Now THIS is a filibuster!

H

Horn6721

Hook'em
"On this day in 1964, Everett Dirksen (R-IL), the Republican Leader in the U.S. Senate, condemned the Democrats’ 57-day filibuster against the 1964 Civil Rights Act. Leading the Democrats in their opposition to civil rights for African-Americans was Senator Robert Byrd (D-WV). Byrd, who got into politics as a recruiter for the Ku Klux Klan, spoke against the bill for fourteen straight hours. Democrats still call Robert Byrd “the conscience of the Senate.”

In his speech, Senator Dirksen called on the Democrats to end their filibuster and accept racial equality.
 
The parties just switched letters. So, don't get all wet over it. Any legitimate mind knows neither party does anything based on what is right or wrong
 
Shiner
Do you ANY MSM outlet or blog will mention this historical event?

I also doubt Jesse Jackson or Sharpton or Sheila Jackson Lee et al will remark on it either.

i thought it was timely as Satchel had a thread on doing away with the filibuster.

It is also timely as the Dems keep trying to paint the Republicans as the racist party.
Here we see clearly that is simply not true.
 
I know a racist when I see one and it certainly is not what along the lines of what Hollywood or the MSM wants to feed everyone.
 
93
NO
That simply is NOT true .
Pleaes provide a list of the Southern Dem Senators who voted against the civil rights act and then switched parties. See if the list is longer than 1

Or do some research and see how long it was before the south elected predominantly GOP Senators.
They kept electing Johnson ( succeded by Hollings), Jordan, Russell, Stennis, Eastland ellender fullbright, al gore and of course Byrd.

See how long those Senators were elected again after 1964 and see who succeeded them. Dem or R

I hope you actually do some research and then have the cajones to come back and say you are wrong.
 
Maybe this is just a heartfelt reaction; as they surely were touched by this awesome, good-intended campaign

The Link




smokin.gif
 
"I hope you actually do some research and then have the cajones to come back and say you are wrong."

It's complete BS to imply that he's wrong because they didn't "physically" change parties while they were alive, with the exception of Thurmond. Hell, most of them died within 10 years of passage, which was before a lot of the southern letter-flopping. Of the 20 who voted against it in the Senate, 17 were members of the Conservative Coalition. Are you unequivocally stating that they would still be Democratic Party members today? Because you're jaded/naive/dumb to state otherwise.
 
H11
Reading comprehenson is a wondrous thing. This from my post obviously went right over your head
"See how long those Senators were elected again after 1964 and see who succeeded them. Dem or R "

Most of the Senators were reelected and then were replaced by another Dem.
Examples:

Ala didn't elect a Pub Senator until 81
Va 83
Miss 89
La , still has Dems
Texas 93
Ark 97
NC converted the quickest
SC had Thurmond a former Dem who turned Pub and served until 2003 ut didn't elect another Pub as their other Sen until 2005

Horn 11
did you realize that? that the Southerns States stayed predominantly Dem in the US Senate for 25-30 years AFTER the Civil rights bill was signed in .64?

That makes it hard for dems to try to float the arguement that all the south turned Repub to protest civil rights doesn't it?
 
Sen. Robert Byrd renounced and apologized profusely his early stance in favor of the KKK and his later battle against civil rights. Maybe we can forgive Byrd along with Sen. Strom Thurmond, who broke with the Democratic party over civil rights, and Jesse Helms, a Democratic politician who turned Republican over the civil rights act and later became a senator. The country didn't become accepting of civil rights all at once, but eventually just about everyone saw the light, including Byrd, Thurmond and Helms. Certainly we can be grateful that Lyndon Johnson, northern Republicans, northern Democrats and westerners of both parties saw the light in the 1960s and our children today find the idea of citizens being denied, on the basis of thier color, the right to vote, attend state universities or swim in a public swimming pool mystfying and bizarre.

The south turning Republican may have been influenced to some degree by the civil rights act, but in my opinion it was overdue forgiveness of Republicans for the Civil War and Reconstruction.
 
Crock?

" and Jesse Helms, a Democratic politician "
You know Helms did not vote on the civil rights bill? and did not hold an elected office as a Democract and was elected to the US Seante in 1973 as Pub?

I know you and others like to pretend the south turned Republican becasue the Republicans were racist.
Facts just do not support that lie.
Of the 11 " southern" states who voted against the civil rights act of 1976 all relected the sameDem Senators who voted AGAINST the civil rights act of 1964 if they ran OR voted another Dem senator in their place for decades. The only exception to that was NC who voted a GOP Senator ( helms ) in 73 and another in 75.
some never changed ( La all Dem) or have one of each and several had Dems senators until 2003.

4 of the 11 didn't elect a Repub Senator uintil the 80's
I am disappointed that so many people take at face value the south became Republican because of racism.

You and others keep using that false talking point
 
And I'm saying that the racist Democrats who voted nay on it were Dems of a different time and would have been unelectable today. And the fact that they were all quite conservative also, by generally accepted beliefs, means they wouldn't be Democrats either. Stating that the individuals/states didn't "switch parties" until later doesn't change my statement one bit.
 
Horn6721, since you posted "Reading comprehenson is a wondrous thing." prior to you addled-assed critique of my post I assume your misrepresentation of what I said is picking a fight rather than innocent misunderstanding.

So fine: Let's start

What I said:
The south turning Republican may have been influenced to some degree by the civil rights act, but in my opinion it was overdue forgiveness of Republicans for the Civil War and Reconstruction. -- Crockett

How you responded:
"I am disappointed that so many people take at face value the south became Republican because of racism.

You and others keep using that false talking point "-- Horn6721

I never said that Jesse Helms voted against the civil rights act of 1964, but he was a well known political commentator, trade assn president and legislative aide (calling him a politician was judgement call -- you could argue either way but there's no question he spent his working hours engaged in political communication.) He was known for his rabid opposition to the civil rights act and Encylopedia Brittanica and other sources say that it was a major factor in his 1970 switch to the Republican Party. Strom Thurmond made it clear the Civil Rights Act of 1964 was the reason he switched party allegiances. He was among those filibustering with Byrd.

Byrd, Thurmond and Helms later repudiated earlier anti-civil rights stands, though Byrd did it first and with more fervor. I suggested all three men be forgiven. They were a product of their times, subjected to influences and dogma that we cannot replicate or judge.


"I know you and others like to pretend the south turned Republican becasue the Republicans were racist.
Facts just do not support that lie." -- Horn6721"


The fact is that over the last 50 years the Democratic party has become progressively more liberal and was no longer a good home for guys like Helms and Thurmond. Those gentlemen mounted a spirited defense of the staus quo and old-fashioned values on lots of issues besides race. I honestly think the guys that conservative were only Democrats because in the Solid South the GOP had no traction. Civil rights was just one issue that motivated southerners to consider switching parties. There have been lots of issues where Southerners' postions, on average, were more conservative than other Americans. As the Republican Party has developed into an even more clearly conservative organization, I think it was natural, even intelligent, for southerners to abandon old and irrational prejudice against the GOP dating to the Civl War and it's aftermath.
 
Just to be clear, I'd also like to go on record that I've not called anyone out as racists. Though I certainly don't believe it is a " cause and effect" situation, it's undeniable that as southern states very gradually became more Republican, they became less racist. As Horn6721 correctly points out, the switch to Republican domination was a very gradual process, not an instant response to the Democratically-sponsored Civil Rights Act of 1964.

I'd also like to point out that the Civil Rights Act of 1964 had numerous controversial aspects, not the least of which requiring public restaurants and hotels to accomodate miniorities. It was seen by many as an overreach of federal powers. It had opponents that were in no way racists. Barry Goldwater and Ronald Reagan, neither of whom could be credibly termed racist, spoke against it on the grounds that it was an overreach of the national government at the expense of the states and the business owners. Goldwater and Reagan are important political figures whose accomplishments elsewhere make their error in judgement here an inconsequential footnote in their overall record. Here as in an earlier post attacked by Horn6721, I acknowledge that Republican support for the Civil Rights Act of 1964, which while less than unanimous, was crucial to its success. Again, I never called anyone racist. Neither party is racist, though obviously they have and continue to harbor racists. Happily, that represents an ever dwindling portion of the American electorate.
 
Crockett:

Wow, I can't believe that I agree with another one of your so soon. I applaud the fair and balanced opinion that you wrote.
yippee.gif


I think the era of the blatant racism is gone. While I consider myself part of the first generation born after the Civil Rights Act of 1964, and there are elements of racism still alive in this country, racism is completely different today then it was 48 years ago. I believe that it has gone the way of the ethnic wars of the late 1800's and early 1900's. There will always be some form of hatred but in most of societies circles it is gone and people are judged on what they can do for each other and or society.
 
Yeah Major -- every once in a while we ought to take a deep breath, look at where we've been as a country and give ourselves credit for genuine improvements.

On NPR a few years ago I heard an interview with a Scandanavian journalist who came to the US for one of the murder trials of 1960s criminals who evaded justice in a not so colorblind south. He had covered the earlier trials where the bad guys skated. He was impressed upon his return in the late 1990s, not so much by the outcome of the trials, but by going to lunch in a restaurant where there were not only blacks and whites present, but often sitting at the same table in friendly, animated conversation. That wasn't happening in the 1960s.
 
Croc
Your post at the top of this page is well written and quite encompassing. Well done

You pointed out there are racists in both parties and there are racists from all races or groups.
When I included you in the group who think the GOP is a party of racists and who use the south turning Republican as proof I made a mistake as your post clearly shows.
 
I'd have voted for McCain if he hadn't been on the ticket with a woman who I thought incredibly dumb, vain, arrogant and ambitious. Sadly enough traits that are hilarious in a sitcom character like Ted Baxter or Michael Scott are terrifying to contemplate as the leader of the free world. I'm not Libertarian, but honestly when Gary Johnson talks about being to the left of the Democrats on social freedom and to the right of the Republicans on fiscal isssues and staying the hell out of long-term foreign entanglements, he makes a lot of sense to me. Since Romney will get the Texas delegates no matter how I vote, I may use my ballot to make a statement.
 
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