Impeachment

[iatrogenic]

Calling for any physical confrontations is abhorrent, IMHO. The moral equivalence of claiming rhetoric supporters should "get up in the faces" (Maxine?) of the opponent vs saying show up on Jan 6th, the opponent will be in the Capital Building, stop them from doing their job. One is rhetoric while the other demonstrates planning, forethought and has an specific outcome time tied to it. It's like a potential criminal saying "we should rob a bank" and another planning and executing the bank robbery. Are both culpable? Yes! Is one more culplable than the other? I think we can agree that the latter would be more at fault and punished more severely.



If you can show that Maxine, Kamala, Cory Booker or any organized, directed and ultimately specified the outcome of those protests, specifically any looting/burning then I'll join you in calling for their impeachment/removal from office too. If not, it's a vapid attempt at moral equivalence that doesn't hold up to scrutiny.



If I shout fire in a crowded theater of 100 and only 20 react leading to injury does that mean I'm not culpable because all 100 didn't act? Just because an estimated 400k didn't converge on the Capital Building doesn't mean his words, direction weren't effective for the thousands that did cross the police barriers.

Holding all protesters accountable for the act of a subset is dumb. That applies to rally goers on 1/6 and BLM protesters throughout the US. Attending a rally to let your voice be hear is an American freedom. Crossing police barriers, assaulting cops and breaking and entering the Capital Building or Nordstrom is illegal and should be punished. Burning a car in Kenosha or taking a crap in a Capital Building bathroom and smearing it all over the hallway should be punished. If you can find the rally organizers and show similarly that they incited the crowd to loot then punish them. My guess is that looting/burning is less organized and typically more spontaneous or lone wolfs. What happened on 1/6 was organized in plain sight, was celebrated by Trump after it was done. Trump's reaction to the sacking of the Capital Building cannot be ignored.



I've very clearly said that not all Trump supporters are culpable for 1/6, limiting my disdain for those that crossed police barriers and the people that organized/pointed/fired them at the target. DJT isn't simply a supporter. On more than a dozen occasions he directed his supporters to amass on 1/6, the day of the counting. His speech was timed to finish within minutes of the 1pm EST, the start of the count. He waited 3 hours after the start of the insurrection to respond to any of the mob activity, despite passionate please from Republican in Congress, then while doing so called them "patriots" and "we love you".

Unfortunately for you, Trump never yelled "fire". He did say act peacefully and patriotically and have your voices heard. You cannot change the facts no matter how much you try.

 

[mb227]

Not following the reason. Do I think the trial for bank robbery would have occurred without the robbery? Clearly the Capital sacking was a turning point. At that point we transitioned from rhetoric to action, very specific action to stop the count.

You were not paying attention...there were literally millions of people pissed off at the move towards socialism long before Trump even arrived on the political radar. If Trump is to blame for ANYTHING, it is that his lack of filter allowed people to quit swallowing their levels of pissed-offedness.

There were plenty of discussions about Democratic shenanigans long before 2016 and **checks notes** that was before January 06, 2021. It was very much in place on Twitter for those that were looking. But many chose not to listen, just as we saw people ignoring the claims from lesbians like me about the erosion of female space and rights. Eventually, it makes its way to the surface and people listen.

 

[Seattle Husker]

Has anyone ever explained, or heard the explanation of why some guards moved back barriers to allow in the protestors? Are they saying they were Trump supporters but had no clue what would be the results? I seriously haven’t heard any follow up on this.
And no, I have not followed the proceedings, I did follow the first but the edited videos used on this one were too much for me, so I stopped very early on.

Nothing public from what I've seen other than a few dozen that were suspended in the immediate aftermath. It's possible they weren't Trump supporters but local officers on the ground made the decision to not fight the oncoming crowd. The only way to avoid that fight is to let them through.

This will likely be covered in the multiple investigations/after action reports. Will they ever be publicized?

 

[Seattle Husker]

You were not paying attention...there were literally millions of people pissed off at the move towards socialism long before Trump even arrived on the political radar. If Trump is to blame for ANYTHING, it is that his lack of filter allowed people to quit swallowing their levels of pissed-offedness.

There were plenty of discussions about Democratic shenanigans long before 2016 and **checks notes** that was before January 06, 2021. It was very much in place on Twitter for those that were looking. But many chose not to listen, just as we saw people ignoring the claims from lesbians like me about the erosion of female space and rights. Eventually, it makes its way to the surface and people listen.

All this explained why they chanted "HANG MIKE PENCE! HANG MIKE PENCE! HANG MIKE PENCE!" as they sacked the Capital Building? That's why the shouted "TRAITORS" at the LEO trying to hold back the mob?

 

[mchammer]

Joe had a major opportunity to tone down the anger. He could have asked the House to focus on his priorities instead of impeachment for 100 days or so. But he chose not to. Joe also could have studied killing the Keystone and killing fracking instead of issuing EOs.

I think Joe is not good for that so far.

Joe is out of touch with reality, more so than everyone else in DC.

 

[OUBubba]

You were not paying attention...there were literally millions of people pissed off at the move towards socialism long before Trump even arrived on the political radar. If Trump is to blame for ANYTHING, it is that his lack of filter allowed people to quit swallowing their levels of pissed-offedness.

There were plenty of discussions about Democratic shenanigans long before 2016 and **checks notes** that was before January 06, 2021. It was very much in place on Twitter for those that were looking. But many chose not to listen, just as we saw people ignoring the claims from lesbians like me about the erosion of female space and rights. Eventually, it makes its way to the surface and people listen.

Much like all of the missing debt pearl clutching from 1/20/17 to 1/19/21.

 

[OUBubba]

All this explained why they chanted "HANG MIKE PENCE! HANG MIKE PENCE! HANG MIKE PENCE!" as they sacked the Capital Building? That's why the shouted "TRAITORS" at the LEO trying to hold back the mob?

Can you imagine if they had found pelosi?

 

[mchammer]

Can you imagine if they had found pelosi?

I hate Pelosi but my guess she would hold her own.

 

[OUBubba]

I hate Pelosi but my guess she would hold her own.

None of us could “hold our own” against a mob.

 

[horninchicago]

Wait...I'm still busy fantasizing, er, imaging that.

 

[OUBubba]

Wait...I'm still busy fantasizing, er, imaging that.

we see you...

 

[mchammer]

Thread by @MattWalshBlog on Thread Reader App

So of the five deaths linked to the riot, only one — Babbit — can be conclusively considered a death caused by violence during the riot. Only the violence in this case was done by a cop. That is what we know right now. If anyone knows more, they aren’t telling us.

 

[bystander]

The hatred is visceral...and not healthy. If you're using biblical terms of good vs. evil to describe people whose politics you disagree with, thumbs may be more useful when pointing out problems.

Both of you are incredibly naive. That's all I can say.

 

[OUBubba]

Thread by @MattWalshBlog on Thread Reader App

So of the five deaths linked to the riot, only one — Babbit — can be conclusively considered a death caused by violence during the riot. Only the violence in this case was done by a cop. That is what we know right now. If anyone knows more, they aren’t telling us.

Two cops died correct? I saw one cop beaten, ironically, with an American flag pole. And you people go ape **** when CK takes a knee.

 

[Mr. Deez]

Two cops died correct? I saw one cop beaten, ironically, with an American flag pole. And you people go ape **** when CK takes a knee.

Is it ok to condemn both?

 

[Mr. Deez]

Has anyone ever explained, or heard the explanation of why some guards moved back barriers to allow in the protestors? Are they saying they were Trump supporters but had no clue what would be the results? I seriously haven’t heard any follow up on this.
And no, I have not followed the proceedings, I did follow the first but the edited videos used on this one were too much for me, so I stopped very early on.

What I've heard is that they removed the barriers because they were clearly overwhelmed and couldn't resist a crowd of that size. Obviously investigations are taking place, but the original explanation at least seems pretty plausible. It isn't a very big force. It can deal with a few freaks causing trouble. It's not equipped to deal with hundreds or thousands of people causing trouble all at once. They need backup (such as the National Guard) to deal with that.

My guess is that Capitol security will be dramatically beefed up after this. I don't think the current deployment of several thousand troops will be long term. In fact, I think most of them have already gone home. (I think about 5,000 remain after a high of about 25,000 during the inauguration.) However, I could see a big, permanent increase in the number of officers with plans put in place to be able to very quickly deploy a huge force if something like this happens again and have no problem with all that.

I don't buy the narrative that "we were close to losing our democracy." That's hyperbolic ********* designed to drive a political point and to stroke the egos of politicians with delusions of grandeur. We've had presidential assassinations, and we didn't lose our democracy. Flight 93 could have been successful (meaning struck the Capitol and killed the entire US Congress), and we wouldn't have lost our democracy. President Bush would have ordered the military to go after the bad guys. We would have very quickly held 435 special elections for the House to fill the vacancies, and our states would have appointed senators to fill those vacancies. Within a month, we'd have a fully-functioning US Congress meeting in a temporary capitol building, and we would have built a new permanent one within a few years. It would have been horrible, but our democracy would be OK. Our democracy isn't secured by a bunch of self-important politicians with fancy offices in a fancy building. It's secured by the brave people in uniform willing to take a bullet to protect it overseas and by a people and a culture willing to demand it at home. Having said that, it is pretty absurd that these yahoos got as far as they did, and we should take big measures to keep it from happening again.

 

[Sangre Naranjada]

I wish we would stop calling it a democracy, and instead use the proper term: representative republic.

 

[theiioftx]

Although it ain’t too representative these days.

 

[Mr. Deez]

I wish we would stop calling it a democracy, and instead use the proper term: representative republic.

I use it colloquially because everybody else does. I know it's not correct. It's a little like calling the former GB Packers quarterback Brett "Farve." We know it's wrong. We just say it that way anyway.

 

[theiioftx]

Breaking: Apparently There's An Impeachment Or Something



Breaking: Apparently There's An Impeachment Or Something

 

[bystander]

Accountability for thee but not for me. Gotcha.

The entire riot or whatever you want to call it was a crime and incredibly stupid. I have no problem with them all being charged, tried and convicted with whatever crime they committed. Speaking for myself, you and OU seem to think I love white people no matter what they do. I don't. When I look at a white person I don't think, "That's my tribe" or "Those are my people." I don't even think that when I'm in the presence of Cubans. I don't think that about anyone except people that share common tastes.

It was stupid because a crime was committed. It was stupid because they opened the door for Liberals to pretend they have clean hands.

As for Trump, I'd have to read the entire transcript, which I have not. I can admit that I've not studied the matter. But I've read your posts asking for proof of election fraud and from what I can tell, none has been brought forward or if any, it's minor. So it was a huge mistake in my opinion for Trump to continue to say the election was stolen.

Yes, the President influences people. But not me. There was nothing he could say that would make me act. And if he encouraged them to come to DC, then he should have known his audience. I don't believe he actually thought they'd do what they did. Maybe he is naive or stupid when it comes to reading people.

But to impeach him over these words is a very dangerous thing. The door will be open. People will listen intently now to the words of a Maxine Waters and others who clearly incite anger in others. Maybe it's a good thing to make Trump an example so that future leaders learn that words can be deadly.

And now we have these idiots willing to tell anyone who will listen that Trump incited them. That he betrayed them. They will say anything to get off. We all know that. THEY are the malcontents who thought it was a joy ride. F'em. They should be punished with no deals made. Trump didn't organize them. Their testimony will be 100% self-serving. Rational people know this. But the political climate is so bad that their OCD pathological need to act like rebels is on them and the Liberals will turn their lying testimony as to motive, intent and organization as a fact that Trump made them do it.

 

[bystander]

Is it ok to condemn both?

Yes.

Ape-****. That's an attempt to marginalize the problem of CK. And what is the problem?

The one time that many adults have a chance to commune with the anthem and the flag has been politicized. If you stand you are seen and accused as being in favor of black men being killed in cold blood. It is a "SUPPORT THIS OR ELSE" kind of situation. It was a stupid tactic. Why force people to choose between support for black causes and patriotism. You can't win hearts and minds like that.

At the same time, we know that there are "patriots" who "Point the cannon at you" (to coin a lyric from the CCR song Fortunate Son). Nobody should be forced to do anything. Nobody should be forced to stand. Nobody should be forced to kneel. We should do what we want in terms of symbolic gestures as long as there isn't any violence or property damage. What one person lives another can only imagine. So if CK wants to kneel so be it.

I don't care.

But I like to talk about it on here and dissect it. That's not going ape-****. It sound like ape-**** when you totally disagree with a take.

CK is not a big problem but the giving the finger to the anthem and the flag is not the way to get things done. The real problem is the Liberal elites who are fooling their beneficiaries or those who want to be "good" who believe everything they say and who ignore what is really happening.

 

[4th_floor]

Wait...I'm still busy fantasizing, er, imaging that.

Careful, you could be impeached.

 

[Horn6721]

Why are the Democrats using such dirty tactics? Editing vids and outright lying.
If their cause is so just why resort to lying?

 

[iatrogenic]

Two cops died correct? I saw one cop beaten, ironically, with an American flag pole. And you people go ape **** when CK takes a knee.

Incorrect. No cops died at the peaceful protest. No cop died from being hit by a fire extinguisher or beaten with a flag pole.

 

[OUBubba]

Yes.

Ape-****. That's an attempt to marginalize the problem of CK. And what is the problem?

The one time that many adults have a chance to commune with the anthem and the flag has been politicized. If you stand you are seen and accused as being in favor of black men being killed in cold blood. It is a "SUPPORT THIS OR ELSE" kind of situation. It was a stupid tactic. Why force people to choose between support for black causes and patriotism. You can't win hearts and minds like that.

At the same time, we know that there are "patriots" who "Point the cannon at you" (to coin a lyric from the CCR song Fortunate Son). Nobody should be forced to do anything. Nobody should be forced to stand. Nobody should be forced to kneel. We should do what we want in terms of symbolic gestures as long as there isn't any violence or property damage. What one person lives another can only imagine. So if CK wants to kneel so be it.

I don't care.

But I like to talk about it on here and dissect it. That's not going ape-****. It sound like ape-**** when you totally disagree with a take.

CK is not a big problem but the giving the finger to the anthem and the flag is not the way to get things done. The real problem is the Liberal elites who are fooling their beneficiaries or those who want to be "good" who believe everything they say and who ignore what is really happening.

It's the 7th most discussed thing on the front page. Seems like it's still a big deal. And I'm of the opinion that the "blue lives matter" crowd beating police officers to death is WAY more damning than an activist quietly taking a knee.

 

[Seattle Husker]

Why are the Democrats using such dirty tactics? Editing vids and outright lying.
If their cause is so just why resort to lying?

Dirty tactics = using Trump's own tweets and video'ed speeches against him. Just more of the previous claim that you can't listen to what Trump says but what he does. Of course, in this case he was saying come to D.C. on the 6th. It will be "wild". "March to the Capital". "I'll be there with you." "If you don't fight like hell we won't have a country." Then he waited for 2 hours after the breach to react at all. Trump must have been taking a nap or something. Wait, he did tweet his chastisement of Pence 30 minutes into the breach prompting his supporters on bullhorns to read the tweet aloud then chant "Hang Mike Pence".

All selective editing...outright lying. Don't believe your eyes or ears.

 

[iatrogenic]

nd I'm of the opinion that the "blue lives matter" crowd beating police officers to death is WAY more damning than an activist quietly taking a knee.

I would agree, but that did not happen. Just another lie spread by Libs for political purposes. It never ends.

 

[iatrogenic]

Dirty tactics = using Trump's own tweets and video'ed speeches against him. Just more of the previous claim that you can't listen to what Trump says but what he does. Of course, in this case he was saying come to D.C. on the 6th. It will be "wild". "March to the Capital". "I'll be there with you." "If you don't fight like hell we won't have a country." Then he waited for 2 hours after the breach to react at all. Trump must have been taking a nap or something. Wait, he did tweet his chastisement of Pence 30 minutes into the breach prompting his supporters on bullhorns to read the tweet aloud then chant "Hang Mike Pence".

All selective editing...outright lying. Don't believe your eyes or ears.

In other words, let you interpret the situation regardless of the facts in order to push a narrative.

 

[horninchicago]

Quietly take a knee on your own Gawdamn time. I don't give a **** about these stupid *** "protests". It has been shown countless times that white people are killed by police, while usually being justified uses of lethal force, more than black people. But facts never matter.

And, something being front page news when it has been shown countless times, that only unreasonable people don't believe, that most of the print media lies to further the liberal agenda, doesn't really matter to most of us.