Bandwagon challenge

[uisge beatha]

Yeah, kinda silly since your original post implied we were all on the TH wagon to begin with. I lived through the latter Acker years, McWilliams, and Macovic before getting to Brown. I bought into the Charlie Strong Experience until Kansas. I've never bought into the THE - I've always had reservations about the hire and been on the win me over camp. My expectations after last year was the D should be ready w/ game 1 and questions on O. Game 1 showed that wasnt true. Game 2 shows that's not true. So I'm still on the sideline. If that puts me in the OFF category, so be it

 

[#2is#1]

Time to pay up... I’m not sure where we are at. I feel the two teams we just beat are overrated, but if we can recruit that’s all that matters (Insert photo of Sterns, Watson, Keontay)
That’s the difference of years past. Players.

 

[AC]

Time to pay up... I’m not sure where we are at. I feel the two teams we just beat are overrated, but if we can recruit that’s all that matters (Insert photo of Sterns, Watson, Keontay)
That’s the difference of years past. Players.

BJ Foster, Calvin Anderson, Joshua Moore, Reese Latieo
Defense has completely come alive since Tulsa. Hope coach Herman can keep em motivated and hungry in Manhatten, KS this Saturday.

 

[#2is#1]

BJ Foster, Calvin Anderson, Joshua Moore, Reese Latieo
Defense has completely come alive since Tulsa. Hope coach Herman can keep em motivated and hungry in Manhatten, KS this Saturday.

Absolutely AC, I think we should go through the posts and call some folks out. I ask the negative people who continually posted negative stuff to come clean and admit wrong on TH, give to Hornfans and move on. But I know most are cowards behind the keyboard.

 

[Vol Horn 4 Life]

How do I reply if I'm sitting on the wagon with both feet dragging the ground?

Not sure if I'm one who is being called out, but I'll weigh in. I only have one foot dragging the ground now. Two good wins is not enough for me to absolutely believe. Sustainability and progressive improvement is what I'm looking for and they have improved. However, I have to see sustained improvement.

If they beat K State and OU and I'm on all the way. Beat KSU and lose a competitive well played game against OU then follow that up with another solid win against Baylor and I'm on. Lose to KSU or get blown out by OU and I'll have both feet dragging again.

Be careful and make sure you understand the difference between critically discussing opportunities/problems and just being negative. I see both on this board.

 

[Pomspoms]

I have been "off" since last year. Herman makes mistakes just about every game. Good thing we have good players that bail him out. Like I have been saying since last year he is a good recruiter but not a good game day coach. I suppose it is possible he could learn from his mistakes and become a better game day coach but he would have to tame the "gambler" and greedy part of himself. I am on record as saying we beat every team except OU and WV and finish the regular season 9-3 which is good. And I think we get more good recruits and finish around 4 or 5.

 

[SabreHorn]

I ask the negative people who continually posted negative stuff to come clean and admit wrong on TH

I'll be the first to admit I was wrong on Tom Herman, since I was one of the biggest proponents for his hiring the summer before it occurred. He has yet live up to that billing, but as of now I have seen:

1) Losses to teams we should have beaten
2) Losses in games we should have won
3) Play calling that is beyond explanation and stupidity
4) Players not being coached up
5) Total mismatches NEVER taken advantage of. Do you realize we are the only one of 13 OU opponents last year that NEVER threw at their true freshman CB that every other team exploited?
6) Refusal to put the best 11 players on the field
7) Arrogance - yes, Mack Brown was arrogance, and as I was told face to face in Bellmont, "he's the most hard headed son of a ***** you'll ever meet.
8) Trying to run a no huddle but substituting every play, OR taking 35 seconds to get the play off.
I don't want to have coffee or even have BBQ or El Patio with Herman. What I do want is for him to recruit the very best talent, coach them up, win the games he should and prove he's worth $1,000,000 a year much less $5,000,000. Granted the last two weeks have been great strides forward, BUT for the money being spent, better results should be required.

 

[zuckercanyon]

I'll be the first to admit I was wrong on Tom Herman, since I was one of the biggest proponents for his hiring the summer before it occurred. He has yet live up to that billing, but as of now I have seen:

1) Losses to teams we should have beaten
2) Losses in games we should have won
3) Play calling that is beyond explanation and stupidity
4) Players not being coached up
5) Total mismatches NEVER taken advantage of. Do you realize we are the only one of 13 OU opponents last year that NEVER threw at their true freshman CB that every other team exploited?
6) Refusal to put the best 11 players on the field
7) Arrogance - yes, Mack Brown was arrogance, and as I was told face to face in Bellmont, "he's the most hard headed son of a ***** you'll ever meet.
8) Trying to run a no huddle but substituting every play, OR taking 35 seconds to get the play off.
I don't want to have coffee or even have BBQ or El Patio with Herman. What I do want is for him to recruit the very best talent, coach them up, win the games he should and prove he's worth $1,000,000 a year much less $5,000,000. Granted the last two weeks have been great strides forward, BUT for the money being spent, better results should be required.

Sabre, that was with Charlie's players (I'm ready for the retaliation)…..Charlie wasn't worth $750k a year but he got $5 per as well....watch this team development....

 

[SabreHorn]

Zucker,

You make a very valid point, one that I made multiple unpopular posts about, while trying to remain PC (hardly my strong suit).

Everyone says Charlie Strong is a good man. Met him a couple of times, but my longest conversation was, "welcome to Texas". He set out to change the culture of one of five most storied programs in America. I adamantly voiced concern about his obsession with recruiting Florida (which produces 150-200 great D-1 talented players every year) rather than developing relationships with Texas HS coaches. Florida (I've been a member of The Florida Foundation or over 30 years) is a totally different culture. I believed then, and still do, that those cultures would clash and create a real problem in our program. Some adjusted (Beck) and some left. Herman has had to deal with the malcontents but walk on egg shells to make sure that the midget on 7th doesn't get his PC brain out of joint.

Mack Brown was different; go to his office to talk to him about what to do better or improve, he considered it an "attack", and simply told the kid. "you want to leave, I'll give you your release" - there was no discussion, but then as painful as it is to say, he had the President's support, and Deloss was the master politician.
Red was right and was wrongfully labeled and maligned by people that don't know and have never met Red McCombs, but also didn't know jack **** about Charlie Strong. Strong is a position coach.

Compare Strong to the great DCs that have come through Austin - Mike Campbell, Leon Fuller, Dick Tomey, Will Muschamp, and now Orlando. Does he match up with any as a DC.

After he hired Strong, I told Billie Powers that he had set our program back 20 years. Hopefully Tom Herman can shorten that timeline, but like most Texas fans, I am very impatient. Mack Brown did the impossible - no school was more fractionalized than Texas. He united all those factions. Herman has had to unite his players.

 

[Creek]

I've been supporter since he was hired. I have for the most part like what I am seeing. This progress can take time from Strong's and MB issues. I think a k state win in Manhattan against Snyder is a quality win-period. K State kicked MB butt a lot and for no good reasons. I'm expecting to kick OU axx.

 

[Horn6721]

SabreHorn
I look forward to and love your posts. I am a a nothing but I have extreme passion for the Horns.
I respect your opinion about Strong and not fitting here culturally. I thought from the first he was a nice decent man who just didn't fit in here as a head coach. I wanted him to succeed here so there could never be a charge of racism.
But If he is only a position coach how did he do it and is doing it at UCF?

 

[Dionysus]

Re Charlie

I wonder if some people just do their best work where the spotlight and pressure are dialed down a bit. If so, I can respect that. Being the top guy at a big name program may not be all that much fun actually.

 

[SabreHorn]

6721,

I think Strong will do ok, not great but ok. He appears to be more in his element - Florida, small school out of media limelight (the State of Texas will have 50-100 HS games this weekend drawing larger crowds than USF draws). He is also playing with someone else's talent. He was able to win at Loserville with Petrino's recruits. He had a good year last year with Willie Taggert's recruits.

Truthfully, the jury is out on Strong on two of the most important facets of being a coach:

1) Can he recruit enough of his own to play the game?

2) Can he evaluate talent? A former board favorite was relieved of his coach duties by a legend because his talent evaluation is "piss poor".

Strong also returns to Florida at a time that FIU & FAU are on the rise, and CFU thinks they have arrived - yes, they are as delusional as Aggies.
He will make a good position coach in the NFL in two years.

 

[SAMMCHornfan]

I will vote after the KSU game. I have said all along Texas was capable of winning those last two games. The big test for a Tom Herman coached team will be this week against a lesser opponent on the road. His last team at Houston failed miserably in those scenarios. Reverse that trend and I am all in!

 

[zuckercanyon]

SabreHorn
I look forward to and love your posts. I am a a nothing but I have extreme passion for the Horns.
I respect your opinion about Strong and not fitting here culturally. I thought from the first he was a nice decent man who just didn't fit in here as a head coach. I wanted him to succeed here so there could never be a charge of racism.
But If he is only a position coach how did he do it and is doing it at UCF?

He's a position coach at Florida and Texas (Power 5). He's a better than average head coach at a level below.....much respect for comment made about not being good in the limelight......I'll just point out that Notre Dame hired Willingham and Texas hired Strong with the "he'll fix the behavioral issues" tag instead of "he'll come here and win games. I honestly look for the day when non-football factors are never weighed and a person is hired because they can win football games. It'll be best for all concerned, so it doesn't look like a favor. Maybe that's pie-in-the-sky, but as long as "other factors" are considered, that cloud will loom overhead......I'll point to Tomlin at Pittsburgh (NFL)…..never hear that he's "a great (non football trait) coach", just that "there's a coach who knows how to win"......Super Bowls to prove it......

 

[ViperHorn]

He's a position coach at Florida and Texas (Power 5). He's a better than average head coach at a level below.....much respect for comment made about not being good in the limelight......I'll just point out that Notre Dame hired Willingham and Texas hired Strong with the "he'll fix the behavioral issues" tag instead of "he'll come here and win games. I honestly look for the day when non-football factors are never weighed and a person is hired because they can win football games. It'll be best for all concerned, so it doesn't look like a favor. Maybe that's pie-in-the-sky, but as long as "other factors" are considered, that cloud will loom overhead......I'll point to Tomlin at Pittsburgh (NFL)…..never hear that he's "a great (non football trait) coach", just that "there's a coach who knows how to win"......Super Bowls to prove it......

Good post Zucker. The only thing I would quibble with is "a person is hired because they can win football games". I would suggest you add "at the top of the Power 5 level" at the end of that sentence. Strong won at Loserville and Herman won at Cougar High. Strong could not and Herman is struggling to win at the level Texas desires.

 

[RainH2burntO]

I

Good post Zucker. The only thing I would quibble with is "a person is hired because they can win football games". I would suggest you add "at the top of the Power 5 level" at the end of that sentence. Strong won at Loserville and Herman won at Cougar High. Strong could not and Herman is struggling to win at the level Texas desires.

Like your post, Viper...but all but about 5 head coaches would struggle (at least initially) to win at the level Texas desires.
Not you necessarily, but many on these boards were clearly spoiled by our 10 year run and fail to realize how few teams win 10+ games in a year. Nothing wrong with desiring 10+ win seasons and a nice bowl to go with it, but when it gets to the point where it is demanded I think the whole fun and blessing in being a fan gets lost...at least for me.

 

[AC]

TH should, really should beat K St with some ease. The talent differential is that significant. I simply accept that the defense is now on a different level and will be dominant especially against teams that don't pass that well. K St does NOT match up very well to the Texas D. Alex Dalton is their only hope. Orlando better scheme blitz packages accordingly. If we handle K St OU better look out. If this is proven wrong on Saturday we have a different conversation. But Texas could go 10-2 or better if they keep this up. Who will stop this defense (TTU, and WVU have the best chances). Outside of those two I don't see many loses which means the complaints are null and void. Saturday will tell a lot. Last Saturday told a lot. I guess I like optimism better, that's a personal choice but I have some evidence to back up that position. I am not saying we go 10-2 now, but if we handle K St which is a trap game no doubt and play as we proved already that we can. We can slow down the doubt and negativity towards TH. Makes sense. I know OU is a huge game, but if we survive the big trap game before OU and we beat USC, TCU easily. It stands to reason we can go toe to toe with OU. And we will give their QB hell.

 

[RainH2burntO]

TH should, really should beat K St with some ease. The talent differential is that significant. I simply accept that the defense is now on a different level and will be dominant especially against teams that don't pass that well. K St does NOT match up very well to the Texas D. Alex Dalton is their only hope. Orlando better scheme blitz packages accordingly. If we handle K St OU better look out. If this is proven wrong on Saturday we have a different conversation. But Texas could go 10-2 or better if they keep this up. Who will stop this defense (TTU, and WVU have the best chances). Outside of those two I don't see many loses which means the complaints are null and void. Saturday will tell a lot. Last Saturday told a lot. I guess I like optimism better, that's a personal choice but I have some evidence to back up that position. I am not saying we go 10-2 now, but if we handle K St which is a trap game no doubt and play as we proved already that we can. We can slow down the doubt and negativity towards TH. Makes sense. I know OU is a huge game, but if we survive the big trap game before OU and we beat USC, TCU easily. It stands to reason we can go toe to toe with OU. And we will give their QB hell.

Not picking on you or your post at all...just something you mentioned that opens door for this->>
I keep hearing people saying something like think we may can hang or may go to to toe or can possibly be in it with OU.
I don't get it....Sure they look (pretty) good, but we have been playing them tough, beat them with a lesser coach (my opinion) and team two years ago, and very nearly beat them last year with a team that doesn't look near as good as this years team - all while they had a starting NFL QB, #1 draft pick, and Heisman winner at QB. I have no doubt, personally, that we can beat them. If we get any pressure in the backfield and Murray doesn't get many yards with his legs - we will beat them. It will be a good, close game again in my opinion and no reason at all to doubt our chances.
In fact, If I had to bet who had the better chance of running away with the OU game if it isn't a squeaker...I'd say it's us.

 

[AC]

Not picking on you or your post at all...just something you mentioned that opens door for this->>
I keep hearing people saying something like think we may can hang or may go to to toe or can possibly be in it with OU.
I don't get it....Sure they look (pretty) good, but we have been playing them tough, beat them with a lesser coach (my opinion) and team two years ago, and very nearly beat them last year with a team that doesn't look near as good as this years team - all while they had a starting NFL QB, #1 draft pick, and Heisman winner at QB. I have no doubt, personally, that we can beat them. If we get any pressure in the backfield and Murray doesn't get many yards with his legs - we will beat them. It will be a good, close game again in my opinion and no reason at all to doubt our chances.
In fact, If I had to bet who had the better chance of running away with the OU game if it isn't a squeaker...I'd say it's us.

Your 100% correct. I just know from experience when I am in a public forum I don't write checks I can't cash. In other words, I won't go out on a limb by myself and guarantee victory or predict a blowout. Somebody important could get hurt by October 6th, anything can happen. I have been in the public eye (not to TH extent), therefore, I am careful about what I say publicly. I do think we will beat OU, but I want to see how we do against K St.

 

[Horn6721]

Sabre
Your points make sense. USF has 41k students, not as many as UCF which has 66K but certainly a decent sized school.
Charlie is 4-0 now but only one against any real program GT.
I guess I want him to succeed.

 

[RainH2burntO]

Sabre
Your points make sense. USF has 41k students, not as many as UCF which has 66K but certainly a decent sized school.
Charlie is 4-0 now but only one against any real program GT.
I guess I want him to succeed.

I want them to play somebody. Their schedule is so weak. Saw some gal trying to make a suggestive and presumptuous point insenuating racism and unfairness (wow what a vague, meaningless word today) in the CS firing by noting his success at USF after leaving.
I'm like.. wow you're a genius they play no one. Very similar to Herbstreits dumb Pitt comment.

 

[#2is#1]

I love coming here, especially during the games to read insights of some posters. The venting, did you see what I saw etc...
Let’s keep it going.
Throw some bones down, read the history on this thread, and own up. We will probably lose once or twice again, but admit, this one feels good.
Oh and we will have never lost to the greatest athlete in Texas history.

 

[Vol Horn 4 Life]

Neither of my feet are dragging and kicking up dust. I expect we'll beat Baylor, but will have an OU hangover. WVU will be a very tough game but if we play down to any other competition this year I may have a foot dragging again at some point.

 

[Hoop]

Hey, someone scoot over...I need to get back on.

 

[dukesteer]

After USC I envisioned 5-1. It was just a premonition. Now I’ll go 12-1. Delusional? We’ll see.

TH, about whom I was brutally critical after Maryland, is making better decisions, and his demeanor seems to have improved as well. Dare I suggest a hint of humility.

Ehlinger, about whom I was brutally critical after Maryland, has evolved to a level of game management that I would not have believed possible. I’m thrilled to concede that I was wrong.

No turnovers in 12 quarters? Wow.

This team is very talented, and very hungry. I wouldn’t want to be playing us.

 

[#2is#1]

After USC I envisioned 5-1. It was just a premonition. Now I’ll go 12-1. Delusional? We’ll see.

TH, about whom I was brutally critical after Maryland, is making better decisions, and his demeanor seems to have improved as well. Dare I suggest a hint of humility.

Ehlinger, about whom I was brutally critical after Maryland, has evolved to a level of game management that I would not have believed possible. I’m thrilled to concede that I was wrong.

No turnovers in 12 quarters? Wow.

This team is very talented, and very hungry. I wouldn’t want to be playing us.

Great post back in early October Duke.
I don’t know anyone on this board. Never met Dionysus who seemingly volunteers his time, but I truly love the insight and opinions from some, emphasize some pretty enlightened football fans.
Started this thread to call out some negative Nelly’s out thinking (hoping) TH had it going. Frankly still not certain, and in the same mindset. But also wanted to raise awareness and money for the folks who run it.

I hope we can keep it going, I encourage those who come often to break out and give a few bucks if you can.
It will bring some karma!

 

[mchammer]

Great post back in early October Duke.
I don’t know anyone on this board. Never met Dionysus who seemingly volunteers his time, but I truly love the insight and opinions from some, emphasize some pretty enlightened football fans.
Started this thread to call out some negative Nelly’s out thinking (hoping) TH had it going. Frankly still not certain, and in the same mindset. But also wanted to raise awareness and money for the folks who run it.

I hope we can keep it going, I encourage those who come often to break out and give a few bucks if you can.
It will bring some karma!

Don’t know what happened, but TH’s 4th down decisions have been superlative since the Tulsa game.