Abortion in the case of rape/incest

I am pro-life. I do not believe in an exception for incest and rape. While I deplore rape and incest and support laws and procedures that I pray will eliminate them from our world, I do not believe that terminating a pregnancy that results from a rape is morally right.
I will restate what many here say. The heart of the matter is when does life begin. In the sense that we need to ask when a fetus becomes a person. Some may answer that the moment that an infant emerges from their mother and breathes on her own and can exist independently. Others will talk about the moment of viability. This is currently a theory that is wrapped up with our legal system in determining the legality of abortion. A 3rd option that is often talked about is the moment that brainwaves can be detected in a fetus. And the 4th I see often mentioned is of course the moment of conception.
It is my belief that what constitutes personhood is wrapped up in our very DNA. If there is an entity that has unique human DNA that is alive and growing and replicating, then that entity has a right to life. This would mean that I believe there is a right to life as soon as the DNA from the egg and sperm unite to form a single complete unique and replicating human DNA.
Some mentioned that there will be a point when the point of viability will be conception. I agree that at least in theory science could support a fertilised egg to 'birth.'
The only 'exception' I would make with regards to abortion is if the mother's life is in danger. As I look at that situation it is not really a matter of abortion, but rather of one life v. another life. Morally we have an obligation to protect life as best we can. At this point it becomes a medical decision as to how best to support life. Can both mother and child be saved? If yes, then this is the best option. Can only one be saved? If yes, then the question should come to who have the best change of surviving.
 
"And if men struggle and strike a woman with child so that she has a miscarriage, yet there is no further injury, he shall be fined as the woman's husband may demand of him, and he shall pay as the judges decide. But if there is any further injury, then you shall appoint as a penalty life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise."

Exodus 21:22-25

I shall now sit back and watch the sophistry begin.
 
Most of the semantics and minutia involved in the where life begins debate is only as a result of the abortion issue. If abortion weren't an issue there would most likely be total consensus as to where life begins. And acknowleging this fact is why I believe abortion in all cases short of a mother's death is murder. Having said that, I realize that because of the way the issue has evolved there will never be a law imposed that would satisfy my beliefs. So what is the next best option? This is where I wish the abortion debate would take place. How can we progress to a point where it becomes an extremely rare procedure?
 
yeah whitman, your strawman is perfect for the sophistry you so clearly desire.
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yeah, god must be a real prick because he didn't make humans immortal.
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i have a feeling i'm going to wear out the rolleyes smiley before this thread ends.
 
kgp with a perfectly reasonable, logically sound post and not a single comment on it. Imagine that from this bunch on this topic!!

It all boils down to what a person is and when a person is. Personally, I don't see how you can be ok morally with the abortion of a healthy 34 week fetus, yet morally be against infanticide from birth up to say 2 weeks. From a biologic (i.e. objective, scientific) standpoint the two organisms are virtually indistinguishable, yet legally if not morally we only define one as a person. Why?
 
roundhouse, what exactly did you miss in my response? you called a miscarriage an abortion performed by god. basically, you said the fetus died of natural causes.

well, people die from natural causes every day, do you get pissed at god for those "post-birth abortions"?

i really don't understand what other point you were trying to make, besides being inflammatory on this thread.
 
Missou ---
the post I responded to said that fetuses ALWAYS become just like us "humans" given time. I said, no they do not. Spontaneous abortions happen with much frequency. About 25% of the time. If pre-birth life is so sacred why would God cause/allow such a thing to occur? In some instances there may be chromosomal abnormalities....does he just not like gimps? Or is it a quality of life issue for Him? Just trying to figure it out, since you guys have a direct line to God, and all.

Oh and the rape exception really isn't inconsistent. The baby is obviously half-rapist and doesn't deserve to live. Makes perfect sense.
 
Pregnant women are in a very vulnerable state and the rates of domestic abuse are higher among pregnant women, so I have no problem with laws that give pregnant women more protection regardless of how the laws are worded. Also, although I do not know when life begins, I do know life begins before birth.

I am not pro-life, but I do not see a problem with a person being pro-life and being for legal abortion in cases of rape and incest. Every time we get in a car there is a slight chance we will be involved in an accident that might kill an innocent child who had no say in whether they wanted to get in the car or not. We are willing to accept this risk because the benefits of autos greatly outweigh the drawbacks. We also know innocent women and children will die when we go to war, but we are willing to accept their deaths because we feel they are necessary in order to make us safer. So innocent people die all the time and we simply cannot prevent all the deaths of innocent people. Now, we do a great deal to minimize the loss of innocent human life in both the auto and war situation, but we still cannot get the number to zero.

So, even if one thinks a fetus conceived by rape or incest is an innocent baby, I can understand how a pro-life person could be in favor of legal abortion in those rare instances. I can understand this position, because the consequences of a woman having to be pregnant for 9 months and then give birth and then most likely give that baby up for adoption could be devastating to a girl or woman who would be in a very unstable mental and physical condition after being raped.
 
I was a product of a semi-crisis pregnancy (parents both young). In addition my mom had a life threatening complicationd when she was pregnant with me. My mom had complications with my sib as well.

I'm glad they didn't abort me.




.... and my brother too I suppose
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Strawman? WTF? There is an extensive discussion in this thread about how a fairly new Texas law says that if a fetus is killed in an attack on the mother, it is murder, ergo abortion must be murder. Here is the biblical treatment of the issue, and that is a strawman? Dude, one of us doesn't understand what a "strawman" argument is. Explain to me why you think it is me?
 
Whitman--sure, you brought up the Biblical treatment--Old Testament treatment. If you want to get into a discussion about God's covenents with Man and the Laws he has provided, that's probably best in another thread. You know that Christians have been bound to a new covenent--"eye for an eye" is in no way valid anymore. Hence, I called it a strawman.
 
I didn't want to read the entire thread so i don't know for sure whether this was addressed but I happen to believe abortion is murder in all cases. a fetus being "viable" at the time there is a heart beat. i am not opposed to morning after pills, birth control, etc.

to specifically address the thread, woman that are raped, report it, and are treated never get pregnant. When they are treated, the woman is "cleaned" and inspected, etc. i don't know how many reported cases of incest occur in which there is a pregancy and the woman has requested an abortion. this is always a scenario proposed by the left who are pro-choice but i have never actually heard of a case of it. this may happen a lot in tennessee but they may want to keep the children so abortion really isnt an issue. all i know is that an exception could always be written in for incest but this is never an acceptable alternative for any reason.
 
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