NSA is spying

Another chilling example of the erosion of liberty. Too bad all the reasoned discussion is going on over at the gay boy scout thread.
rolleyes.gif
 
NO
NO!! that can't be Brntorg

When James Clapper told Congress in March BO admin did NOT
"Clapper had been asked directly whether the NSA collects “any type of data at all on millions or hundreds of millions of Americans.”

“No sir,” Clapper told Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.). “Not wittingly. There are cases where they could inadvertently, perhaps, collect but not wittingly.”
He did not say he was specifically referring to email.

would a member of the BO admin LIE?The Link


edit to add, would someone from BO's admin Threaten?
Guardian write tells Piers Morgan why ys Bo admin Would threaten.The Link


Shocked,
rolleyes.gif
 
Seems like a non-partisan topic to me. The Republicans passed the Patriot Act but the current Democratic Administration is taking advantage of it. Either you think it is an invasion of privacy or a necessary evil to prevent terrorism. Unfortunately, there is a third possibility....you think it seems like a good idea, but you don't trust the government, so you go back to thinking it an invasion of privacy.
 
Does anyone remember the outrage by Dem Media Dems politicians( including BO) and , even on here about the original patriot Act which of course makes it interesting that the PA, which Dems appeared to hate was renewed.


Once it was renewed it became BO's patriot Act NOT Bush's

Dems had a chance to reject it, They didn't.
Supporters should man up and stop blaming Bush.

Intelligent people might be more interested in the lies told by Clapper
but some still feel it somehow justifies this by pointing out the original PA was passed while Bush was POTUS

OK all you supporters WHY didn't the Senate vote the PA down anytime they had a chance?
Since they didn't vote it down when does it become BO's partier act in your minds?
 
I meant my Palpitine image to be non-partisan, or bi--partisan.

I've heard that it may turn out to be this administration that helps get across the lessons to be learned about big(or socialist) government, when really it's about big government by any party, any definition.

I feel that way. I'm neither Democratic nor Republican over all these matters. I'm anti-big govermment, anti-socialist. I stand with the Founders on all points and all reasons why the Constitution was drafted following the arguments over the Federalist papers. If there was to be some kind of government, make it small and make it not at all very powerful.

When Obama mentioned some are just gumming up the works... in my opinion, that is how it is supposed to be. That WAS the design in the first place: a government that could not have a runaway power. Anytime I hear Congress is stiffled and can't move, I shout with glee. Horray!! That is how it should be. Go slow. Don't do too much. Don't overdo. Don't overreach.

If only taxes could crumble to the point the megalyth could not support itself or grow itself.
 
I think the conversation on the BSA thread is generally well-reasoned because it is non-partisan. In this case, the partisan's immediate response is to use the story to promote their own party. These partisans are not interested in the policy beyond what it can do to help their team win the next game.

When I read Orwell's 1984 in the 1970 and again in the later 70's, I didn't much like it because I didn't believe such a system could be imposed on a large republic. I reread the book in 1984 and finally got it: the people will embrace Big Brother to keep them safe.

The Federal Government has continued in this direction for decades under different administrations. Scare the people and they acquiesce.

The issue of saving massive amounts of data that can be reviewed after a crime for investigation and prosecution seems to me to be a nose of the camel in the tent proposition. If the government could be trusted to use the data exactly as they say they would use it, then maybe it's a good policy.

But I don't trust even well-meaning elected officials or agents of government to confine themselves to this protocol. Citizens calls, emails, letters and social media activity should remain private if the citizen is not under official and sanctioned police investigation.

Unless the president can explain away my objections, this is a disappointing policy move.
 
RV
that is a well reasoned overlook
with which I agree, The problem I see is there doesn't seem to be anyway to stop it especially after hearing what BOjust said



For others it is hard to accept the disclaimer that they are non partisan about the issue when the first words they posted were about Bush.
 
True, Prodigal. But also consider ill-meaning persons checking in to see who is cruising porn sites, contacting possible mistresses or reading controversial blogs so that they can be used for political attack or blackmail. J. Edgar Hoover would have been delighted using this tool.

edited for verb voice
 
Obviously this is a story of serious import that demands a lot of scrutiny. Obviously someone with this kind of power could misuse.

Were i at the NSA I'd be damned interested in what was being said when that ***** in front of me in the line at the RaceTrack cash register was so distracted by her cell phone it took her five minutes to buy a couple of packs of cigarettes and Red Bull.
 
croc
That post shows how ignorant you are of what is going on.
If you really think that is what is happening then I know you can dismiss it and feel ok about it
 
I'm glad 6721 you really know what's going on and will come back to this board to fill me in.

It was not my intent to offend you or dismiss an item of legitimate public scrutiny. Cell phone users oblivious to the danger and time waste their obsession causes others are a pet peeve and I saw this as one more opportunity to lampoon them.
 
croc
you posted a cute and ignorant example of what the BSA might be listening to
"Were i at the NSA I'd be damned interested in what was being said when that ***** in front of me in the line at the RaceTrack cash register was so distracted by her cell phone it took her five minutes to buy a couple of packs of cigarettes and Red Bull. "

when in fact the data obtained on phone calls has so little to do with the conversation

Here is what 2 former NSA men with 30 years apiece said is gleaned from phone calls
"“Aggregated metadata can be more revealing than content. It’s very important to realize that when an entity collects information about you that includes locations, bank transactions, credit card transactions, travel plans, EZPass on and off tollways; all of that that can be time-lined. To track you day to day to the point where people can get insight into your intentions and what you’re going to do next. It is difficult to get that from content unless you exploit every piece, and even then a lot of content is worthless,” he explained."
but you keep thinking the NSA is listening to conversations from the RacTrak.
 
in reply to
_________________________________________________________________________________________

croc
you posted a cute and ignorant example of what the BSA might be listening to
"Were i at the NSA I'd be damned interested in what was being said when that ***** in front of me in the line at the RaceTrack cash register was so distracted by her cell phone it took her five minutes to buy a couple of packs of cigarettes and Red Bull. "

when in fact the data obtained on phone calls has so little to do with the conversation

_______________________________________________________________________________________________________

If Obama was telling the truth and the NSA is following protocol, then the scenario I described was not realistic. Thank you for pointing this out 6721.This will be very helpful to the Hornfans readers who lack your intellectual gifts and would mistake my humble attempt at humor for serious, well-researched, commentary..
 
There must be a lot of old men out there who served in the GESTAPO or NKVD and are green with envy about the NSA.
 
croc'
Hey I said you example was cute.
The problem, not with you since I know you are quite smart
the problem is BO said, well we aren't listening to your phone calls
and people think, oh well what is the big deal. The president says they aren't listening to our calls .
 
Is this really news? two movies come to mind, Enemy of the State and Few Good Men. Do we need Col Jessup on that wall?
 
I think the NSA is well meaning in its efforts but many in the counter-terrorism effort are zealots. They do believe they are doing 'Gods work' and see their zeal as reasoned and necessary to guard us from harm. I've worked in the Intel Community before and they always get blasted any time there is an event. "intelligence failure" is an oft repeated phrase, so you can probably understand why many of them approach it this way, even beyond the fact that most are true patriots.

That doesn't excuse the politicians and administration for overstepping their bounds. This is not the NSA acting of its own volition. It is a sanctioned operation. The pol's in the circle are giving it a thumbs up. They all need to be gone. Any politician of either party that continues to support these programs.

The danger is not what they will do with the info today, it is what they can do with all the data next year or in ten years.
 
**** this Governement! There I said it. Come and get me NSA!

This path we are headed down will end in rebellion at some point. We are either a free society or we aren't.

Hell now the Russians are even offering to offer asylum to to the whistleblower. We truely live in backwards world now.
 
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