why i think early commits is a good thing for OU

notreally

notreally

1,000+ Posts
while i have to admit, it is very frustrating to watch you guys fill up your class with the top (or most of) talent in texas before we even get to the summer..... the way this year is unfolding, i think it is a good thing for us (sooners).

sure, we never even got a real chance on they guys you already got, but let's be honest, it is likely those guys would have chosen texas over OU probably 9 times out of ten. so it would essentially have been a fake contest. one where we thought we had a chance, but really didn't.

IMHO, the new trend that texas has been leading actually benefits us.

1. we identify early guys in texas we DON'T have a chance at. that enables us to turn up the heat on the texas guys we do have a chance with, and helps us decide how our national picture needs to shape up.
2. it puts more pressure on the remaining texas studs to possibly commit early to us.... hoping to play on a championship level team close to home.

so, it first it irked me a bit, and then i was a bit jealous..... but now, i think this is better for us.
 
OU offered a lot of our recruits.

Saying that OU never had a chance is kind of like playing football until the game is out of reach then walking away saying you weren't even trying in the first place.

You are right that there are guys like Shipley who are sure locks, but I think there aren't a whole lot of kids in the country that are beyond OUs reach.
 
Valid point, notreally. But the fact is that Texas HS football produces more than enough talent to fill the recruiting pipeline for the Big XII South teams and have more left for some national recruiting, as well as the Houstons/Rices/SMUs along the way. OU will always get some top quality recruits from Texas - I'd like to see it minimized and see the very best talent stay in state.

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I agree with notreally and TexasJack. Even if OU is trying to recruit many of the guys we end up collecting, it finds out early on that TEXAS has won many recruiting battles and is able to redirect more energy into landing kids TEXAS is not pursuing for most of the year.
 
I told myself the same thing when Betty Lou Gonzoflunky was the only girl remaining not dancing at the seventh grade sockhop.
 
I get your point not really, and I do agree that it's better for you guys to look at the glass half full rather than half empty. Medium game Bob stays whizzed off enough for okie fan anyway, so better for you to let him get his panties in a wad rather than you.

I'm pretty sure zero-u's recruiting to date is hurting the ags and, to a degree, Tech worse than anybody. I do expect Tubs to get Tech back in the recruiting game by his second time around. agricultural and the Shermanator?...not so much.
 
The other interesting thing from last year is how Texas took one of the top recruits from state of Oklahoma. Previously this wasn't happening.

OU was getting the top in state, cherry picking a few every once in awhile from Texas, getting 2nd tier talent in Texas, and going nationally to get some blue chips.

It is an on going recruiting battle every year. Just seems to me that Texas has done a better job in recent years. Of course it helps having coach Boom.
 
Hurts aggy a lot because players have a choice between ou, osu and aggy when Texas passes on them due to numbers . One of the 3 is not like the others.
 
I think this argument would be more valid if Texas wasn't bringing in the majority of the top talent in the state.

Out of the top 25 prospects for 2011 how many of them are committed to Texas?

OU is now left with the scraps that Texas doesn't want and is fighting with Aggie for the rest.
 
not really,

Rivalry aside, I see your point. Texas produces a lot of D1 prospects and UT can't sign them all. But you still got to compete with OSU, A&M, and LSU for the rest.

While it does have benefits in terms of helping the OU staff know who to go after, at the end of the day the early commitments to Texas still benefit Texas the most.
 
The clear benefit is that you know where to concentrate your recruiting efforts. I have no quarrel with that idea.

But...everybody else knows the same thing. Player X is off the board, we need to grab player Y instead. So it is not only you turning up the heat, but also the other legitimate programs in the region like TCU, Houston, Tech, Baylor, OSU, UTEP, Texas State, Rice, Blinn Juco, Tulane, Tulsa (did I miss anybody? I don't think so...) So while you get no competition from Mack Brown, you do get more competition from the rest of the pack.

With that said, 90% of the time OU ought to kick every other team I listed square in the nuts in a recruiting battle. So you got that going for you.
 
Look, I remember the late 80's and the 90's recruiting for Texas. Remember that? Remember how many top ranked recruiting classes we had year after year. Oh wait, we didn't. (Hey no disrespect to those teams I had some favorite players from back them) Remember how many games we won? Exactly. What Mack is doing is working. I got no complaints.
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Tex81 nails it.

Notreally may like what we are doing, but it benefits us most and then lays open all the reminder to everyone, not just OU. We in the meantime are working on the next class.
 
I agree in some regard, though I'm sure ou fans would prefer it 6-7 yrs ago where had just as much shot at the top 20 players as Texas did. Now however, it seems 10 of the top 20 are just waiting for Mack to offer while ou (and select few others) can battle and split the rest with Texas. And even after Mack nabs 18-20 of his in-state favorites, there are still probably 30 or more others good enough to play for, start, and win at the highest level of div1. ou can still get maybe 10 of those from Texas and focus more on Cal, Kan, Ill, Fla to fill out their class. Mack also doesn't even offer all the top players in state, just the ones he thinks are the best fit. That always leaves numerous all-american/ all-conference type players free for ou or others to get without even competition from Texas. And there will always be 5 or so of the 20 players Mack signs that Stoops and others were indifferent on anyway. Ultimately maybe 10 players they really would like are off the table early with no chance at them, and they certainly wouldn't have gotten more than 5 of them even in 03-04. They wont have to waste there time (the Perilloux effect) and can grab 5 elite players from far away lands. They don't seem hurt at all. aNm, and even LSU are damaged more. There is a trickle down effect to others...
 
But overall, we have out-recruited them since 2005.

Before that they had a star average that was higher than ours and since then we are higher than they are.

Advantage UT.
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The strategy UT has now stuck with is neither good or bad for other top programs in the area, in my opinion. OU gets top-ranked classes every year. We've had maybe ONE mediocre class out of the last 10. This pre-dates and post-dates Texas' current approach of garnering 90% of their commits by March. UT fans who think this has been some sort of awe-inspiring domination over OU in recruiting circles might wanna check their egos. Hell, check the Inside Texas rankings. Clendon will probably have OU nabbing HALF the top ten before all is said and done. Sure, UT will be getting more of the top fifty, but OU doesn't need a majority of thsoe kids to field competitive teams. We can get top kids from OK, KS and cherry pick from FL and CA. This is no different than it ever has been.
 
No one is denying that OU is not getting good classes. They are not as good as Texas' classes.

However, they are getting fewer of the kids from Texas than they use to for the last five years. Just consider AP and Bomar.

Their overall star rank while admittedly not perfect, it is the only semi-objective way to compare years is down somewhat compared to the early years of the 2000-2009 years. Certainly not down to TCU or Aggy levels, but the key is below Texas.

Moreover, since Coach Boom has joined Texas, we not only are securing the services of almost all the Texas kids we want before OU and others even have a shot, we are also looking more for the bluest of the blue in other states. We will see if this continues.

OU's problems with this is that they are probably getting slightly weaker classes than Texas and they are having to go way out of state to get a lot such as in California, Florida, and other states.

That has several issues:
1. It takes more effort to get those kids which means it distracts from close to home such as in the north Texas area and this will likely contribute to the continuation of the Texas domination of Texas.

2. Eighteen-year-old kids away from home where they have to take a plane flight are more likely to get homesick, miss friends, wonder if it is worth it to put in the hard work necessary, and thus be more likely to quit or do less well than advertised.

3. I think that the kids out of state tend to be over-rated compared to Texas kids and kids in the South. I base that on the number of NFL players who are from the South and Texas. Why would they be over-rated? Because the ranking services have to sell subscriptions and they cannot place stars based on how they predict success (even if they can evaluate this since the competition in other States is lower as well), but on relative state populations, especially in football tradition rich states, such as the Big Ten schools areas.

So, I love the trend. If Texas is able to beat OU again this year (and I do think it is a toss-up), then the OU fans will be getting very restless and Texas is likely to beat OU about 3 out of 4 years as long as the current staff stays in place.

Lastly, OU is really in trouble long term if they are left out of the conference expansion which it seems that they will be. Big Ten, PAC 10, nor SEC are interested. Why? Big Ten and PAC 10 want schools with better academic records and cleaner history (1 clean NC all time in 2000 and even that it is somewhat doubtful given Big Red and the number of programs on probation now; basketball anyone?).

The SEC largely does not care about academics or clean histories, but why would they take a strong competitor in who adds so few hard-core fans? Answer is, they won't.
 
LonghornsWin, even if I grant you every point you made -- which I don't, necessarily -- do you honestly believe there will be much difference in the success level of the 2 programs? I'm going to guess it will continue to swing back and forth, as it has for the last decade. And honestly, I'm granting Texas a little in making that comment. I feel OU has more skins on the wall over the decade in question. You've won a couple more BCS games, while we've won more conference titles. I'll call it a push, even though I'd rather have conference titles. You'd probably claim the opposite, and that's fine.

My entire point before is that if UT has the #3 ranked class, per Rivals, and OU finishes with the #7 ranked class, there is virtually no appreciable difference; both teams got great classes that almost every other program will be envious. To paint any other picture smacks of naive. These services aren't infallible on judging talent, so any class in the top ten will probably be really good.

It should also be noted that just because UT is snapping up commits early doesn't mean those kids are 'the best' kids to be had. Again, this statement hasn't proven to be true, as Mack has whiffed on prospects, same as Stoops, Saban and Meyer. These staffs aren't perfect and probably don't go off Rivals rankings to make their offers. At the end of the day, I'm pleased with the classes OU is bringing in, and Texas fans would be, too, if in the same position. If that means UT continues their current approach, that's fine.
 
OUE,

Appreciate the measured response.

I am saying that the star average was higher for OU early in the decade than it is now. OU was high this year because of having (I believe) five more commits than Texas. I actually did an analysis a year or so ago comparing then and now in terms of stars and recruits. Texas is better off now than they were earlier int he decade and OU is lower.

Does this always translate into better teams. Yes and no. Analyses in the past have shown that the overall higher a team recruits, the better they tend to finish. But of course, quality of coaching, bounces of the ball, busts in recruiting, injuries all factor in to how a team does each year.

I do think that things have temporarily gone to our side because our coaching staff is better at the moment than yours and because we are getting somewhat higher commits. Obviously, this can be disputed. Texas winning 4/5 cannot.

You do have more conference championships and you should be proud of that. It is much closer than it looks though and we have better consistency and more overall conference wins.

The future for OU is not so bright if the realignment takes place. The Big three conferences are not very interested in OU for the reasons I mentioned and just like Texas had a hard time getting great BB recruits here even if they lived in Texas until we joined the Big XII, I predict that OU will have problems in a second tier (but still BCS) conference.

I may be wrong on all accounts. Time will tell.
 
The possibility of OU's systemic cheating causing them to get locked out of conference realignments would be sweet justice. It could be that this is the beginning of the demise of OU's elite competitiveness once recruits catch wind that Oklahoma's stature in regards to national TV appearances will diminish because it has no association with a super-conference. It may have taken too long, but finally they might reap what they have been sowing for decades. To see them in a conference with the University of Houston and Colorado State, etc would be fantastic.
 
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