Carbon Markets continue to collapse

M

mop

2,500+ Posts
Was it about a year ago that I mentioned that the carbon markets were not doing well. One poster said they were fine and pointed out that huge firms were pushing them as "evidence" (not a quote from him, just quotes to illustrate how ridiculous this claim was) that they were going strong. In the past few months multiple articles have been written about the collapse of the Carbon Markets. This most recent one from 2 days ago:

European Carbon Markets collapsing...



I think that carbon trading has peaked (a few years ago) and will go the way of Enron (the originators of this scheme if I understand correctly).
 
I wonder how much of it is due to:
A. Decline in the value of the Euro relative to the dollar (esp in midst of the EU debt crisis), versus
B. Decline in actual industrial output, versus
C. Other (e.g. expected easing of limits, etc.)
 
How can something collapse if according to you and your conspiracy theory friendly blogs it already collapsed?


Oh well, next year you can post another thread saying that they're still collapsing.
 
Perhaps Europe should establish a Fed for Carbon Credits that can just poof them into existence when carbon markets sag and gross polluters require bailing out.
 
McBrett, stop being obtuse. The Chicago market shut down! That's what I was referring to. I never said the worldwide market had shut down. But you probably see the handwriting on the wall eh? The gig is up...carbon markets are a luxury of a strong global economy and they are going away with almost certainty at this point. As it is, what major investment firm is going to be putting any serious cash in the carbon market? Do you think we should still be investing in carbon markets?
 
To be clear McBrett, I don't think you are obtuse at all. I am merely suggesting that you are purposely pretending to not understand. You and I (and virtually everyone else on these boards) know that the carbon markets, in all likelihood, are done for. There is no point debating that. If they do happen to rise from the dead (economically speaking) you will be as surprised as me.
 
Which is all further evidence that *if* you want to limit carbon emissions that it is far more efficient to just tax it.

Companies can reliably predict what their expenses will be in the future since tax changes tend to be telegraphed well in advance. The reduction in emissions can more directly be controlled. That is separate from whether you agree with whether carbon emissions should be reduced.

I just flat out hate the idea of exchanges from an economics perspective. It's still a tax, and if you are going to tax me or a corporation, then just call it a tax and be done with it.
 
This thread could also be about the prescription medicines of certain posters.

First they said it collapsed and was dead two years ago, then they post a link saying it's trading at lows, and thus dead- even though they're still trading, and add in their personal commentary which coincides with the conspiracy theory websites he subscribes to.

You can deny climate change all you like, or say it's a crazy natural phenomena having nothing to do with man made carbon emissions, which then leads you to make fun of renewable energies and the policies of carbon markets used in the EU, parts of Asia and parts of the US- but- these people don't share your views. So, the sooner you accept it the quicker you can get back to politicizing other natural or scientific issues that make you uncomfortable. Isn't their a pro-choice board somewhere you can go harass?
 
McBrett, what colors is the sky in your world? Are you serious? When we posted about the death of the carbon market 2 years ago, it was about the complete shut down of a major carbon trading floor in the U.S. It was and is a big deal and a very bad sign for the carbon markets. You tried to spin it as no big deal and pointed to advertisements by major firms for the carbon markets.

This thread is about the fact that Europe now appears to be following suit. Or rather, that carbon markets are collapsing and are at an all time low. Do you care to respond to THIS thread? Or do you care to respond to the claims made herein? At any rate, there is no question, as much as you try to dodge it, that the carbon markets are in big trouble. With the economic crisis the world is facing, the best bet is a complete collapse globally.

For the record, where was there any conspiracy site referenced or linked to? You are quite the spin master.


For the record, where was there any conspiracy site referenced or linked to? You sure are the master of spin. How is GreenBiz for you McBrett?

If that's not good enough for you, how about this article that was published 2 hours ago?

Is Carbon Trading Disappearing in a Puff of Smoke?

here are some choice quotes from that article:

In reply to:
Click to expand...
 
Like I stated on another website. As long as people like Al Gore, that scream "GLOBAL WARMING", continue to own mansions, multiple vacation homes and yachts, I will not listen.
 
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