If you obstruct yourself from being exonerated when you already knew no collusion existed, can you be prosecuted?
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Mueller Report Finally Released...
- Thread starter Clean
- Start date
They have taken the simple tantrum and turned it into an art form.
First, people in the Trump camp called the whole thing **** before any of that was known. They followed the James Carville playbook. Second, the Mueller investigation was not the same thing as the earlier FBI investigation that relied on the Steele Dossier. The Mueller investigation was a broader matter that likely could have stayed within DoJ had Trump not kept tripping over his own cock.
No, they both relied on speculation. However, I will agree that the other side had the greater confirmation bias. The Democrats basically ran with the story from Day 1, but that's to be expected. Politicians frequently scandal-monger on their opponents.
The ones who really blew their credibility was the media, which just pushed the story relentlessly - probably even harder than Democratic political figures did. The truth and evidence were irrelevant to them, and now they have no reason to be believed. I've never seen more people discredited so overwhelmingly and resoundingly. Basically, the New York Times, Washington Post, CNN, and MSNBC turned themselves into the Weekly World News but with sanctimony. Any time they run a negative story on trump or any Republican, they can just throw this in their faces. Really, they don't have to take their ******** anymore.
Nunes informed us what was going on from the very beginning. Mueller loading his team with dems, FBI members making it obvious they were going after the president, etc.. It was obvious from the start this was ****. However, the whole thing was also such a ridiculous conspiracy theory from the start it was incredibly difficult to believe. You argued with Horn6721 and called him a conspiracy theorist because he believed that the media had faked a photo but somehow you believed this case was legit?
Clean
5,000+ Posts
The Mueller team was definitely playing hardball. I've heard that they turned Michael Cohen by threatening to charge his wife in some of Cohen's dirty deals.
Again, I'm referring to Mueller, not the previous FBI investigation. And you still had no knowledge of any facts. You simply chose to belief Nunes over the others because it was politically convenient.
Mueller was operating an investigation that was independent of the Republican-led Justice Department. Did you expect him to hire a bunch of Trump supporters? Just FYI - Kenneth Starr's team wasn't a model of non-partisanship. It is supposed to be adversarial.
Actually, the biggest thing that gave the theory legs was that it wasn't difficult to believe - not because of anything the FBI did. After all, when Mueller was appointed, most people didn't know much about the FBI's previous "work" (good or bad). The decision to hire Mueller was to a great extent a political one that arose because the pubic supported it based on how Trump behaved.
If Marco Rubio had been the nominee, won the election, and had these allegations thrown at him, there never would have been a special counsel, because nobody would have considered it plausible. He wouldn't have been licking Vladimir Putin's nut sack throughout the campaign, and though he may have fired Comey, he would have had enough discipline not to shoot his mouth off about it.
Hey, I did him a favor. He was embarrassing himself.
It was built on a house of cards on a silly conspiracy theory and there was nothing wrong with Trump's behavior. Sucking Putin's balls? What a stupid thing to say. I believed Nunes because he and others had the facts right before their eyes and they informed us the public . He and the others were right and you were wrong. You wanted to believe in the fairy tale because you disliked Trump. McHammer and I tried to tell you but you ignored us. You really have a nasty habit of underestimating other people's knowledge and overestimating yours.
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The Mueller investigation was more than a continuation of the FBI investigation. And yes, there was a lot wrong with Trump's behavior. It wasn't illegal, but it was stupid and misguided. There never would have been a Mueller investigation without it.
Lots of people had the facts before their eyes. You believed Nunes as a politically convenient toss of the dice.
I wasn't wrong, because unlike others, I didn't prejudge the case. I told guys like you and our token Sooner dolt not to make judgments on the case and to wait for the report. Neither of you did. You guessed right. He guessed wrong.
The investigation was there to eliminate Trump and nothing about justice. I didn't guess. The facts were there from the very start. You just decided to ignore them.
Edit-I know you didn't prejudge the case. You were wrong about it being on the up and up from the beginning.
Edit- Trump has been harder on Putin than Obama and Bush. The idea that Trump was sucking Putin's balls is completely ridiculous.
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Saying it over and over again doesn't make it true. You guessed well.
And you don't know what you're talking about.
Actually I didn't overestimate my intelligence. I did the complete opposite. I reserved judgment on the matter and was the only one to do so while the rest of you were blindly slapping your junk around believing what your politics dictated.
And no, I didn't want to believe the Russia narrative because I knew how damaging it could have been and how obnoxious the Left would have gotten had it been true. Just because I didn't vote for Trump doesn't mean I joined "The Resistance." I've probably spent more time defending Trump since he won than criticizing him.
This had nothing to do with politics. I didn't care for Starr's witch hunt either. This investigation had "warning Will Robinson" from the very beginning and I would have said that if it was a dem president being done this way. Your dislike for Trump has caused you to say a shitload of ridiculous **** about him over the last two years(Trump sucking Putin's balls, the wall is trump showing his cock, etc.). Maybe I'm wrong but I'm having a hard time buying that your emotions aren't affecting your decision on this.
Not a guess. Bet on the side with less confirmation bias. You win 90-95% of the time.Saying it over and over again doesn't make it true. You guessed well.
I35
5,000+ Posts
There’s nothing wrong with Trump’s behavior. Almost every time his words are a reaction to someone else’s action. You always seem to give who started it a pass. You wouldn’t even hear those words out of his mouth if the media had their head up his *** like they did Obama. America is so friggin tired of the bullying and shaming by the Democratic that this time in history we HAD to get someone in there to not only stand up to them, but also drain the swap. It’s gotten way out of hand and if there are no consequences to their behavior then there is a standard set that we will never get back.
He wasn’t voted into office for his personality or mouth. He was voted in to office to do a job and make changes to that dreadful Obama brought on us. If you cant get passed his words while we are doing better than we have in many years then you are the petty one. I’m hoping they will develop a medication for people with TDS soon. Because there’s too many over the top crazy people running their mouth these days.
One last thing, Trump never gets the credit he deserves. He is the only one in Politics that is truly serving his country the right way. He is a billionaire that gave up his luxury lifestyle to work long hours and give his paycheck up as a donation. He’s the most transparent President we have ever had that is not bought to make decisions for any cronies. Every decision he makes has America first and what’s best for our safety. That’s refreshing.
ProdigalHorn
10,000+ Posts
This is pretty ridiculous regardless of your take on Mueller, Trump, or his supporters. First, most of them didn't think he was corrupt in the sense that he was on the take, but rather that he was running a partisan investigation. I don't know what was in his mind, nor do I care. What I do know is that if this person came back without finding anything, and I believed he was a partisan, that would make it even more likely that I would believe him. Because if a partisan out for blood couldn't make the case, then it seems like that's all the more reason to believe his report. Only someone looking to play political "gotcha" would argue that the proper response to this is "well I thought he was a partisan hack and didn't believe he'd be fair, but now he's coming back and said he didn't find anything, so clearly I can't trust him and something must be there." If the shoe fits...
For the record, no one I heard ever claimed that Mueller was out there planting evidence or anything like that. They did, however, believe he was coercing witnesses into testifying to things by going after their family members, as well as turning a blind eye toward clearly partisan elements of the investigation until the damage had already been done.
I35
Your comment that we did not vote for Trump for his personality or his mouth is dead on.
Do i wish he did not always say or tweet what he does.? Yes BUT as I always ask my leftie friends; Which of the gains in the economy do you want your Dem Potus to roll back? Great employment among all minority groups? Highest wage increases in 20 years? Lower taxes for 97%who pay taxes?
Do you want the mfg jobs that have been and are being created to disappear, again?
Etc etc etc.
The lefties Dems and Trump haters can only whine about his tweets.
What is even funnier is the stuff the Dems say they want to focus on Trump has already started on.
They had to create an extreme in the GND since current data is showing We, the USA, have reduced our emissions. And free enterprises are working on renewable sources at an amazing rate, No govt needed.
Hopefully most of the people are smarter than Dems give then credit for.
Your comment that we did not vote for Trump for his personality or his mouth is dead on.
Do i wish he did not always say or tweet what he does.? Yes BUT as I always ask my leftie friends; Which of the gains in the economy do you want your Dem Potus to roll back? Great employment among all minority groups? Highest wage increases in 20 years? Lower taxes for 97%who pay taxes?
Do you want the mfg jobs that have been and are being created to disappear, again?
Etc etc etc.
The lefties Dems and Trump haters can only whine about his tweets.
What is even funnier is the stuff the Dems say they want to focus on Trump has already started on.
They had to create an extreme in the GND since current data is showing We, the USA, have reduced our emissions. And free enterprises are working on renewable sources at an amazing rate, No govt needed.
Hopefully most of the people are smarter than Dems give then credit for.
I don't buy that - not because I think you're a partisan Republican but because I think you're partisan Trump supporter.
A witch hunt? Bill Clinton committed a felony (actually more than one). Starr was right to go after him. Clinton should have been removed by the Senate, and he should have been tossed in the slammer. Furthermore, he set a terrible precedent. It is now OK for the President to commit a felony because of him. That is a friggin' disgrace.
I am the least emotional person here when it comes to politics. I'm a massive cynic. I use somewhat "colorful" rhetoric at times, but there's a reason why I describe Trump's conduct that way. It's not kneejerk opposition or emotion. It's based on actual things he says and does. Keep in mind that I've praised him on many other things. I've even praised some facets of his Russia policy. I wouldn't do that if your characterization was correct.
He's spouting the same pep rally fodder he always posts.
Well that’s the truth, for sure.
I35
5,000+ Posts
All your statement did was diagnosed you with TDS. But we all already knew that. It is entertaining though that you don’t see the obvious. I’m grabbing my popcorn and enjoying the show as you worry about the petty stuff Trump tweets.
I35 was 100% correct so it's a shame it fell on deaf ears. I stand corrected on Clinton. I didn't realize he had investigated Whitewater. Yes, you have praised Trump on a few things but the negativity from you can be as silly as a liberal.
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I35
5,000+ Posts
There was no guessing on anyone’s part. Dems knew it wasn’t true but wanted it so bad they ran with it. Dems also knew for the same reason the Republicans knew and it was because there was no leaks. No President has ever had more leaks to the press in history. It’s even safe to say all the Presidents combined. You really think with all those Dems investigating Trump that they would have been quiet for 2 years to the MSM if they actually had something?
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I read his comments in full. I didn't just dismiss them. The problem with his post is that he just jumps on the same strawman points and raises a bunch of irrelevant gibberish, all of which has been addressed and length several times. He just sticks to the script. It's like arguing Russia with Musburger.
He's a polarizing figure. Sometimes he does very good things, and sometimes he does really stupid things. You shouldn't be surprised.
I predicted a Trump defeat. So did most people here, even those who supported him.
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Trump was elected because Hillary Clinton was a dumpster fire. She won the race to the bottom. No Hillary, no Trump.
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