“Players who skip bowl games likely to tank in NFL” (Shannon and Jimmy Johnson)

Johnson also had another saying, Shannon said: "What you see is what you're going to get. So don't cover up your eyes and say, 'I can change him.'"

"In recruiting, it's the same thing," Shannon said. "You see things in recruiting and you say, 'Oh, I can change him. Oh, I can change him.'

"If the guy's been doing that for 18 years, there's nothing you can change about him."

We have a 2019 recruit who didn't sign in December and has been acting like a diva and was kicked off his high school team for a couple of weeks. Do we think we can change him if he signs?
 
A DC at a Group of 5 school doesn't hold much weight. However, Johnson knew talent like few other coaches so that is cause to pause. However, I think this phenomenon is too young to make that judgment.

Business decisions are made every day in the real world. College football players are for the most part not in the real world so saying they are skipping a game after 3 or 4 years of a free ride is a business decision is a mischaracterization, but it is a decision they are free to make. However, that decision should be their first real-world lesson - there are penalties for skipping out on a contract. Their penalty should be having to repay 3 or 4 times the value they received under their scholarship.
 
""If a team is 6-9, no chance of them making the playoffs, are they going to play or are they going to tank it?"

In the pros, will the coach care in this case?
Or will he just as soon save his star athletes health for next year and try to draft around them, get some free agents and build for next season.
It's a different mind set all around.
The only player I can ever think of is Christian McCaffrey.
Panthers are going nowhere and he's still suiting up.
 
moondog_LFZ said:
""If a team is 6-9, no chance of them making the playoffs, are they going to play or are they going to tank it?"

In the pros, will the coach care in this case?
Or will he just as soon save his star athletes health for next year and try to draft around them, get some free agents and build for next season.
It's a different mind set all around.
The only player I can ever think of is Christian McCaffrey.
Panthers are going nowhere and he's still suiting up.
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Le'veon Bell sat out the entire year over the number of touches required of him because the franchise tag was not enough money. An entire year and it had nothing to do with the team's record. That is the wave of the future I bet at running back in the NFL. But the story is not over yet; we'll see who signs him next year and for how much. Should be interesting.

I wonder what Zeke will do in another year or so when (I say when because the Cowboys have shown they won't over-pay a running back by letting Demarco Murray go) the Cowboys don't give him a multi-year contract with a big bonus.
 
ViperHorn said:
A DC at a Group of 5 school doesn't hold much weight. However, Johnson knew talent like few other coaches so that is cause to pause. However, I think this phenomenon is too young to make that judgment.

Business decisions are made every day in the real world. College football players are for the most part not in the real world so saying they are skipping a game after 3 or 4 years of a free ride is a business decision is a mischaracterization, but it is a decision they are free to make. However, that decision should be their first real-world lesson - there are penalties for skipping out on a contract. Their penalty should be having to repay 3 or 4 times the value they received under their scholarship.
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I agree there should be a penalty however, as most of us know, we receive massive correspondence from our alma maters looking for money. These players who choose to preserve their health for their NFL careers will possibly one day be a BMD. You don't burn that bridge as a college.
 
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moondog_LFZ said:
Again I will put forth the concept that a bowl game is not considered part of the season.
They played the entire season, therefore the contract has been completed.
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They have to participate in all football activities in order to fulfill their obligation. A bowl game is part of those football activities.
 
Unless I'm missing something there is nothing written that players have to play if told to do so. Just like there is no guarantee of playing time. There is also no guarantee the player keeps his scholarship if he chooses not to play. The thing everyone is caught up with it is their last game of their career so there is no accountability.

I'm not sure why everyone is so upset about a player sitting for a meaningless game because "I would never do that".
 
bystander said:
J

We have a 2019 recruit who didn't sign in December and has been acting like a diva and was kicked off his high school team for a couple of weeks. Do we think we can change him if he signs?
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I'm inclined to doubt it. While he plays a position of great need, I'm guessing that if he wears the Burnt Orange, he won't be a contributor and could end up being a detriment.
 
Run Pincher said:
Football is a team sport. Selfishness never wins.
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Bingo. This is an issue of character, or lack thereof.

There is nothing positive about the trend. Nothing. But until a high profile coach or group of coaches calls out the behavior, it will gain momentum.

Wouldn’t it be something if coaches like Saban, Harbaugh, and a few others including an NFL coach or two got together, held a press conference, and expressed their dislike of this behavior. That’s probably what it’s going to take to stop it.
 
ViperHorn said:
They have to participate in all football activities in order to fulfill their obligation. A bowl game is part of those football activities.
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I would agree with MD if they ranked teams after all "regular season" games were completed and didn't have a ranking afterwards. I once asked an "old school" Longhorn fan why DKR was only a bit over .500 in bowl games since he was one of the alltime greats. Old School replied "he looked at it like it was a vacation for the players".
 
moondog_LFZ said:
Again I will put forth the concept that a bowl game is not considered part of the season.
They played the entire season, therefore the contract has been completed.
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I would respectfully disagree, unless you also consider an NFL player has completed the terms of their contract when the final gun blows in Game 16...do the playoffs not count for them?

The season encompasses ALL games, pre and post season. Period. If a coach elects not to play someone, the decision was that of a coach, NOT the player. After all, pre-season holdouts sustain a consequence...why should a post-season college player have no consequence? They got paid...well, in theory they did. Even more so if they actually got a meaningful degree...
 
rick mueller said:
I'm inclined to doubt it. While he plays a position of great need, I'm guessing that if he wears the Burnt Orange, he won't be a contributor and could end up being a detriment.
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Wait...I thought ALL publicity was good publicity...I guess the crime beat IS the exception to that one though LOL!
 
dukesteer said:
Bingo. This is an issue of character, or lack thereof.

There is nothing positive about the trend. Nothing. But until a high profile coach or group of coaches calls out the behavior, it will gain momentum.

Wouldn’t it be something if coaches like Saban, Harbaugh, and a few others including an NFL coach or two got together, held a press conference, and expressed their dislike of this behavior. That’s probably what it’s going to take to stop it.
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I just think this is too much of an over generalization to say it's a "character" issue. And Jimmy may know recruits/players, but personally I see little correlation to whether a player plays in a bowl game and his NFL career. It's like they are making this more than a guy that gets a DUI or tests positive for drugs. Or until 5 years ago whether he beat his girl friend. A little perspective here. College has made these bowls near meaningless. Especially once you get beyond the CFP and maybe NY6. When you have a 6-6 team playing a 7-5 team does that game really have any meaning on the national stage? Of course it doesn't. If we beat Georgia it's a big deal to us and maybe HS players in the state. We may see a recruit or 2 move our way. But do you think any HS player in Ohio will give a damn? College has made this CFP or bust and then they are surprised when guys skip. No different than fans skipping the bowl. Most of these lower tier bowls are lucky to have 1/2 the stadium filled.
 
wadster said:
I just think this is too much of an over generalization to say it's a "character" issue. And Jimmy may know recruits/players, but personally I see little correlation to whether a player plays in a bowl game and his NFL career. It's like they are making this more than a guy that gets a DUI or tests positive for drugs. Or until 5 years ago whether he beat his girl friend. A little perspective here. College has made these bowls near meaningless. Especially once you get beyond the CFP and maybe NY6. When you have a 6-6 team playing a 7-5 team does that game really have any meaning on the national stage? Of course it doesn't. If we beat Georgia it's a big deal to us and maybe HS players in the state. We may see a recruit or 2 move our way. But do you think any HS player in Ohio will give a damn? College has made this CFP or bust and then they are surprised when guys skip. No different than fans skipping the bowl. Most of these lower tier bowls are lucky to have 1/2 the stadium filled.
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Are you saying prior to the CFP that all the bowls mattered?

None of the bowls mattered prior to the BCS or CFP era. The only ones that mattered were the ones who had #1 to #4 ranked team in their bowl.
 
militaryhorn said:
Are you saying prior to the CFP that all the bowls mattered?

None of the bowls mattered prior to the BCS or CFP era. The only ones that mattered were the ones who had #1 to #4 ranked team in their bowl.
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No, the CFP has just made the other bowls less significant. Used to be New Years day was THE DAY to look forward to in college football. You had 5-6 games and it was a great day to watch and when your team played in one of those games it mattered much more than today. So no all the bowls didn't matter, but more did. Now it's 2 games and then 1 and all the rest are just meh unless your team is playing. But to say someone has character issues because they don't want to risk hurting themselves in a bowl is a judgement on one data point. You don't know the character in their heart. Maybe they feed the poor, take care of the widow which is what is demanded in the bible. No where does it say one must play in a meaningless crap bowl game. You have to look at someone in their entirety to make any type of judgement and even than it is not ours to make. But to make a judgement off of one decision makes no sense. I think all of us have a decision that in retrospect we'd do differently. They aren't committing a crime. They just aren't living up to your expectation. Get over yourself.
 
I realize that this is an emotional issue and there are differing opinions. But for my money it “is” a character issue.

We always hear that football is a team game, and it’s true. Even the greatest individual athletes (even VY) need the help of other players to excel, or succeed.

A decision by a single player to make a self-serving decision — to the detriment of the team — does make a statement about that player’s character, and not a positive one.
 
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