbell and Kennedy x2). We'll take the win how we can get it. A 'W' is a 'W'.
But even he used over 25 pitches to do so. Our pitchers sure do seem to use a lot of pitches.
Yep.
I'm waiting for one of our pitchers to complete 8 innings. I'd even take 7 innings. Or just give me 6 innings for crying out loud. Then a set up man for 2 innings, and a closer for the 9th.
2023 Baseball Cumulative Statistics - University of Texas Athletics
Based on both WHIP and ERA (each, only considering the guys with lots of innings pitched), our 3 weekend starters should be:
Gordon
Hurley
LBJ
Based on both WHIP and ERA (each, only considering the guys with lots of innings pitched), our 3 weekend starters should be:
Gordon
Hurley
LBJ
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I’ve noticed the same thing with the Tech pitching staff…high pitch counts. I’ve attributed it to youth of the pitchers, and the maturity (not just age) of the batters we’ve faced. Three up, three down innings aren’t the same as a “quick inning” . Iowa & UTA both fouled off a gazillion pitches each inning.
And if your bullpen is young, most of those guys were starting pitchers in high school. They’re working to develop that reliever mindset they need to be able to walk into various scenarios and pitch out of it. Feels like our bullpen has to walk the first batter they face before getting down to business.
Morning of 3/18/2023
Starters and Potential Starters
..................ERA......WHIP
Gordon......1.37......0.95
Hurley........1.71......1.00
LBJ..............3.05......1.35
Zane...........3.32......1.58 --- mostly being used as our closer now
Sthele.........5.40......1.36
Starters and Potential Starters
..................ERA......WHIP
Gordon......1.37......0.95
Hurley........1.71......1.00
LBJ..............3.05......1.35
Zane...........3.32......1.58 --- mostly being used as our closer now
Sthele.........5.40......1.36
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So, if we were to actually start our best 3 starting pitchers (Gordon, Hurley, and LBJ) for weekend series once conference play starts, our ERA among weekend starters would average 2.04.Morning of 3/18/2023
Starters and Potential Starters
..................ERA......WHIP
Gordon......1.37......0.95
Hurley........1.71......1.00
LBJ..............3.05......1.35
Zane...........3.32......1.58 --- mostly being used as our closer now
Sthele.........5.40......1.36
Even if our bats are lagging, we should take 2 out of 3 of every conference series (and sweep some of them) with a 2.04 ERA among our weekend starters.
An average 2.04 ERA for weekend starters <------- That ain't normal.
It appears that our coaches' philosophy is to go with "better stuff" (Sthele and LBJ) over effectiveness/better stats (Hurley and Tole). I would pick the opposite for our starters (better stats over the "best stuff"). This is baseball, not football. Stats matter--A LOT.
Perhaps their thinking is that we will face better and more sophisticated batters against Tech, OSU, and TCU, so we'll need the guys with the really good stuff on the mound...?
Sthele and LBJ should both do fine. It's good to know we've got potential starters who could be Grade A middle relievers in Hurley and Tole (also Burke and maybe others).
Perhaps their thinking is that we will face better and more sophisticated batters against Tech, OSU, and TCU, so we'll need the guys with the really good stuff on the mound...?
Sthele and LBJ should both do fine. It's good to know we've got potential starters who could be Grade A middle relievers in Hurley and Tole (also Burke and maybe others).
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It seems that the coaches have picked: Gordon, Sthele, and LBJ as our weekend starters going into conference. Hopefully we use all of: Hurley, Tole, and Burke as the go-to middle relievers in the weekend games, with Shaw as the obvious "stopper" and Morehouse as the closer. Hopefully, we can also "reserve" the following young relievers for weekend duty: Whitehead, Grubbs, Lummus, and Howard--each of whom has already shown some good pitching in multiple games.
So who does that leave for our weekday pitchers? Stuart, DuPlantier, and Walbridge look like possibilities with each getting around 3 innings. DuPlantier has pretty good numbers. Stuart doesn't, but the coaches have a lot of trust in him. We all know about Walbridge; I will say his stuff ain't bad. George will also be available, and he needs the experience after a very forgettable start. We can also get innings if necessary from: Whitehead, Grubbs, Lummus, and Howard, but it would be best if those 4 talented youngsters were each available for duty each weekend. Some (or all) of those 4 will likely see action in both weekend and weekday games, but not many innings in any given game.
So who does that leave for our weekday pitchers? Stuart, DuPlantier, and Walbridge look like possibilities with each getting around 3 innings. DuPlantier has pretty good numbers. Stuart doesn't, but the coaches have a lot of trust in him. We all know about Walbridge; I will say his stuff ain't bad. George will also be available, and he needs the experience after a very forgettable start. We can also get innings if necessary from: Whitehead, Grubbs, Lummus, and Howard, but it would be best if those 4 talented youngsters were each available for duty each weekend. Some (or all) of those 4 will likely see action in both weekend and weekday games, but not many innings in any given game.
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As of 3/19/2023
Team pitching in the Big 12 (by ERA):
Texas..................2.81
WV......................3.67
Tech....................3.72
KSU.....................4.32
TCU.....................4.45
OSU.....................4.48
OU.......................4.65 (sux)
Kansas.................4.74
Baylor..................6.38
We're head-and-shoulders above the competition on the mound.
Big 12 Conference
Team pitching in the Big 12 (by ERA):
Texas..................2.81
WV......................3.67
Tech....................3.72
KSU.....................4.32
TCU.....................4.45
OSU.....................4.48
OU.......................4.65 (sux)
Kansas.................4.74
Baylor..................6.38
We're head-and-shoulders above the competition on the mound.
Big 12 Conference
And Coach might hold back a good weekend middle reliever and have him pitching mid-week. Some of the mid-week games are ones we'd really like to win, such as Texas State and aTm. Also, some pitchers may be throwing a fair number of innings during the weekends and also some during the mid-week. There will be some juggling to do, especially that week where we face Texas State twice.
Just one more time...
Per the numbers, Hurley is a weekend starter. Please read the stats yourself. And he has the innings -- it's not just a small sample size.
"Oh, but so-and-so has 'better stuff'" you say -- ah, phooey! Numbers/proven performance >>> "better stuff". This is COLLEGE baseball. Remember, last year, Nixon and (the old) Stewart had the wickedest "stuff" on our team, and they performed terribly in games last year.
2023 Baseball Cumulative Statistics - University of Texas Athletics
Per the numbers, Hurley is a weekend starter. Please read the stats yourself. And he has the innings -- it's not just a small sample size.
"Oh, but so-and-so has 'better stuff'" you say -- ah, phooey! Numbers/proven performance >>> "better stuff". This is COLLEGE baseball. Remember, last year, Nixon and (the old) Stewart had the wickedest "stuff" on our team, and they performed terribly in games last year.
2023 Baseball Cumulative Statistics - University of Texas Athletics
Yes, but that may have something to do with the level of competition. I haven't looked at all the others schedules, but I don't think Manhattan, NO and a school still buried under snow is going to be the same as tech, tcu, Bailor.
I'm thinking I could walk on at NO.
Some of the other Big 12 teams' non-conference opponents are below. Bottom line, everyone (except for TCU) does it. The other Big 12 teams' non-conference schedules look like ours. Only TCU has no pansies.
Tech: Western Illinois, New Mexico, Rice, UTA (actually, not a bad team this year)
Okla St: Cal Baptist, Loyola Marymount, Austin Peay, Utah Tech, Missouri State
OU: Rider, Cal Baptist
WV: Canisius, William & Mary, UNC Greensboro
Baylor: Central Michigan, Youngstown State, Mercer (who swept Baylor), Rice
KU: Oakland (NOT the Oakland A's), Valparaiso Chile
(actually Valparaiso in Indiana...), Belmont, Citadel
Kansas St: Lamar, Stonehill???, Youngstown State, SFA
Tech: Western Illinois, New Mexico, Rice, UTA (actually, not a bad team this year)
Okla St: Cal Baptist, Loyola Marymount, Austin Peay, Utah Tech, Missouri State
OU: Rider, Cal Baptist
WV: Canisius, William & Mary, UNC Greensboro
Baylor: Central Michigan, Youngstown State, Mercer (who swept Baylor), Rice
KU: Oakland (NOT the Oakland A's), Valparaiso Chile
(actually Valparaiso in Indiana...), Belmont, CitadelKansas St: Lamar, Stonehill???, Youngstown State, SFA
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More on a typical non-conference opponent of the other Big 12 teams...
Kansas St played "Stonehill". Bet you've never heard of Stonehill before.
Stonehill College -- a small Catholic liberal arts school in Easton, Mass.
2500 students
In addition to baseball, the Stonehill Skyhawks compete in Lacrosse, Ultimate Frisbee, Golf, Floor Hockey, and Flag Football.
The "inside baseball" -- Stonehill College is a private school for New England Irish Catholic kids who weren't smart enough to get into Holy Cross.
Stonehill College
Stonehill College - Wikipedia
Kansas St played "Stonehill". Bet you've never heard of Stonehill before.
Stonehill College -- a small Catholic liberal arts school in Easton, Mass.
2500 students
In addition to baseball, the Stonehill Skyhawks compete in Lacrosse, Ultimate Frisbee, Golf, Floor Hockey, and Flag Football.
The "inside baseball" -- Stonehill College is a private school for New England Irish Catholic kids who weren't smart enough to get into Holy Cross.
Stonehill College
Stonehill College - Wikipedia
Bottom line: everybody does it (except TCU). The Big 12 schools' non-conference schedules are littered with plenty of crappy teams. We're not unusual. We've done the same as the other conference teams. Only TCU puts no chopped liver on the non-conference menu.
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So, if everyone played only decent (or better) teams in non-conference play, our Team ERA might be 3.4, but WV's would be 4.2, Tech's would be 4.3, KSU's would be 4.9, OSU's would be 5.1, etc.
We'd still be far outpacing the other teams.
Tech’s non-con schedule also includes Iowa, and later in the season Stanford at Stanford, and Grand Canyon. Other than Western Kentucky - I think UT & Tech use the same travel agent and booked most of the same cupcakes this season.
Everybody except TCU went to the Cupcake Bakery for a lot of non-conference foes.
For our tougher non-conference games, we have/had: Vanderbilt, Arkansas, Missouri, LSU, Texas State (twice), aTm, Indiana (just an average team), Air Force (decent team). But we definitely had our share of cupcakes.
LBJ and Stehle both have more upside to me than Hurley or Tole. That doesn't necessarily mean their stats will look better, they need innings to get themselves figured out, LBJ, Stehle, Morehouse and Gordon will put you in position to win as starters. Hurley and Tole are going to get hit and hit hard against the better hitting teams if they have to pitch more than one round through the order. Thats just my opinion. But Hurley and Tole can definitely help as relievers and sure hope they perform like starters. Nice problem to have. We need Witt, T minus 3 weeks and counting till we see him if he's on schedule.
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