Abortion Isnt a Necessary Evil; It's Great
- Thread starter NJlonghorn
- Start date
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
ProdigalHorn
10,000+ Posts
Somehow people managed in the past. Yes I'm aware people weren't squeaky clean with no back-alley abortions and life wasn't Leave it to Beaver, but by the same token, our rate of out-of-wedlock pregnancies has skyrocketed, and it seems to have coincided with one generation's decision that sex should basically become a recreational activity with no consequences.
I'm sure some people have issues with talking about options, but I'd bet the majority of even conservatives don't have an issue with "telling young people about all the options". The issue is that sex education by many groups is rapidly become sex advocacy and sex improvement. Talking about using a condom is one thing. Distributing them at will, showing graphic examples of how to use them and introducing varying methods and techniques for making the experience more pleasurable are a completely different situations.
I'd argue that there's a pretty strong correlation with religious faith there as well. As Europe has become less and less religious, their stances on social issues have become more and more liberal. (Not to mention their stance on population control.)
In addition, every poll I've seen shows that millennials are coming up with strong and stronger resistance to abortion. Even while they're becoming more liberal politically, they're rejecting abortion as an option more and more. So to someone's point about how we will be viewed in 200 years, if it's true that we're on the "wrong side of history" if we oppose gay marriage based on the trends in opinion, why is it unreasonable that we would be viewed favorably for promoting a practice that's clearly declining in acceptability?
texas_ex2000
2,500+ Posts
On the contrary, I think this article is great. I hope the media promotes more of these stories during the SCOTUS hearings and in 2020.
Seattle Husker
10,000+ Posts
Millenials are more resistant to abortion but they are also MUCH more cognoscente of birth control. That's a direct result of the sex education movement. These millenials are more selfish (damn I sound old!) than previous generations. They understand the impact a child would have on their lives and seek to avoid it at all costs. Heck, for the educated millenials, the average age of their first marriage has to be climbing into the 30's now. They care so much about themselves they don't want to be burdened by interdependence with a spouse.
ProdigalHorn
10,000+ Posts
And they won't get out of my yard, either!
NJlonghorn
2,500+ Posts
Millennials aren't resisting abortion more than youth did in the past. Link. They just don't face the abort-or-not decision as frequently as their predecessors-in-youth. Link.
I hate to be blunt (never mind, I don't hate it), but some of you need to come to grips with the fact that young people are going to ****. In prior generations, all too many youth were shackled by the idea that sex out of wedlock is immoral, so they decided that they weren't going to do it. But then they did. On the spur of the moment, without taking appropriate precautions. Then, they faced the decision to either have an abortion or have a baby.
Just like prior generations, the current generation of youth also fucks. But they are better educated about sex, so they are able to make a fully informed decision, as opposed to succumbing to temptation. This forethought enables them to use condoms and other forms of birth control to minimize the risk of a pregnancy. The fact that you think their conduct is immoral or inadvisable doesn't matter to them.
I think there's truth to this, but I don't think it's entirely right. I've never bought the idea that people who got pregnant were "uneducated." Have we ever really had a lot of people who know how to have sex (not how to have "good sex" (whatever that means) but just "where things go") but don't know that pregnancy can happen? I doubt it.
What I think has really changed is the lack of inhibition and therefore the willingness to plan. Guys and girls meet up planning to have sex. There's no pretense, so the dude makes sure he has condoms, or if he's lucky, the girl he's getting with is on the pill. Past generations (though still pretty recent generations like my own) usually had the pretense that sex at least wasn't a certainty, so they didn't always prepare. She wasn't on the pill, and the guy didn't bring condoms, but the sex often happened anyway, and yada, yada, yada, pregnancies happened.
Furthermore, I think the lack of inhibition snowballs on itself and creates social pressure to have sex. If you're a girl who doesn't want to have premarital sex, you're going to have a hard time getting and keeping a boyfriend. Why? Because girls who will "put out" for him are everywhere. If you won't have sex with him, some skank next door will.
I also agree that past young generations "******" (since we're using that term) as much as they do now, but I think it was done under very different circumstances. Yes, people were much more religious, but the logistics of a young guy having sex with a young girl were a lot tougher. Most young girls lived at home with a mother and a father, neither of whom were going to enable some dude to come bang their daughter and would actively try to prevent that from happening sometimes under a real threat of physical violence to the guy. Furthermore, before the 1950s, very few young men owned a car, so there was no where for them to run off to alone. Both factors meant that parents had to be a lot more involved in the process of dating, which meant fewer opportunities to be alone and therefore have sex.
But of course, hormones are hormones, so they did have sex as they do now. In fact, with the rise of porn and cyber sex, they probably had real sex more than young people do now. However, the "urgency" to have sex meant that the guy had MUCH more motivation to get married quickly, because then the girl's parents (who wanted grandchildren) would be working in his favor rather than against him. Stringing some chick along for years had real consequences for a guy - much less chance for sex. Furthermore, the reverse of the social pressure that currently exists for women to have sex existed for men. If a guy farted around and didn't propose to a girl, some other guy would. Hence, a 19 year old guy would pull what little money he had together, buy a tiny diamond ring, and marry some 17 year old chick. He may have married for love, but he married at 19 rather than 31 for sex.
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The article isn't surprising nor anything I would't expect a selfish elitist to write. If I remember correctly, the Nazi's thought the elimination of the Jewish race would be an "unequivocal positive".
As far as the last point goes. The author certainly sets herself up for criticism with that one as I've known and seem plenty of examples of women who have been emotionally devastated for 10, 20, 30+ years because they chose to end the life of their unborn child.
As far as the last point goes. The author certainly sets herself up for criticism with that one as I've known and seem plenty of examples of women who have been emotionally devastated for 10, 20, 30+ years because they chose to end the life of their unborn child.
NJlonghorn
2,500+ Posts
Deciding to have an abortion certainly can have devastating emotional consequences on a woman. Deciding not to have an abortion also can have devastating emotional consequences on a woman. This is why the gold standard is avoiding unwanted pregnancies.
NJlonghorn
2,500+ Posts
Consider a quarterback who sits down with a playbook and memorizes his read progressions, but doesn't study film or practice live. That quarterback isn't sufficiently educated about the offense, and won't be able to make effective decisions in real time.
Similarly, simply having book knowledge about "where things go" and "that pregnancy can happen" doesn't make a kid "educated" about sex. Kids need to know about the different kinds of birth control, where to acquire it, and how to use it. But even that isn't enough. The hardest (pun intended) part is knowing how to talk about birth control with a partner before it is too late.
Consider this -- a girl is with a guy she's been dating for a while. She knows that she should keep a condom handy, but for some reason she doesn't have one at the moment. Plan A is out the window. When things get hot and heavy, she knows that her next option is to make sure the guy has a condom. Uh oh, he doesn't. Plan B is out the window, and by now both kids' hormones are raging out of control. If neither kid has game-planned that situation, they are likely to go through with sex. But if one or both has game planned that situation, they are more likely to come (pun intended) to a better resolution, such as hand or oral sex. Then, the next time, they will make sure they have a condom ready. Until a kid is at this point, I don't think they are truly "educated" about sex.
and I think there are easy to find studies which show the comparative rates of abortion clearly show the USA in post RoeVWade far exceeds any other "first world" nation.
A simple gander at various nations' laws regarding abortion reveal USA is among the most permissive.
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I wouldn't argue you are wrong in this statement, but if that's the predominant outlook ... what a pitiful testimony of our youth; especially our boys.
If that's what it takes to "keep a boy" then that boy wasn't worth keeping.
Of course, there are exceptions to this. However, with the destruction of any sort of moral compass when it comes to sexual activity, the exceptions are becoming fewer and fewer. I'm going to try to raise my own son to be one of those exceptions, but I don't think most people do that anymore. And of course, society laughs at and ridicules those who do.
true ... and behaving properly is the only sure fire way to do that. Relenting your responsibility to a pill or a device to become a shield to your intentional act is pitiful ... but consistent with the way our societal values have degenerated.
I've been sorely blessed with a couple of young men placed in my care to raise. I know they've been challenged in this and they've honorably resisted.
They have their girlfriends and they treat them with respect ... not as play toys ... nor as status emblems/arm candy/etc. The biggest reason for this is the example they had. I wasn't perfect in my relationship with my wife, but it's been one of almost 27 married years of integrity. Their grandparents, my folks and hers, one man/one woman for 50 years each ... until Dad passed last year ... and even Mom's parents until Paw Paw passed in '11. Ditto wifee's grandparents. The boys observed that for 20 and 18 years (well ... ok ... deduct their "infink" years). Example is STILL the standard.
The relationship between them and me is making the transition from "Father" to friend. They are both legal adults, now, and still in need of guidance which I am ready to provide, but clearly they live their own lives and I'm proud of them for that. Hopefully I can make that transition like my father so aptly did 30 years ago.
Abortion is bad. It takes what that unborn baby has (security/nourishment) ... and it takes what it would have had; a chance to live. It kills the baby and it strikes a blow to our collective conscience.
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Yeah let's just clue in the folks who should avoid procreating about this. Problem solved. Let's have lunch!
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