Dream vs Modern day big men

Hey genuis, the reason he's arguing the 1986 Rockets against the Showtime Lakers is because the '86 Rockets stomped a mudhole in the Lakers *** right in the heart of the Showtime era.

How can you argue otherwise that the Rockets wouldn't have been able to continue to do that to the Lakers if injuries and drugs hadn't played a part? A young Hakeem and a healthy Ralph Sampson in his prime would've been hell to pay.
 
Mitch, I think the deal is that that also was a pretty young Rockets team. The Lakers couldn't handle Ralph and Hakeem (which was the idea in putting them together in the first place). I know I got the sense that it could have been a changing of the guard, somewhat like when the Trailblazers blew past the Lakers and Sixers in '77 -- another star-crossed team.

Losing Lloyd, Wiggins and Lucas at various points destroyed the team.

The Lakers got better, but the Rockets also probably could have done the same (and did in Hakeem's case).
 
Just to address a couple of points regardin Duncan versus Hakeem...

Someone brought up Duncan's 37 minute, 5 point game the other night. Yes, the Spurs got their asses kicked. Duncan did not look good. He also had the flu. He;s also played more games than anyone in the league over the last 10 years, so I doubt he's in his prime anymore.

Someone else said something about Duncan not being better than Hakeem in any area. Footwork was one. Tim Duncan is widely known for having some of the best footwork of any big man ever. The Hornets big men all watched tapes of Duncan during the off-season to emulate his defense and footwork, since he was "the best center in the league for a long time." Their words.
 
No big man's footwork has ever been as great as Hakeem's, period. The dude played soccer his whole life, even while he was in the NBA.

Duncan's footwork is great. Hakeem's was uniquely great.
 
They have good footwork in two different kinds of ways. Hakeem had quicker feet (and was just quicker overall), but Duncan has such precision that he can make a really basic, slow-looking move and somehow he's gotten himself a good look with his defender totally out of position.

In reply to:
Click to expand...
 
When someone has the audactiy to say that the one area where Duncan is better than Hakeem is FOOTWORK, they obviously never saw Hakeem play.

This from wikipedia: "The best footwork I’ve ever seen from a big man"
—Pete Newell[6]
Offensively, Olajuwon established himself as a great finesse player, perfecting a set of fakes and spin moves that became known as his trademark Dream Shake. Executed with uncanny speed and power, they are still regarded as the pinnacle of "big man" footwork.[6] Shaquille O'Neal stated: "Hakeem has five moves then four countermoves, that gives him 20 moves."[

There has never, ever been a big man with footwork like the dream. Ever. He had the footwork of a guard.
 
Maybe both right

Games played
1983-84 (82)
84-85 (82)
85-86 (79)
86-87 (43) Rockets
87-88 (19) Rockets
88-89 (29) Warriors

Sampson Goes Home To Get a Fresh Start by Flip Bondy
Published: October 8, 1992, New York Times
Then, the moment was gone. In the finals against the Celtics, Sampson scuffled with 6-1 Jerry Sichting. He was portrayed as a bully, a loser. "I was playing at my highest level then," Sampson said. "I had no idea the fans would react like that."
The next fall, Sampson suffered an ankle injury that led to the first of three knee injuries. Coach Bill Fitch lost patience with Sampson's playmaking mentality.

Warriors' Hopes Center on Sampson by Sam Godaper
Published December 14, 1987, New York Times
''We didn't break up the Twin Towers,'' Ray Patterson, the Rockets' president and general manager, said yesterday. ''What we did was trade Ralph. There is no question that Ralph is a center. Jim Petersen has been coming along well in scoring and rebounding, and he will be our power forward.

Sampson's production with the Rockets was way down in 1987. One could argue that he settled on becoming a perimeter player and/or because he was damaged goods.

Pts per game (15.9); pre-ankle injury # (21.0, 22.1, 18.9, 15.6 year of the ankle injury)
FG% (.439); pre-injury (.523, .502, .488, .489)
Rebounds (9.1); pre-injury (11.1, 10.4, 11.1, 8.7)
Blocks (1.7); pre-injury (2.4, 2.0, 1.6, 1.3)

My personal belief: The Rockets knew Sampson was damaged goods. Why not try to get that elusive point guard (Sleepy Floyd) and add another big man (Joe "Barely" Carroll) since the Warriors were in fire-sale mode (only three wins at the time of the trade. Of course, Patterson isn't going to mention anything injuries and chose to go with "we're going in a different direction."
 
Correction to above: The Warrior stats are for the 1987-88 year. Sampson was traded after about a third of the season was over.
 
If Tim Duncan is such a great defender then why don't the Spurs put him on West, who is killing the Spurs. Foul trouble? That's a weak argument. A good defender wouldn't get into foul trouble.

Hakeem guarded Shaq, Robinson, and Ewing during his playoff runs. The Rockets didn't have to protect him by putting him on a weak offensive player so that he didn't get into foul trouble.

Amazing that anyone would have compared the two defensively.
 
And Shaq averaged 28 against Hakeem. And, Hakeem had alot of help on Robinson. Hill elected to have David play Hakeem one on one. That or Rodman wouldn't double.
 
There's not even a comparison defensively. Hakeem dominates. The Spurs try and protect Duncan, while the Rockets rely on the Dream to anchor the defense. One is a great player around some very talented players. The other is a legend who played with some very average players. Really this shouldn't even be an argument. Olajuwom was a beast.
 
First of all there is a big difference between Shaq and West. Hopefully you can see that.....well, maybe you can't since you are argueing that Duncan was better than Hakeem.

Second, Hakeem played Robinson straight up. Why would he need help on him? HE KILLED ROBINSON!

Stop making excuses for Duncan. He is a very overrated defensive player. If he was anywhere near the defender you claim he would guard West instead of trying not to get t-bagged by Chandler.
 
Wilt was one of the greatest athletes of the last century. Comparing him to the younger Shaq, they each would have had their hands full.
 
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