Question for the Liberals

I35

I35

5,000+ Posts
We have heard that the rich "doesn't pay their fair share." So how many families should the rich pay for in taxes per family? 20, 30, 50, hell 100 families? Please give a number of families the rich should pay for?

A question for BI. I know this is a long shot, but a few years back there was a guy that had a college football forum. There was a fellow Texas fan on that board that was named RadioFreeBevo. The Texas fans had to stick together because we had just won a national championship and every college football fan were coming after the Horns by trolling. But RFB and I didn't see eye to eye on politics. By chance was that you? Don't forget to answer the above question.
 
Crickets chirping. This proves exactly what I have been saying on this board about Libs. It's much easier for Obama to holler 1 liners and repeats it over and over such as "War on Women" or "The rich needs to pay their fair share" or "Romney wants to take us back to the policies that got us in this mess". It's much hard for Romney to explain the facts because it's much more than one sentence and it takes time to explain and takes using your brain to understand those facts. I'm challenging a Lib to give us a number of families that it takes for Romney to pay for for it to be fair. I even offered them some numbers even going as high as 100 families that Romney would have to pay for that would make it fair. Step up Libs and give a number or don't be an idiot and fall for their one liners.
 
You posted a question that seems to defy an intelligent answer. Are you thinking we should make being an American something that comes with a franchise fee?OK kid, you are 21 and responsible for 10K in annual federal revenue on a rising scale culmating at 35K at age 60. Oh and if you have wild success making more than 1 million a year, you have to pay the fees for 2 mallingerers. 50 million a year and you have to pay for 60.
 
I'm not a true liberal -- I am equally scared of true "liberals" as I am of true "conservatives". But I suspect the reason you aren't getting any answers is because the question makes no sense on many levels.

First, what does it mean to be "rich.” A “rich” person making $1 million per year shouldn’t be expected to pay as much in taxes as someone making $100 million per year.

Second, what does it mean to “pay for” a family. We aren’t talking about paying for a certain number of families. We are talking about paying for a share of the national government’s operations.

Third, it is only partially a question of what is “fair”. To a large degree, it is a question of what is “best.” The biggest problem facing our economy is the growing concentration of wealth. In Monopoly, where the rules are totally fair, one person ends up with all of the money and all of the property. I believe that a totally “fair” system in the real world would have pretty much the same result, with the wealthy gathering a steadily increasing slice of the pie. Eventually, the “masses” would get fed up and we would end up with rebellion of some sort. If we don’t fix the problem now, I can see a scenario where the Marxist crazies manage to get seats in Congress 20 years from now and the Presidency 20 years after that.

In Monopoly, we solve the problem by shuffling the deck, redistributing the money, and starting over. We can’t do that in the real world (nor would I if I had the choice). Taxes are the best proxy we have. This may not be fair, but it is what we have to do to preserve our capitalistic system.

Fourth, it is hard to say what exactly “fair” means. In the above discussion, I assumed “fair” to mean what you seem to mean by it – equal. I don’t see it quite like that. Successful Americans often want to take credit for being “self made.” That is rarely, if ever, the truth. I was born into a society with good hospitals and health care, excellent nutrition, clean water, good schools, etc. I took advantage of these things and put myself in a position to be successful, so I deserve some of the credit. But society as a whole helped me get to where I am. I don’t pretend for a second that I would be this successful if I had been born elsewhere.

Now that I own my own business, I still get helped by the government. They build roads and other common resources, educate my potential employees (not to mention my kids), research and eradicate disease, provide for an external defense and internal policing, etc. etc. etc.

In short, the government has invested money and effort in me. It doesn’t strike me as “unfair” for the government to make a nice return on this investment. The more successful I am, the bigger the government’s ROI should be.

I don’t begrudge the people who make tens of millions of dollars. In fact, I hope to be one of them one day. If I am, I will be proud of my accomplishments, but I will also be mindful of the fact that living in the USA made it all possible. And I will be delighted to pay handsomely for that fact.
 
So you are spinning the question now? It's not a hard question at all. I'm asking your opinion. It's up to you to figure out what's fair. It's up to you to determine how many families should be covered by the Romney. I know why you won't answer it. You will do anything to not put a number down. Just answer the question. Okay, let me ask you this. Is it fair that Romeny will cover 100 families taxes? 47% doesn't have to pay federal taxes. So Romney has to help cover them not paying taxes.

WashU, really? That's the best you can do is link something stupid from Youtube? To answer youronly one good question I'm talking Romney rich.
 
There was the clip recently released (from the late 90's) in which BO clearly proclaims that he's in favor of redistribution of wealth. I think he can't say that now, so "the rich need to pay their fair share" is version 2.0.

There's a section of Whitehouse.org where the WH addresses the issue of "the people who pay no income tax." Their take on this is that when you factor in payroll taxes, the numbers don't looks so bad, ie the "rich" only pay a few percent more in combine income/payroll tax than one would think based on their percentage of total income. Fair enough, but isn't that admitting that they already pay more than their "fair share" at least based on income and payroll taxes.
 
Your original question was about a hypothetical rich person, which was unanswerable. Now you ask a fundamentally different question -- how much should Romney himself pay? That is still a hard question, but it is closer to being answerable.

Based on the tax returns released today, the Romneys made $13.7 milllion in 2011. That is 100 times more than someone who made $137,000. Thus, I think the Romneys should pay AT LEAST 100 times as much as someone who made $137,000, and arguably quite a bit more than that.

How many people's share of the government would be funded by that amount of taxes? I don't know how to calculate, or even conceptualize, that number. But I would venture to say that it would be way more than 100 no matter how you calculated it.

Please, god, let me face the horror of such unmitigated unfairness.
 
NJlonghorn,

Not sure where you got your numbers from on Romney 2011, but it looks like he paid 3,226,623.00 in taxes. In 2011 the federal government collected $1,100,000,000,000.00. It is estimated the number of workers in 2011 is at about 140,000,000. This makes $1,100,000,000,000.00/140,000,000 = $7,857 per person in taxes. So what Romney paid in taxes covers atleast 411 people. How can one person be obligated to cover that manyt people. That is flatout not right. When 47% doesn't pay any federal income tax and then you have idiots that say the rich doesn't pay their fair share, that isw complete ********. That's not America and is complete class warfare.

By the way, you bring up asking how rich? Does it matter when BHO makes the claim the rich doesn't pay their fair share a general statement? If having to ask tells me you just go along with his liberal talking points. Enough is enough. It's time to get this clown out of office and unite America again.
 
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